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How do you explain the problem of pain?

Discussion in 'Religious Issues' started by teumessian_fox, Jul 10, 2012.

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  1. teumessian_fox

    teumessian_fox

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    I saw a vid of children butchered by rival african tribes. One child was fleeing with her foot flopping on a broken bone.

    In a book called "Have Atheists Proved There Is No God", the author discusses the problem of pain and the existence of God.

    In light of innocents suffering, how would you explain this paradox? Free will? The fall of man?

    And please, no 7th Day cultists respond. Your desire is not to illuminate, but to dominate. Thanx.
     
  2. Japle

    Japle John, Viera, Fl

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    The best book I've found on this subject is "God's Problem" by Bart Ehrman. It's an excellent in-depth study of the subject.

    Bottom line: A personal god who actually cares about humans couldn't possible allow the suffering of innocents.
     

  3. ricka10

    ricka10

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    They are only practicing survival of the fittest. Pure Darwinism. Whats the problem?
     
  4. teumessian_fox

    teumessian_fox

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    Seriously? The problem of suffering reconciled with a Benevolent God?

    It's a theological paradox that has been debated among ivory tower theologians for hundreds of years.

    It's not a question that can be answered. I'm interested in GTrs perspectives.

    thanx
     
  5. Snapper2

    Snapper2

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    So is the book trying to prove there is no God based on pain? Is He is to blame for one man murdering another because He created them but would not stop it. Huh?Isnt it easier for someone that knows what they are talking about to take for what it is. We murder each other. And we dont believe in God or if we do,we hold our beliefs above the rights of those who dont believe as we do. We did it.
     
  6. MrRandyRhoads

    MrRandyRhoads

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    As far as I know, the purpose of pain is to tell your brain "Hey, something isn't right here."

    One could venture a guess and say that since pain signals your body to address the issue or possibly die (if circumstances allowed for that possibility, of course) then you could argue that pain is in fact beneficial to the survival of man.
     
  7. Snapper2

    Snapper2

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    Says who? Is that how you feel? It would only make sense if you didn't believe in a resurrection. If you don't then I see what you mean.
     
  8. Japle

    Japle John, Viera, Fl

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    Of course I don’t believe in a resurrection. Not that my beliefs have any relevance to the existence of a god.

    Can you explain how belief in a resurrection matters to an infant who’s suffering from a fatal infection? Keep in mind that the infant isn’t old enough to have any concept of religion.
     
  9. Snapper2

    Snapper2

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    First of all, religion is nothing but our attempt to find favor in a God we believe. The resurrection in Christ would have to do with the infant's Creator's love. Not what the infant deserved or didnt deserve.
     
  10. Arc Angel

    Arc Angel Deus Vult!

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    :upeyes: You guys never quit! In fact, I'd say it's people like you who seek to dominate just as much, or even more so, than others whom you like to accuse of doing the same thing. Why don't you, just once, attempt to step over your own hardhearted bias, and try looking at people and events in a more scripturally enlightened way:

    Each and everyone of us is dogged by his own haunting and subjective karma. Do you understand what, 'personal karma' means? (If you don't then try reading the Book of Job. These points are argued there; and, guess what? That God in whom you are so disbelieving is justified on the very points which you are now, supposedly, considering!)

    As for your remark about, 'innocents'? Are you kidding! If Sacred Scripture teaches us anything it is that NONE OF US are innocent - None of us! (So, we're back to, 'karma' again.) Does the existence of pain, or its reality, bother you? Well, surprise! We're NOT here for the party. Keep on reading downward. You might achieve greater insight into the dilemma you're trying to fathom.

    (I daresay that if you had previously read - and pondered - the Book of Job and, in particular, all of Chapter 3, as well as Chapter 5, verses 17-19 then you would have already answered your own question. That you have not already done this tells me a great deal about you.) ;)
     
  11. Syclone538

    Syclone538

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    Can you give some examples of atheists doing this?
     
  12. Snapper2

    Snapper2

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    Don't really care to.I'll just judge myself. My statement was that we are all capable of murder given the right circumstances whether we are religious or not. It's OUR(mankind) fault.
     
  13. G26S239

    G26S239 NRA Patron

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    Way to get a discussion going the direction you want it to. :thumbsup: :rofl: 7th day cultists stay off the grass. Do you have difficulty defending your position when 7th day cultists show up?

     
  14. Brasso

    Brasso Millennium Member

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    I'm not Jewish. I'm Messianic.
    It's a lot harder to argue with someone when they don't contradict themselves.
     
  15. Cavalry Doc

    Cavalry Doc MAJ (USA Ret.)

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    I don't know what you can learn about whether or not there is a god by watching the cruel things people do, but I have learned a lot about humans watching the things they will do to each other. Which is a pretty good reason to carry a gun.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2012
  16. Animal Mother

    Animal Mother Not Enough Gun

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    How are children or infants not innocent? Doesn't the Bible itself say that one isn't responsible until they're able to understand the need for accountability?
    How does God jerking Job around prove anything?
     
  17. High-Gear

    High-Gear

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    Right, apparently we are all born trash and are worthless until we accept your god.


    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Rwioe1SGkQ&feature=youtube_gdata_player"]Welcome To This World - YouTube[/ame]
     
  18. Gunhaver

    Gunhaver the wrong hands

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    Evolution explains pain. Nature doesn't care about suffering because it evolved around a system of life consuming life. Getting eaten is painful so you'll be motivated to avoid it and survive long enough to reproduce. Surviving long enough to reproduce is such an obvious agenda in nature that we see animals die soon after they complete that mission. Male mantises are eaten during mating. That's how important they are after completing their function and the nutrients in their bodies is better spent on the next generation than any more life for them. Many spiders are consumed by their young as soon as they hatch because the female's purpose is complete. Just about any animal in nature including humans will die to protect their offspring because that is so ingrained in us by the fact that it's been so rough out there for so long that any species that didn't have the natural tendency to behave that way didn't survive for long.

    Nature doesn't care about pain anymore than it cares about the horror of children feeding off their parents. That's a human response. We don't like those things so we label them as bad and make up stories of why things are that way rather than accept that that's how life works and be thankful that we were lucky enough to be born as humans so we could avoid a lot of that ugliness.
     
  19. Guss

    Guss

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    The message of the Book of Job is that humans are not even worthy to ask why. Just suck it up.
     
  20. Guss

    Guss

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    That was a good book. Dr. Ehrman was once a minister and the issue of suffering was the final straw that turned him to agnosticism.
     
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