Gen 4 G17 Stove Piping

Discussion in 'General Glocking' started by PhiDeltChicoTCU, Mar 3, 2010.

  1. PhiDeltChicoTCU

    PhiDeltChicoTCU

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    What ammo are y'all running through your Gen 4 17s?

    I put an assortment of roughly 100 rounds of Winchester white box and Remington orange/ green box through my NIB 17 and experienced 9 stove pipes.. Both boxes were 115 grain target grade ammo.

    Thinking the ammo is a little under powered for the double recoil spring.

    I've never had any issues with my Gen 3 17 eating these boxes so I'll assume it's related to the new spring. I had 2 other friends try it and they had stove pipes too so it's not a limp wristing issue
     
  2. DannyR

    DannyR Moderator Millennium Member

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    I experienced the exact same problem with a Gen4 G17, using Winchester USA 115-gr FMJ, Atlanta Arms 147-gr Match, and my 147-gr FMJ reloads. I am trying to get my hands on some Blazer 124-gr and/or American Eagle 147-gr ammo to see if the problem persists. I agree with you that it may be the spring rate.

    It is neither a shooter nor a magazine issue.
     

  3. TZZ

    TZZ

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    I owned a Gen 4 G17 for less than a week. It had so many problems that I could not believe it. This gun is not ready for prime time. Redesign is necessary.

    To begin with, I hated the RTF. It is too rough, sort of like holding a gun with medium coarse sandpaper glued to its grip. This alone was not enough to influence me to get rid of the gun. But what came next was really unexpected.

    Among the issues I experienced were numerous FTE's and FTF's. I was absolutely shocked by quantity of malfunctions. The first time at the range I put 300 Federal American Eagle 115 grain rounds through the gun. I had a malfunction with almost every round. I also observed that nearly every time the last round in the magazine had been fired the slide failed to lock back. Considering that I usually load only 10 rounds in magazines for testing and shot placement evaluation, this means that out of 30 magazine loads there were at least 25 failures to lock the slide back when the magazines were empty. I used 4 new magazines during my first test.

    Back at home I discovered the G17 recoil spring assembly was not seated properly. I fixed that problem and thoroughly cleaned the gun, spending at least an hour on it. I also disassembled the magazines, cleaned them, and put just a very small amount of oil on each spring.

    The next time at the range I shot 400 rounds of 115 grain Winchester White Box through the G17. Nearly every one fired and ejected perfectly with excellent accuracy. Problem solved -- or so I thought.

    On my third visit to the range I began firing 115 grain Monarch ammo. At round #3 the FTE's and FTF's had returned. Thinking the recoil spring assembly had somehow moved, I immediately unloaded the gun, removed the slide, and examined it with a bright flashlight. Nothing was out of place. This made no sense to me. I re-attached the slide, reloaded the gun, and resumed firing. Nearly every one of the 50 rounds was FTE or FTF. Again, empty magazines were usually accompanied by failure to lock the slide back. During this range visit I used 6 new, clean magazines.

    By this time my frustration level was at an all time high. I called Glock tech support for advice. They told me that since, I had already tried different types of ammo, all I could do was send the gun to them for repair. Turnaround time would be 3 - 4 months for repair -- and I have to take it on faith that my G17 won't be returned with an explanation like "No Trouble Found", or "Cleaned and Test Fired to Factory Spec".

    Forget it! I took the gun back to the store and sold it to them for less than half of what I paid. I am truly very sorry that I did not buy a Gen 3 G17.

    My advice to all of you trying to decide whether or not to buy a Gen 4 is to wait at least 6 months. There are too many reports of FTE and FTF with this gun to buy it at this time. Wait until Glock makes a design improvement and the entire existing inventory is out of the dealer pipeline.
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2010
  4. SawgrassRaven

    SawgrassRaven

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    This is why I never buy a new firearm from any company until it's been out a few years.

    Hope this gets resolved.

    :wavey:
     
  5. ravenkeeper98

    ravenkeeper98 NRA Benefactor

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    100 rds last weekend Blazer Brass 115gr, no issues. This was the first 100 I put through it as well. I guess since I had the failure to return to battery with my 30SF I'm immune to any issues with the Gen4 G17
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2010
  6. paul45

    paul45

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    This kinda shocks me.

    You are willing to take that kind of hit?

    Your gunshop is willing to take that kind of advantage of a customer?
     
  7. Chui

    Chui

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    Hell, I wish I could have picked it up from you.
     
