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FYI...Avoid Nontypical Outfitters of New Mexico!!!!

Discussion in 'Hunting, Fishing & Camping' started by Gunlawyer, Jan 29, 2003.

  1. Gunlawyer

    Gunlawyer

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    Just a heads up to those who are booking for the coming fall. I booked a mule deer hunt with this incredibly unprofessional "operation" last fall and I deeply regret the experience. Suffice to say that almost everything represented by them in person, literature and on their website is a downright lie!!! My experience was not an exception. I have since learned (way too late) that my bad experience is standard for one of their hunts. email me at enviro_law@hotmail.com if you need the gruesome details, this warning should be enough. One of my favorite quotes from the hunt Guide: "Well, we will see more deer from the truck..." and lets not forget "yeah, I have got to get some binoculars..." Avoid at all cost!!!

    Chris Thomas
    NRA Life
    USPSA FY42412
     
  2. terlingua

    terlingua Senor Member

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    Sorry for your bad luck. Thanks for the heads up though. You might want to post this at a few of the hunting sites.
     

  3. hoagie55

    hoagie55

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    Chris,

    Why don't you type up a professional review of them and then post it here for all to read. You can also go out and post it on several hunting bulletin baords to warn people about this outfitter. I can give you the name of three hunting bulletin boards if you like.

    FYI. When typing up a review keep it as professional as possible and not ad anything personal in it at all.
     
  4. paulito

    paulito

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    so what you're saying is.......... you didn't get a deer? j/k i'm really sorry about that unfortunate inccident. my cousin experienced the same thing with a bear outfitter in canada three years ago. he was guaranteed to kill one (or at least have a shot at one) and he never saw a single sow. he argued with the guide and he finally agreed to let him come back the following season for a free hunt. well, he didn't see one on that trip either so my cousin just forgot about the whole thing. you know, if i paid over $3k on a special "guided" hunt, i would at least want to see one to be satisfied. was yours pretty much like that? never even saw one? i'm really sorry about that.

    paulito;9
     
  5. DonD

    DonD

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    Hate to say it but having lived in NM for 15yrs, unprofessional operations are not surprising to me. Sorry you got stung. Don
     
  6. Gunlawyer

    Gunlawyer

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  7. ithaca_deerslayer

    ithaca_deerslayer

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    List the problems you had.

    Hopefully it wasn't that you didn't see anything, or get anything.

    Anytime I invite someone to hunt on my property for free, I always say "no guarantees".
     
  8. Gunlawyer

    Gunlawyer

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    Here is my tale of woe…

    I bought a mule deer hunt off ebay with non-typical outfitters of New Mexico the December before last for $1,460.00. The regular price is $2,450.00 so I figured I got a deal. I mailed him $1000.00 as a deposit with the rest to be paid when I showed up. Before I won the auction ended, I phoned Adrian Romero, the owner, and he promised me up and down that I would see lots of mule deer, and specifically between 8 to 12 bucks a day. (keep in mind that my grievances with this outfitter have NOTHING to do with the number of deer I saw) Cool I thought! So I won the auction for a fully guided hunt, for 5 days with food, wall tents and everything provided.

    The time got close to the hunt and I needed details on where to go to meet them.. I never heard from them, and one number was disconnected, the other line never returned my calls. I called New Mexico Fish and Game to see what they could do since this outfit was licensed with them. Sure enough, they had a good number and called him. He called me shortly thereafter and told me that instead of doing the wilderness tent camping thing I would be staying at the Travellodge in Grants. Oh well, so much for the outdoor experience, a hotel will have to do I thought, at least the hunting will be good!

    He said he would reserve a room for me and leave my tags at the front desk so I could get my license the night before opening day at the Wal-Mart across the street, and that he and my guides would take me out for dinner that Friday night. In fact he stated that he had some cancellations, and I would have two guides! Cool!! Right?

