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Going to jail for getting a good deal at car dealer

Discussion in 'The Okie Corral' started by berto62, Sep 28, 2012.

  1. fowl intent

    fowl intent

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    Sounds to me like the buyer knew the seller made a mistake, and did everything he could do to capitalize on it. Why else would he have immediately gone and gotten a cashier's check to pay off the entire balance when he signed the new contract.

    The dealership screwed up twice, once on the initial mistake, and the second time by getting law enforcement involved in what is really a civil issue. But for buyer to prevail, he has to come to court with "clean hands", and I don't think he has them.
     
  2. FCastle88

    FCastle88

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    The dealer's insurance will most likely pay the damages, and the employee/employees involved should be fired and facing false imprisonment charges. I find it hard to believe that one employee did all this without anyone else having some idea what was going on. If the insurance doesn't pay the damages, the owner of the dealership hired the employees and authorized them to act on his behalf, legally he's responsible for their conduct while on the job. If the dealer does have to pay he could probably sue the responsible employees, though it's doubtful he'd ever see any money. Are you saying the buyer shouldn't be compensated for being falsely imprisoned and given an arrest record in an extortion attempt?
     

  3. kensb2

    kensb2 pistol n00b

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    Why not? If you can afford to pay cash, in essence, then why finance? Why have another monthly bill to worry about? You logic fails severely in this case.
     
  4. FCastle88

    FCastle88

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    The buyer might have suspected something was off, or he could have thought they were giving him a good deal to make the sale. Either way, the dealership signed the contract and accepted his money, they screwed up and it's their problem. The buyer's actions might have been morally questionable, but legally he owes them nothing.
     
  5. devildog2067

    devildog2067

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    They certainly should be financially responsible. The question is, did they do $2.2M in damages?
     
  6. devildog2067

    devildog2067

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    I used to run a car dealership. If I filed a claim for something like this with my insurance company they would have laughed at me.

    I can't say what sort of personal liability insurance my dealership's owner carried, but I can say that the dealership's policy did not cover things like this (where there is alleged criminal conduct). The dealership insurance is for times when the grease monkey forgets to tighten the lug nuts and a wheel falls off.
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2012
  7. NeverMore1701

    NeverMore1701 Fear no Evil Platinum Member

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    I paid for my truck the day I bought it. Why shouldn't he?
     
  8. Kilrain

    Kilrain Señor Member

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    By mistake you mean the $5600 clerical error, not the employee who told the police the car was stolen when, in fact, it was not, right?
     
  9. FCastle88

    FCastle88

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    Negotiating $5.6K off of $40K American brand SUV isn't exactly unheard of, they could have given him a good deal to make the sale then tried scamming the full price out of him. There's also a few comments that claim to be past customers of the dealership who say the dealership tried the same thing with them, minus the actual arrest. Given that it is a fairly common scam, and other customers say they tried the same thing in the past, I'd say at worst the buyer managed to get one over on the dealership while they were trying to get one over on him.
     
  10. glock_19guy1983

    glock_19guy1983

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    I hope he gets every cent of the 2.2M. The dealership should also have to pay his legal fees. With the arrest record he has a HUGE black ball against his name for a medical career. I think settlement would be a bad move on his part. It is easy to turn a jury against a sleazy car salesman.
     
  11. John's 26

    John's 26

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    Long story short, several years ago, we had traded in an, at the time, newer GMC pickup for a new, upgraded version of the same truck. We agreed on a price, in writing, and we bought the truck, signed the contract, and left the dealership. Something kept knawing at me though. The next morning, I went over the contract and they had errored and overcharged me by about $1,500 (they upped the sale price and upped the trade-in value to make the deal look better on paper, but did not up the trade-in value enough to match the deal I agreed to). That afternoon, I asked to speak to the sales manager and, contract and in-writing agreement in hand, explained the situation. He took the paperwork (copies BTW, not original) to the back to talk with the finance guy. Came back a few moments later and told me to hang on while they fixed it so I could sign a new corrected contract. No questions asked.

    In the finance guys office, he showed me their copy of the agreement, showed me where they screwed up on the contract, handed me a new contract, which we went over to be sure it was correct, and I re-signed. They also apologized and gave me 3 free oil changes for my trouble. Now keep in mind we had bought several vehicles from this dealer over the years, and they always gave me a fair deal.

    John
     
  12. CitizenOfDreams

    CitizenOfDreams

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    That's for the court to decide. The amount will undoubtedly be negotiated to a smaller number, so 2.2 million is a perfectly sane starting point.

