How much more substantial is the 9mm vs the .380acp for self defense?

Discussion in 'Caliber Corner' started by arkephonic, Oct 12, 2019.

  1. Quigley

    Quigley Elite Member

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    Cool, just keep your 9mm trash talking(see post 101) to yourself.

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  2. shadowlands

    shadowlands

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    I'll post whatever I'd like to post. I wasn't trash talking the 9mm. Post 101 is sarcasm meant for the fanboys. When did I say it sucked? In fact, I have one at home. Boom! It's a WWII German Luger that still fires and it's accurate as hell.
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2019

  3. Dog Soldier

    Dog Soldier NRA Benefactor

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    I carried a "Town Gun" Colt Mustang Plus II for some time. The Colt .380 had worm fits far to often. It did not cycle every time.
    I now have a Kimber Micro 9. It is very compact handles 9MM+P+ without a flaw.
     
  4. Quigley

    Quigley Elite Member

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    You've been stating for a while that all you own is a G42 and a G27 until you recently bought your Maverick and now all of sudden you own Luger? Is that your way of saying your dad owns a Luger that you'll inherit when he dies? Or have you been holding out on us?

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  5. Dog Soldier

    Dog Soldier NRA Benefactor

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    I am a Luger Lover. I have a number of Bring Backs. But my favorite is the modern Texas Luger made in Houston. The Mitchell Arms"Texas" Luger is no longer made. The old DWM 1914 is also a shooter. Note this model has no stock lugs. A little rare.

    2007328223323_1914-DWM-8083a-ORS_0008.jpg
     
  6. shadowlands

    shadowlands

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    Actually it was my Dad's. He gave it me a few years back. It's in my safe. My Dad is still alive and I'll inherit some of his guns when he passes. That's what he's mentioned. I do have photos of it at the house. It's very similar to one Dog Soldier posted above actually. Still has the leather holster. It's condition isn't as nice as Dog's.
     
  7. shadowlands

    shadowlands

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    I'll locate my pics and post them when I'm home. Thanks for sharing.
     
  8. shadowlands

    shadowlands

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    Photos coming soon. And if I need to, I'll shoot it along with my two Glock's so you can see it's mine. Boom! Once someone else tells me more about it, I'll toss it into my signature.
     
  9. shadowlands

    shadowlands

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    CRAP!!! Now you know I have a 9mm in my house!!! I even have some 9mm ammo for it. Don't tell anyone!!!
     
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  10. Deputydave

    Deputydave Millennium Member

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    [​IMG]
     
  11. Joshhtn

    Joshhtn The eBay Guy Gold Member

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    This guy (shadow) makes me scratch my head quite often... I can't quite figure him out, but based on his past posts and threads, I'm convinced he's not firing on all cylinders.
     
  12. fredj338

    fredj338

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    Agree, except for the whole energy dump thing.:duel:
     
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  13. fredj338

    fredj338

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    Not really. The issue with numbers like this, it still isn't quantifiable. Most aggressors stop their attack when they get shot with anything, one shot stop. It doesn't really give the 380 any more cred. To say that the 380 is equally effective as a 44mag or 10mm is just not dealing with reality.
    If there was a way to do a street study where we knew what the variables were that caused the failures, that would be more viable. Kinda of a BIG diff in quoting a one shot stop/body or head? The vast majority of head shots are one shot stops, regardless of caliber. I would also say most headshots are delivered by accident, not intentional. So while M&S & Elliftetz anecdotal study is interesting, but not definitive. One could also completely turn either study upside down by showing the failures to deliver one shot stops by caliber. Everything fails, even 50bmg.
     
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  14. fredj338

    fredj338

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    Curious how you measure this? Unless you run identical drills with a timer, you are guessing. It is measured accuracy at speed. Put up a idpa or uspsa or fbi target. Stand at 10y (7y for real noobs) & give me a modified bill drill, 5 body one head. Your goal is all "zeros" in 3sec or less from the holster. You can do it without cover just to eliminate any garment clearing variable. This is my std drill to test a new platform or new shooters ability to manipulate the trigger, proper grip & ability to track the front sight.
    I have yet to find anyone that doesn't shoot it better with a 9mm in any platform. Yes I can do it with a 45 but I am way closer to 3sec than the 2.5 with my g26. The avg shooter cant even get close to 3sec, regardless of caliber, thus making an Argument they should be going 9mm so they can practice more & have more ammo to land their hits.
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2019
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  15. fredj338

    fredj338

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    That is hilarious. Only truth is timer & target. What you feel is irrelevant. Most people find out pretty quick they arent nearly as good as they think once you put them to a test.
    One of my fav examples is a new shooter we had at a match & he shot his classifier. Now the IDPA 5x5 classifier is pretty damn easy, too easy IMO. Still, he thought himself a pretty good shooter, hoped to make expert if not master in his first attempt. He made marksman, pretty far from expert much less master. Oh yeah his follow up shots were fast enough, but accuracy just wasn't there. Lots of guys can pull a trigger fast but in a competition or fight, only good hits count. So go run the drills for yourself, knowledge is power.
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2019
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  16. fredj338

    fredj338

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    True words. As I have often said, if I think I need to carry a gun, I need it do whatever I need it to. I don't like unitask tools & a pocket rocket is that to me, contact weapon, if I have time to get it out of my pocket?
     
  17. fredj338

    fredj338

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    I am fine with whatever works, just don't make silly statements like "more punch" unless you can quantify that. Good bullets in any will expand to 65cal + & drive 13-16" deep. IMO, the 45 would have a very slight edge as it is bigger at impact, more immediate tissue crushing, but they all do the job pretty much the same.
    9mm 124gr+p @ 1200fps = 397ft#
    40 180gr @ 1000fps = 400ft#
    45 230gr @ 900fps = 414ft#
    380 90gr @ 1000fps = 200ft#
    FWIW, I would be fine with the 380 if the bullet would expand beyond 50cal & drive the 13-16" but it is too light & too slow for that.
     
  18. BigBluefish

    BigBluefish

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    For me, it's always more about the gun. Does it fit me, can I see the sights, is the trigger OK, can I HIT anything with it, is it small & light enough to carry?

    Once I get past those questions, I really don't care if it's anything from .380 to
    .45 auto (.357 Mag & .44 Special included).

    If it's a 9mm, great. Ammo is cheap and plenty of choices. I'm a big fan of the Beretta 85, Sig 232 & Makarov, and don't lose sleep over carrying a 'minor' caliber. The G36 works for me (still haven't decided about the 1911) and the fact that it is a .45 is a plus, I guess. It certainly does not bother me. 2 or 3 rounds to the chest from any of these will ruin your day, so I don't sweat foot-pounds and bullet diameter.

    Though it is endlessly entertaining to discuss and debate such details.
     
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  19. fredj338

    fredj338

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    Yeah I can kill with a pointy stick, doesn't make it an effective fight stopper. Pretty sure cavemen figured this out about 60,000 years ago.
     
  20. Dog Soldier

    Dog Soldier NRA Benefactor

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    That is true. Archeologist have found .380 ammo buried deep in those ancient caverns.:kidding::kidding:
     
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