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Glock 18C with 15# & T.H.E. Tungsten guide rod

Discussion in 'General Glocking' started by Darin Reiss, Jan 19, 2006.

  1. Darin Reiss

    Darin Reiss

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    Sorry for the quality of the video. The idea of taping it was last minute.

    Factory Glock 18C except for T.H.E. tungsten guide rod and 15# spring. The magazine was loaded with 28 rounds and they all went into a group of about 1.5" at 4 feet.

    I was surprised how much the group tightened up using the tungsten guide rod/spring combination.

    Thanks,
    Darin


    http://myweb.cableone.net/uziforme/DarinG18C.mpg
     
  2. Wicked96SS

    Wicked96SS Typical Gun Nut Millennium Member

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    Great video!

    Would be interested to see before and after, and actually aiming at a target and not shooting into the ground... that would be a better test.... I would bet the groups would be the same with the stock guide rod in it... I know it would be with a G17, as I have done that test... but, I have never done it on a G18!!
     

  3. Timmah!

    Timmah! Senior Jackass

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    Neither the spring nor guiderod has anything to do with accuracy whatsoever.

    Tim
     
  4. G17Collector

    G17Collector Original "G"

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    Wrong. The added weight increases controlability as does the spring (to some extent). More controlability = increase in accuracy.
     
  5. Norman

    Norman Non nobis CLM

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    What is the stock spring weight on a Glock 18C?
     
  6. Custom Glock Racing

    Custom Glock Racing I did it first. Millennium Member

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    It has no effect on mechanical accuracy. It can only make the gun easier to shoot.


    -------
    Stock on an 18 is 17 pounds.
     
  7. coolhand

    coolhand Very Senior Millennium Member

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    What’s the purpose of shaved rear top slide? Is it to reduce the weight for reliable cycling? I’ve heard lots of "back plate" converted full-auto Glock have jamming problem pretty often. I’m wondering if they use different type of springs on firing & recoil. Any Glock experts?
     
  8. G17Collector

    G17Collector Original "G"

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    Right and wrong. I was not clear in my initial reply.

    While it has no effect on mechanical accuracy, we are talking about a select fire weapon. Heavier weight equals more control. More control equals greater accuracy ON FULL AUTO.

    To be honest, I don't think that the weight of the tungsten rod would make enough of a difference to be seen. The G18 is light to begin with coupled with a cyclic rate in the 11-1200rpm range = lots o' practice.

    Now, I did not know that the stock spring weight was 17lbs. Dropping to 15lbs. will negate the increase in weight (you have increased the rate of fire). It may even go further than negating, I'm not sure.
     
  9. Custom Glock Racing

    Custom Glock Racing I did it first. Millennium Member

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    More ccontrol means more control, nothing else. It sometimes translates into better accuracy but thats up to the shooter. The accuracy of the gun stays the same.

    It does make a difference, I have tried it. Dropping the weight changes slide velocity and often makes it easier to shoot. I am sure.
     
  10. Darin Reiss

    Darin Reiss

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    I find that I can shoot tighter groups with my 17's when I use the Tungsten guide rod and 15# spring. In my defensive pistol class drills I notice a big improvement over the stock setup because I can make follow up shots so much quicker due to less muzzle flip. I found this to be the case with the 18C also. I am going to test this setup tonight at the indoor range against a smurf and see how it compares.

    When I first got the T.H.E. Tungsten guide rod from Custom Glock Racing, I didn't think it would do much good, I mean it is only 1.5 oz or so heavier than stock but at least for my shooting abilities, strength, etc. I notice a big difference.

    Darin
     
  11. G17Collector

    G17Collector Original "G"

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    I do not want this to become a flame war or overly agitated conversation, but when it comes to automatic weapons I have some experience - trust me.

    With any automatic weapon more weight equals more control which equals better accuracy. There is no exception for Glock select fire pistols. It is a basic law - physics.

    There is a reason that machine guns weigh as much as they do. Here is a good "for instance":

    When the US Army adopted the M14 rifle they also adopted a heavy barreled version dubbed the M15. We all know that the M14 is select fire and the M15 is too. It was going to replace the BAR as the Squad Automatic Weapon (SAW). What the US Army found out was that the M14/15 platform was just too light to be effective - in other words it was uncontrollable and thus inaccurate. A trick used at the time was to unhook the sling from the rear sling swivle and step on it - that somewhat controlled the rise so the gunner only had to deal with lateral movement. Later the Army adopted a special stock for the M14 and created the M14E2, it was still a failure as a SAW. The failure was not a maechanical one, nor ammunition or magazine. It was weight. (There is a reason an M2 with tripod weighs in at 90+ pounds)

    So, with automatic weapons, weight does play a MAJOR part of accuracy. There are no "ifs ands or buts" about it. With autos, control equals accuracy. Again, the mechanical accuracy is only a good as the weapon to begin with.

    Now, a G18 cannot be expected to be used effectively in full auto beyond 25 yards or so. The accuracy simply suffers, although the G18C compensation helps. As does many, many rounds of practice. However, I digress...

    Now, to be sure I am clear: I understand and agree that in semi auto mode increased weight will not help accuracy. Full auto is a different beast altogether. I think we are just going in different directions on the same track.
     
  12. Glockasaurus Rex

    Glockasaurus Rex Degüello

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    Is there any way a civilian can buy a G18? I want one!!!
     
  13. CA_DUDE

    CA_DUDE Dude here.

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    Cool video! Are those all the cows you've whacked on the barn?
     
  14. J Crew

    J Crew Family Man

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    well more control or not... i like the video. keep it up.

    - Jason
     
  15. Darin Reiss

    Darin Reiss

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    CA_DUDE,

    I didn't whack any of the cow/bull skulls on Morris's chicken coup. I will have to ask him where they came from. He has Black Angus cow/calves and a few bulls. He has some INCREDIBLE whitetail deer on his spread. His ranch borders the Hashknife. The link shows what his place butts up against.

    http://www.huntthehashknife.com/

    Darin
     
  16. Custom Glock Racing

    Custom Glock Racing I did it first. Millennium Member

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    I was talking about FA glocks and I have tested tungsten and springs with them. Again, been there done that know what works.
     
  17. G17Collector

    G17Collector Original "G"

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    So, a tungsten rod makes a difference when shooting semi auto in competition, but makes no difference in full auto?

    From the CGR.com website (as of 1/22/06) technical article on guiderods:

    "Something that weighs less than 2 ounces may not seems like much but it does make a significant difference in the numbers and when shooting. "

    Can you explain yourself?
     
  18. MARTIN FISHER

    MARTIN FISHER

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    Coogan,
    I think what CGR is saying is that the mechanical accuarcy of the pistol does not become better with the giude rod. IE, the groups shot in a mechanical, stable rest would not get any tighter by using a tungston guiderod.

    He agreed with you in that the G18 or otherwise is easer to control with more weight lighter spring, but the gun, barrel, ammo and system is not "more accurate" which I agree with.
     
  19. AWDTerror

    AWDTerror Ass Penny

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    does anyone else besides me think that shooting at the ground is a bad idea?
     
  20. G17Collector

    G17Collector Original "G"

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    I am arguing pratical accuracy here, not mechanical. The article on the website encompasses my argument. CGR's argument here does not echo the article. If his argument DOES, then he has not effectively conveyed that to me.