  8. Chui

    Chui

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    The recoil spring assembly is much stiffer than the Gen III pistol so "weasel rounds" may be marginal cyclers. Also if there is just a small amount of unlocked wrist in your shooting said "weasel rounds" it's likely to fail to feed.

    I'll purchase anyone's Gen IV if they choose to sell it. PM me please.
     
  9. JBP55

    JBP55

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    2900 rounds of various ammo. through my G4 G17 with 7 different shooters and it has been flawless.
     
  10. JBP55

    JBP55

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    I have 147 AE, 147 GS, 147HST+P, 124+P GS, 124+P HST but shipping would be costly. I think the spring rate in the G4 G17 could be lowered 2#-3#.

    I have fired 2900 115 WWB, 124 NATO, 115 AE, 147 AE, 115 Champion, 124+P GS, 147 GS, 124+P HST and 147+P HST with my G4 G17 with 7 different shooters and it has been flawless. Good Luck in solving the issues with your new gun.
     
  11. faawrenchbndr

    faawrenchbndr CLM

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    Smart man,......I'm going to sit this Gen 4 thing out for at least a year.
     
  12. Copis

    Copis

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    maybe leave the slide locked back for few days? :dunno:
     
  13. faawrenchbndr

    faawrenchbndr CLM

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    A coil spring does not loose any spring tension be being held compressed.
    It is cycles that weakens a spring.
     
  14. LEAD

    LEAD

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    I agree rather than taking a couple hundred dollar hit, try to lock the slide back for a few and see if it just needs to be broken in. I advise this for anyone getting these types of problems with similar weapons.

    I know that it shoudn't work, but it has.
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2010
  15. BigBadAllis

    BigBadAllis

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    I had the same problem with my G22 Gen 4. I called Glock they tried to blame it on the ammo. I had several stove pipes for the first 500 rds. After 500 rds, I haven't had any probles what so ever. I made sure to have it well documented so if it happens again, I'm sending it back to Glock.
     
  16. Copis

    Copis

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    I am aware of that fact.....
    So how do you explain the fact that so many G30 owners can squeeze the last round in AFTER the mag has sat loaded for a few weeks?

    Its a new spring so it might be over tensioned.....it's worth a try.....

    Its certainly a better suggestion to the OP as opposed to "I would have waited a year to buy a Gen 4"
     
  17. jack76590

    jack76590

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    I suspect glock is going to have Gen 3 recoil springs in inventory for a long time. Glock could easily have designed the Gen 4 G17 to take the same recoil spring as the Gen 3. The Gen 4 dual recoil spring could have been used in the G22.

    There would have been no additional parts for glock to stock. But then people would have said, if the 9mm and 40 caliber glocks need a different recoil spring, why are you just now providing separate recoil springs after years a denying, there was any problems with your Gen 3 40 cal glocks.
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2010
  18. TZZ

    TZZ

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    I was willing to take the loss for several reasons. For starters I have a very good income and no dependents. A $300 loss is not that big of a deal. The way I see it all hobbies are expensive. Whether you acquire top-of-the-line Nikon photo equipment, or you buy a few thousand movies for your home entertainment collection, you are going to spend a lot of money.

    As for the store taking advantage of me. I don't feel they did that. They told me fair enough that they pay a wholesale price for new guns, so they can't offer a customer a high value for a used gun. I also told the dealer that I did not care much about the resale value. I just wanted to sell the gun and be done with the matter. When I had a check in my hand I felt greatly relieved. I deposited the check at an ATM on the drive home.

    My biggest regret in this matter is the fact that I ALMOST bought the Gen 3 and I made the wrong choice. I went to the store unsure of which G17 to buy, saw the improvements of the Gen 4 model, and at the last moment changed my mind regarding which one to buy. I am now thinking of returning to the store and buying a Gen 3. One way or another, I intend to succeed in my quest for a reliable G17.
     
  19. voyager4520

    voyager4520

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    Try some American Eagle, it's the hottest stated factory load I've seen. I don't know what the actual velocity is, but it's got the highest stated factory velocity.

    I've seen enough of these Gen4 G17 FTE/FTF threads to make me think the recoil springs are too strong(as DannyR said) since they tried to use the same part for both the 9mm and .40. I've never even shot a 9mm Glock, but I remember many people saying that even the Gen3 9mms were oversprung because they used the same part for 9mm and .40. Maybe once you shoot it for a while the recoil springs will break in a little.
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2010
  20. RFPhoto

    RFPhoto

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    I see alot of people here are shooting WWB, Blaser, etc. I would suggest you give your new Gen 4 guns at least a 200rd steady diet of Speer Gold Dots or +P ammo thru it before you send them to Glock.