    When I showed up at hotel, the front desk had not heard from the outfitter in a long time, had no idea who I was, had no reservations for me and did not have my tags! They said the credit card they had for the outfitter did not have enough credit on it to cover my room and I promised I would get hold of Adrian and get him to straighten it out. So they let me have a room on that basis and I waited. Finally I managed to reach Adrian on his cell phone and asked him what the story was, asked where my tags were. Turns out he forgot all about my tags, that he was currently in Oklahoma guiding some deer hunters (who he told me just left out of disgust at not having seen any whitetails) and that he was hunting himself for a few days. I asked who would guide me and he said he did not know but would make some calls and find someone. I told him about the problems with his payment for the hotel room and he assured me that it was all taken care of. Tuns out that he never worked it out and I got kicked out of the hotel after two days, and only got back in after one of the guides called and complained to Adrian on my behalf…more on that later.

    What about the tags I asked? He said I had to drive back to Albequerque (90 miles away) and get replacement ones from Fish and Game. Keep in mind that it was now 3:30 in the afternoon on Friday, opening day was the next morning. So I called Fish and Game, got good directions and by some miracle, after driving like a madman, made it to their office just before closing.

    Adrian calls back later in the evening and says he found someone to take me out, says the guy knows the area (Zuni Mts.) well and to be ready at 5:30 a.m. I ask about the two guides I was supposed to have and he says they could not get off work!??! He further suggests that I eat locally since there is no one to cook. At this point I am pissed but I hide it, I don't want to get into a verbal fight and end up with no guides at all.

    The next moring I am ready and waiting outside my motel after eating at the Denny's next to the hotel. A big, friendly fella' dressed in camo pulls up in a huge, new pickup and I feel better, I think to myself that maybe this all will be fine. So into the Zuni mountains we drive. Opening light of opening day finds us sitting in his pickup on the edge of a clearcut. He has no binoculars, no range finder, and though he is very nice and wants to help, he also has no clue. At least he turned the stereo down in the truck while we waited. I am simply dumbfounded with disgust at the situation. Some outdoor experience!!!

    Now I am no expert on hunting Mule Deer, but I have done a ton of reading spotting and stalking, and about glassing muleys, you know, using a tripod mounted pair of huge binoculars and in fact successfully hunted the Kaibab in Arizona the fall before for muleys so I know that this situation is totally screwed. I asked him if he had any experience glassing for muley's and he responds that has heard about it, but he doesn't own or have any binoculars with him. My pair of 10 x 50's don't cut it but he is amazed at what he can see when I offer them to him to try out. He similarly amazed at the rangefinder I offer to him to try out. Good God.
    Now it is full daylight and finally we exit his truck for a fast walk down a logging road through the clear cut at a pace so fast there was absolutely no chance of seeing a damn thing unless the deer were blind and deaf. Pure beginner hunting tactics. I follow dutifully behind him, so depressed and unbelievably amazed at what is happening that I can’t speak. After about a half hour of this he exclaims," I don't know why we are not seeing any deer, well we will see more from the truck".

    The next day I get a new guide, again a really nice guy who really wanted to get me on a deer. Nonetheless, it was practically the same experience. At first light, he took me to the same spot as the other guy and we did the same thing. The only difference is that now we drove into the clear cut in his jeep instead of walking as I did the day before. After this failed to produce- go figure…, he exclaims “Well, we always see more deer from the road” At this point I gave up all hope. I am not a road hunter but changed my attitude (so I could enjoy myself) to accept that any hunting would have to be done by myself, and as a result, I really did enjoy the nice scenery as we drove around for hours. It really is beautiful to drive on the forest service roads in the Zunis, the big pines in the noon day sun, golden aspens, the mountains, etc.

    This should give you an idea of the rest of the trip. I had booked with this outfitter after being assured that I would be led by real professionals. I had hoped to learn more about hunting mule deer. Not that it matters, but I never saw a deer (until after three days of this when I fired them and hunted by myself the last two days) but that is hunting and didn't bother me. What bothered me was how practically every single factual representation Adrian told me was a damn lie.

    Everything, the outdoor camp, the camp cooking, how they scout all season, are very experienced, that he had my tags, that he paid for my room, that he would provide any of the things the auction was for really, etc. In short I got taken. If he lived in Texas I would sue the #$@%*& out of him in small claims court but it is not worth it to chase him in New Mexico in the District Court. So from now on I will check references and never buy a hunt on ebay ever again.
     