    Just out of curiousity, how high would you estimate the damages if someone made you ineligible to work at CERN?
     
  13. 427

    427

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    Once, I literally ran across the street to the bank to pay off a car I bought an hour or so earlier.
     
  14. devildog2067

    devildog2067

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    I'm not going to pretend that there aren't sleazy car dealers out there, or that there aren't scams out there. Most of the reason why I left the business was that I was tired of lying to people.

    That said, this is not at all a "common" scam. Once someone's signed papers and rolled off the lot, they're an owner. Any attempt to re-sign papers can just as easily end up with the person giving the car back. That's a far more likely outcome (I know, I've had to do it many times) than getting a person to sign a new contract for more money.

    And $5600 on a $40k car is approaching 15% of the LTV. 99% of the time, even if a dealership wanted to try to scam someone in this way, they couldn't get the scam bought.

    Car dealerships simply don't engage in illegal activity very often. There's very little upside. The car business is pretty lucrative as it is--every time a car rolls off the lot, the dealership makes ~$2500 worth of profit (on average) one way or another. An extra $5600 on a single car deal is definitely worth negotiating for, but is definitely NOT worth losing a deal for. In the big picture it simply doesn't matter. It doesn't move the needle at all.
     
  15. Mayhem like Me

    Mayhem like Me Semper Paratus

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    Think about what it would be worth to you a law abiding citizen if you were arrested for no reason, strip searched, then had to bond out on a made up charge where a valid sales contract was signed by both parties.


    This was a CYA for the manager to cover his rear on a contract he made a mistake on and knew he would have to eat. It is in fact a false report of a crime and he should be charged.


    IF he porvided false information to sweeten the PC for the warrant that would be another charge, I can tell you for a fact our agency would never investigate a clain like this given the circumstances in the article, I am very suspicious of what information he gave police.

    The dealership has what attorneys call"exposure" in this matter.

    2.2 Million seems excessive they want it to settle in the low six figures I'm sure...
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2012
  16. devildog2067

    devildog2067

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    The post I responded to said that he deserved "every cent" of the $2.2M.

    The damages couldn't be measured in dollars--I'd lose a unique opportunity, there's only one CERN. Honestly, however, working at CERN (or anywhere, as a particle physicist or physics professor) doesn't pay well at all. I do it part-time, now, and I have another job that pays my bills.
     
  17. JohnBT

    JohnBT NRA Benefactor

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    "If you can afford to pay cash, in essence, then why finance?"

    To qualify for a promotion of some sort.

    I got a free tv once with a new car purchase, but only because I financed. I had the money for the car in checking, but took the tv and then paid off the loan as soon as I got the paperwork. There weren't any fees involved or penalties, so my only cost was a stamp to mail a check.
     
  18. Mayhem like Me

    Mayhem like Me Semper Paratus

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    While the damages could not be measured in dollars, that is the only way a court can make you whole.


    Once that person was printed they now have an FBI number showing the arrest.

    This will take years and many hours of attorney fees to straighten out and won't happen overnight.

    Say a job opportunity arises, all nurses I know have state licencing requirments and that will involve a criminal records check that will come back with an arrest for a felony in this case.

    It is not something that will go away in a year.
     
  19. G23Gen4.40

    G23Gen4.40 .40 Rocks

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    No the employee will be fired, the employer who hired him will have to pay. 2.2 ain't enough in my opinion.
     
  20. FCastle88

    FCastle88

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    A google search comes up with quite a few complaints about this scam, and warnings about it on several car buying tips and top car scam sites. Several posters on here have posted stories of dealers attempting this scam, both in this thread and others. Several comments on the article claim that this same dealership has tried the same thing in the past. I'd say it's more common than you want to think or admit.

    I already said several times the buyer is under no obligation to sign a new contract, that's what makes attempting to get them to do so a scam. You say it like the buyer's only two options are to sign a new contract or return the car, when in fact in most cases they can simply tell the dealer to pound sand and keep the vehicle and the original contract. If the buyer is smart they know they don't have to sign a new contract, but not all buyers are smart, and as I said sometimes they'll trick the buyer into bringing the vehicle in for a free service or something and then refuse to return it. I never said attempting to get the buyer to sign a new contract was illegal, the dealer is free to ask them to do so, the buyer is free to say no. What is illegal is having him falsely arrested for not doing so.