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My in-law is super liberal. Probably voted for Biden, even though she think he’s a looser, out of spite to cancel my vote for DJT. She is also a huge feminists( classic but LFBTQR... type of Karen). We got into the electoral college thing. I simply asked her if she was ok with her daughters having their careers limited or eliminated because 51% of the population thought they needed more stay at home mothers. Or if minorities really needed to ride in the front seats. Or if... eventually it dawned on her that democracy is nothing more than mob rule and today it may be her kind that are in charge, but tomorrow it may not be.


We don’t live in a democracy by design. If we lived in a democracy, we would have had a few more civil wars by now or most likely be very similar to Venezuela.


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I am one of the unfortunates that had his daughter attend a liberal college , meet and marry a very liberal man from a very liberal family. We all know where we stand with one another after all these years so politics seldom comes up in mixed company . Once in a while one of them let's something leftist slip out and I bat it back across the net and we move on to other subjects. Has worked for 15 years, hope we can continue our civil arrangement.
 

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My in-laws vote Democrat for the sole reason that their parents did and they’re grandparents did. They have no idea what each party stands for in regards to policy, agenda and ideas. I throw little comments here and there. They are incapable of understanding.
I've had this conversation more than several times over the past few months, it's a generational thing. Let's vote like pawpaw did, the heck with policies and liberal stupidity, my parents and grandparents CAN'T be wrong!
 

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My wife's sister and husband, just in the last few years, got on board with the republican
side. They are now all aboard the Trump train and joined us at the recent rally in Tucson.
 

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With the EC the focus is primarily on states that can provide the most electors, and then the swing states. But to win the EV of most states you still need to win the popular vote of that state, and to do so usually requires support from the more densely populated areas. And while it's not always possible to counter the urban vote with rural votes, sometimes there is enough dissent within urban communities to tip the scales in a statewide election.

The argument that cities and densely populated coastal states will overwhelm the votes from the rest of the country is a valid one, since collectively these areas overwhelmingly choose one party. In a popular vote situation you may see the opposition candidate actually campaigning in those areas. You may also see some moderation of extreme positions to gain support. Old habits and attitudes die hard, however, and winning over voters is a daunting task. Eliminating the EC would change the way candidates campaign though, and that could shift some votes one way or the other, but I'm not sure it would be enough to swing a national election.

Elections often hinge upon personality and promises, not substance or results, so whomever says what people want to hear and looks the best saying it on TV will likely win a popular vote every time.
 

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I never had that trouble with my Father in law. Other than helping elect Bill Clinton by voting for Ross Perot, He was a good conservative.
His son, Wayne Jr and his children are another story and would argue liberal politics until blue in the face. Then inspired me to create this sign and place it in the entryway.
No Politics.jpg
The sign, and my daughter informing them all that I had had enough of this crap, transformed our family events into a much more civil and enjoyable time for all.

In any other environment, I encourage such discussions, even though they never change the minds of hard headed people of either party, but at least in public, I can just get up and walk away
 

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Discussion Starter #32
I never had that trouble with my Father in law. Other than helping elect Bill Clinton by voting for Ross Perot, He was a good conservative.
His son, Wayne Jr and his children are another story and would argue liberal politics until blue in the face. Then inspired me to create this sign and place it in the entryway.
View attachment 856842
The sign, and my daughter informing them all that I had had enough of this crap, transformed our family events into a much more civil and enjoyable time for all.

In any other environment, I encourage such discussions, even though they never change the minds of hard headed people of either party, but at least in public, I can just get up and walk away
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A great sign, especially these days of highly polarized political views. It should be obvious to everyone that political discussions in family gatherings is an invitation to confrontation--which I think some openly try to create. You would hope that a birthday celebration might be a reprieve from the daily political vitriol that has become the norm--but no.

My hope is that our little "dust up" will remind everyone present that political discussions among the family are pointless discussions, that can only end in acrimony rather than agreement or understanding. I'm afraid the political chasm in the country is way to wide for any of that...
 

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I usually let their comments go by without batting an eye--good people,but very liberal--but this w/e at a get together the subject of getting rid of the electoral college came up and suddenly we were getting more thana bit contentious.

They thought the popular vote was the way to go; I thought it was a great way to hand over elections to the Democratic strongholds on the coasts and we went from there.
We ended it before name calling started, but we were getting close.
After they left, I did a bit more research on the subject since I felt the subject was way more complicated than just count the popular vote--it is.
From what I've read, one of the reasons the electoral college exists is to help ensure the small states have a real say in the presidential election process and the passage of legislation through congress (Especially in the Senate were each state has the same number of votes).

A couple articles on the subject:

https://electoralvotemap.com/5-reawsons-to-keep-the-electoral-college/
https://www.thoughtco.com/why-keep-the-electoral-college-3322050

After reading the various article out there on the subject I gained a better understanding as to why the system was created, the benefits of it and how can act as the glue to keep this Federation of states together during a difficult period.

Amazing how forward thinking the founders of the nation were more than 200+ years ago.
I had a uncle who told me not to ever bother to talk to a lib, ist not worth the time. They won't listen, they let the truth get in the way of the facts.
 

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Thank God for the EC....if not, it would be a huge Dem advantage.

I think a lot of people have trouble understanding the EC because in normal life contests (not presidential elections) the most points, goals, runs etc win.
 

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It's dismaying how Civics classes in HS no longer seem to be teaching how government works, and more importantly, why it was designed to work that way.

Fortunately, such information can be found online, if people care to look for it, and not jut taken the spoon-fed opinions and diatribes fed to them by the media, pundits and talking heads who wish to see America "de-Americanized".
 

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It's dismaying how Civics classes in HS no longer seem to be teaching how government works, and more importantly, why it was designed to work that way.

Fortunately, such information can be found online, if people care to look for it, and not jut taken the spoon-fed opinions and diatribes fed to them by the media, pundits and talking heads who wish to see America "de-Americanized".
Civics was replaced by Gender Studies and is no longer being taught.
 

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I remember when I was a kid in elementary school, one of my teachers told us that the Electoral College meant the voters did not matter. Got my (6th grade) class all riled up.

I went home in a high dudgeon. Declared the evils of the EC to my older (all of 17) brother. He sat me down and explained the EC, the Senate and the HOR and why it was balanced to give smaller states a voice, while also acknowledging the importance of the populations in the larger states. How it was all a compromise in the 18th century and still worked in modern times. Never forgot that talk (or the treachery [ignorance?] of my 6th grade teacher).

The short point to a long story is that a 17 year old kid could understand it and explain it to an 11 year old kid. Adults today have no excuse for their ignorance. Kudos to my brother's civics teacher whoever that was.
Awesome story!
 
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I’d be willing to bet that Hillary did not win the popular vote in 2016. I believe there were many illegals and dead people voting for her.
 

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Our crappy public education system sucks thanks to the scumbag teachers unions. Our teachers fail to teach about the constitution and they fail to explain why the EC is a great idea and just as relevant as it was 230 years ago.
 

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The States would have never agreed to unite to form the United States if the large States were allowed to dominate the less populated ones.

And it was a bad idea when in 1913 thanks to the 17th Amendment Senators were no longer picked by the State legislators and instead were elected by popular vote.

1913 was a bad year for freedom.
 
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