  9. hoagie55

    hoagie55

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    Chris,

    I'm sorry to hear that you got taken. It does sounds like a very bad situation and I'm glad that you were at least able to enjoy the scenery.

    I wish you better luck on your future hunts!!!
     
  10. smeet5150

    smeet5150 Southern Son

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    man, that really sucks. I hope you get some sort of justice.
     
  11. redskyzatknight

    redskyzatknight Glock S&W Kahr

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    that was depressing to even read. i would not have been able to contain my anger and disapointment. it sounds like "Adrian" is solely responsible for everything that happened. i'd badger the sh!t out of him till i got some money back. i would seriously talk with a lawyer if i were you. good luck.
     
  12. ithaca_deerslayer

    ithaca_deerslayer

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    You got hosed.

    Maybe just best to move on and not make same mistake again of going on guided hunt without checking references or knowing someone else who used the outfitter.
     
  13. NugeRocks

    NugeRocks The Nuge

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    Man that sucks. I was just at the RMEF banquet last Thur. (4/3)in Manchester CT. and they had a booth there. I didn't check them out but they did auction off a hunt. The man from the outfit mentioned about the tent, food, etc. and said you would have a great time. I didn't bid. The winning bidder got it for around 1500.00. I guess he's in for a suprise.
     
  14. Clyde in CO

    Clyde in CO LOL WUT?

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    That really sucks man.

    Don't roll over, fight for your money back. Otherwise it's like rewarding him for being a liar and a con artist.

    Best of luck!
     
  15. Minuteman

    Minuteman Jeff Gannon???

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    Interstate fraud
    Wire fraud
    Theft by deception

    I think there is also a federal law about using a hunting tag as a lure for a deception. This kind of thing has happened alot in the past. There are laws about this.
    You should report him to fish and game, state D.A., local D.A., your local D.A., BBB, and the local shooting hunting clubs in his area.
    Try to find out if he has had other similar complaints. A class action suit and some interstate fraud charges would fix his *** good.
    If nothing else, report him to ebay(prob. a waste of time) and make sure his name is mud to his local hunting clubs and fish and game.
     
  16. gogburn

    gogburn Old Fart

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    Well, it does say "nontypical outfitters."

    Sorry, bad humor. I feel your pain.
     
  17. paynter2

    paynter2 It ain't over Millennium Member

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    Chris: How much are you out? the $1000 or did you give him the balance due ($450?).

    It was a pain in the *** - but if you got tags and a hunt for 1 grand, at least you got something besides a screwin'.

    Sorry to hear about it.
     
  18. Gunlawyer

    Gunlawyer

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    This thread is waaayyyyyy old but I thought I would update it. Karma worked out big time in this case. It turns out my buddy Adrian was such a scumbag screwing hunters over (he forged numberous big $$ elk tags) that he was sentenced to 10 years in prison. Tee hee hee!! I wonder if he has become someone's prison wife? Perhaps contracted Hep. C, TB, etc.? Ah prison, good times.

    While I never got my money back and have since moved on to become an accomplished mule deer hunter on my own, I note with a grin that Karma seems to have come around for poor Adrian and his wife. Here is a link.

    http://www.texashuntfish.com/app/vi...e;jsessionid=B64AFD7612486053F33A7EE4EDFAF604

    I don't use guides out west anymore but the lesson here is, check recent references carefully. Or you may meet someone like Adrian Romero. What comes around, goes around.

    Oh, and last week, I finally got a like new Glock 17T, you know, the blue frame Simunition Glock for very cheap. It is like the Universe made it up to me. It all works out in the end.

    CT
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2011
  19. bustedknee

    bustedknee The Snowflakes have invaded GT

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    He cheated the state out of a lot of money. That is why they went after him.

    But it is sweet, ain't it? When what goes around comes around.

    I've had it happen a few times and if I ever need a boost I think back about the time....
    A big ole smile crawls across my face. :laughing:


     
  20. noway

    noway

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    Good for you. I too have been tempted with this guide hunts thousands of miels away from my homestead but have yet to take up one. I'm too looking for a Muley deer hunt but rather go with some one that has been to that location with guide XYZ.

    Reading this post has made up my mind to ......wait !
     
    1965jeff likes this.