from the internet is this valid?

Discussion in 'The US Air Force Forum' started by lethal tupperwa, Jun 15, 2013.

  1. lethal tupperwa

    lethal tupperwa

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    Aug 20, 2002
    I would say every US fighter pilot, retired or on active duty, knows that Panetta and Dempsey both are full of crap when they said there was no time to send help to Benghazi. They claim it was a problem of "time/space." All my friends and I said, "Bull****." We know they could have gotten F-16s there from Aviano.

    "Hands" Handley is a well-respected USAF fighter pilot. Here is his short resume and what he just wrote about Benghazi below that. If anything, Handley is pessimistic in his timeline of when F-16s could have reached Benghazi . I think they could have been airborne even sooner and turned quicker at Sig. The decision to not try was not based on capability. We had the operational capability in every way.

    I hope Handley's taxes are in order. His IRS audit is forthcoming.

    Eagle Biography

    Colonel Phil "Hands" Handley

    Colonel Phil "Hands" Handley is credited with the highest speed air- to-air gun kill in the history of aerial combat. He flew operationally for all but 11 months of a 26-year career, in aircraft such as the F-86 Sabre, F-15 Eagle, and the C-130A Hercules. Additionally, he flew 275 combat missions during two tours in Southeast Asia in the F- 4D and F-4E. His awards include 21 Air Medals, 3 Distinguished Flying Crosses, and the Silver Star.

    Betrayal in Benghazi
    Phil "Hands" Handley Colonel, USAF (Ret.)

    The combat code of the US Military is that we don't abandon our dead or wounded on the battlefield. In US Air Force lingo, fighter pilots don't run off and leave their wingmen. If one of our own is shot down, still alive and not yet in enemy captivity, we will either come to get him or die trying.

    Among America 's fighting forces, the calm, sure knowledge that such an irrevocable bond exists is priceless. Along with individual faith and personal grit, it is a sacred trust that has often sustained hope in the face of terribly long odds.

    The disgraceful abandonment of our Ambassador and those brave ex-SEALs who fought to their deaths to save others in that compound is nothing short of dereliction-of-duty.

    Additionally, the patently absurd cover-up scenario that was fabricated in the aftermath was an outright lie in an attempt to shield the President and the Secretary of State from responsibility.

    It has been over eight months since the attack on our compound in Benghazi . The White House strategy, with the aid of a "lap dog" press has been to run out the clock before the truth is forthcoming. The recent testimonies of the three "whistle blowers" have reopened the subject and hopefully will lead to exposure and disgrace of those responsible for this embarrassing debacle. It would appear that the most recent firewall which the Administration is counting on is the contention "that there were simply no military assets that could be brought to bear in time to make a difference" mainly due to the unavailability of tanker support for fighter aircraft.

    This is simply BS, regardless how many supposed "experts" the Administration trot out to make such an assertion.

    The bottom line is that even if the closest asset capable of response was half-way around the world, you don't just sit on your penguin ass and do nothing.

    The fact is that the closest asset was not half-way around the world, but as near as Aviano Air Base, Italy where two squadrons of F-16Cs are based.

    Consider the following scenario (all times Benghazi local): When Hicks in Tripoli receives a call at 9:40 PM from Ambassador Stevens informing him "Greg, we are under attack!" (his last words), he immediately notifies all agencies and prepares for the immediate initiation of an existing "Emergency Response Plan."

    At AFRICON, General Carter Ham attempts to mount a rescue effort, but is told to "stand down". By 10:30 PM an unarmed drone is overhead the compound and streaming live feed to various "Command and Control Agencies" and everyone watching that feed knew damn well what was going on.

    At 11:30 PM Woods, Doherty and five others leave Tripoli, arriving in Benghazi at 1:30 AM on Wednesday morning, where they hold off the attacking mob from the roof of the compound until they are killed by a mortar direct hit at 4:00 AM.
    So nothing could have been done, eh? Nonsense. If one assumes that tanker support really "was not available" what about this:

    When at 10:00 PM AFRICON alerts the 31st TFW Command Post in Aviano Air Base, Italy of the attack, the Wing Commander orders preparation for the launch of two F-16s and advises the Command Post at NAS Sigonella to prepare for hot pit refueling and quick turn of the jets.

    By 11:30 PM, two F-16Cs with drop tanks and each armed with five hundred 20 MM rounds are airborne. Flying at 0.92 mach they will cover the 522 nautical miles directly to NAS Sigonella in 1.08 hours. While in-route, the flight lead is informed of the tactical situation, rules of engagement, and radio frequencies to use.

    The jets depart Sigonella at 1:10 AM with full fuel load and cover the 377 nautical miles directly to Benghazi in 0.8 hours, arriving at 1:50 AM which would be 20 minutes after the arrival of Woods, Doherty and their team.

    Providing that the two F-16s initial pass over the mob, in full afterburner at 200 feet and 550 knots did not stop the attack in its tracks, only a few well placed strafing runs on targets of opportunity would assuredly do the trick.

    Were the F-16s fuel state insufficient to recover at Sigonella after jettisoning their external drop tanks, they could easily do so at Tripoli International Airport , only one-half hour away.

    As for those hand-wringing naysayers who would worry about IFR clearances, border crossing authority, collateral damage, landing rights, political correctness and dozens of other reasons not to act," screw them”. It is high time that our "leadership" get their priorities straight and put America's interests first.

    The end result would be that Woods and Doherty would be alive. Dozens in the attacking rabble would be rendezvousing with "72 virgins" and a clear message would have been sent to the next worthless POS terrorist contemplating an attack on Americans that it is not really a good idea to "tug" on Superman's cape.

    Of course all this would depend upon a Commander In Chief that was more concerned with saving the lives of those he put in harm's way than getting his crew rested for a campaign fund raising event in Las Vegas the next day. As well as a Secretary of State that actually understood "What difference did it make?", or a Secretary of Defense whose immediate response was not to the effect that "One of the military tenets is that you don't commit assets until you fully understand the tactical situation." Was he not watching a live feed from the unarmed drone, and he didn't understand the tactical situation?

    Ultimately it comes down to the question of who gave that order to stand down? Whoever that coward turns out to be should be exposed, removed from office, and face criminal charges for dereliction of duty. The combat forces of the United States of America deserve leadership that really does "have their back" when the chips are down.

    Glockworks likes this.
  2. A6Gator


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    Apr 4, 2007
    formerly Barack's Plantation
    If it was on the internet, it must be true...:whistling:

    I think he's being waaay too kind to Panetta and Dempsey.
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2013

  3. Superchud1


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    May 25, 2012
    Las Vegas
    Never ask ops how long it takes to get jets ready, pilots fly the aircraft that's all. There are a lot of factors that would determine how long it would take to get the first jet airborne. I don't have any background on getting diplomatic clearances concerning flying over foreign countries...... so I'm not going to comment on the ops side.

    Did Aviano have aircraft on Alert status? If they did aircraft could be airborne in 1-2 hours depending on their alert status.

    If not it takes time to perform the necessary servicing to ready the aircraft. It takes time to load the munitions. Does ammo have munitions ready for delivery to the flightline? If not then they have to be readied and delivered. This takes time. Real life isn't like the movies, you don't just walk up to the aircraft and start it up. Their are a lot of steps that need to be accomplished before an aircraft is ready for flight. Expect 4 hours minimum if the wing commander presses the panic button and rushes everything.

    And Hot pitting in Sig...unless your lucky it's not going to happen.
    1. Does sig have hot pit capabilities?
    2. Does sig have maintenance personell qualified to hot pit an F-16? To be honest I doubt it. Hot pitting is dangerous and requires a bunch of certifications to maintain the capability.

    While I wouldn't say that having aircraft overhead in a timely matter was possible/impossible, it's silly to speculate with out knowing all the details. But based on my experience, unless Aviano had aircraft sitting on Alert status then no your not going to have aircraft overhead for a while.

    My background
    1996-2009: F-16 crew chief block 40 and 50 aircraft.
    Aviano, Cannon, Kunsan and Spangdahlem
    2009-present: MQ-9 crew chief
  4. RonboF117


    Likes Received:
    Apr 23, 2007
    I would disagree it takes four hours to get a jet airborne unless you are talking zero priority and just "flying another line on the schedule". I know you have crew chief experience but my pilot experience doesn't match with what you said.

    I set the record at Kunsan for the quickest "Alert" scramble at 4 min 58 sec from being in the bunk to takeoff. And that includes the 15-30 secs we couldn't get the bread van started to get us to the Alert barns.. I've also hot pitted numerous times on the same mission along with getting new munitions. So if they had an active Alert barn at Aviano with two drops and any kind of munitions, and if it was 1+00 enroute going direct and cleared so; they would have had sufficient playtime in the area to change the tide of that battle.

    I feel the biggest point people don't realize is that this administration is going to squash any investigation that gets close to what was really happening at the Embassy. THAT is the reason people, jets, gunships, etc. we're turned away. If that came out, there would be too much embarrassment and loss of Intel capability. That is where the focus needs to be.

    "The only thing new is the history you don't know".

    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    Glockworks likes this.