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Wouldn't an easy fix now be for the store owner to refund the difference of value between a new PF-9 and a used one. If I were the customer here that would be an acceptable compromise.
that's the issue for me. If I paid for new in box, I expect new in box. Telling me you'd fix a broken one for what I paid new value for is unacceptable....If that's the best they can do, then a full refund should also be an option....if the item was that hard to find and it was my choice to keep it then I'd expect to be refunded the difference between new and refurbished - no surprises...
 

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are we outing Florida ripoffs? ok, bout time.

Johnny Wacko on Ruger forum screwed me on a gun deal. Mods won't
do squat to him and told me to keep quiet. Can't upset our members. My advice is to avoid this guy unless you like losing money.

And Wild west guns in Jax tried to sell me a very used p3at as new.
I asked the salesman about it and he rolled his eyes and mumbled
"that's what I was told to say".
 

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That response from B&H was complete crap...they are still trying to pass blame in a round about way. Bottom line is they sold a pistol with a cracked slide and are acting like it's 'no big deal' and even excusable...that shows exactly how much they care. I definitely won't be shopping with them here in Florida.
 

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The Unemployment people would love you. Firing them is overreacting, because the customer overreacted. He should have calmly adressed the upper level of management, as he did in the end, and he would have had a resolution.
You may tolerate your workers' incompetence, but not me.

First of all, there was the very initial incompetence of whomever checking the gun in as it was received from Kel-Tec or distributor. How can anybody tell me that if they had looked at the gun's serial number and not seeing that big ass crack is beyond me.

Then the other incompetence or negligence arised when the sales rep did not properly inspect the gun AGAIN when it was sold to the customer. How can you suppose to verify the serial number on the gun to make sure that it goes on the Yellow Form and not see that big ass crack?

Then the final incompetence/apathy/negligence/stupdity of the store manager who told the customer to resolve the issue on his own without explaining to him that it's in his best interest to go to Kel-Tec because the new gun would get to him faster than the store can get him a new one.

You're right though. The worker bees may not need to be fired but the store manager's got to go for damn sure. He is ultimately responsible for not only his action but the action of the workers underneath him.
 

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Why the hell would you not look at the gun you are buying??
I bought one from them yesterday and didn't open it. It was a Blue Label G17 Gen4 still sealed from Glock. It was fine. I have bought from them 5 times and have had no issues.
 

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You may tolerate your workers' incompetence, but not me.

First of all, there was the very initial incompetence of whomever checking the gun in as it was received from Kel-Tec or distributor. How can anybody tell me that if they had looked at the gun's serial number and not seeing that big ass crack is beyond me.

Then the other incompetence or negligence arised when the sales rep did not properly inspect the gun AGAIN when it was sold to the customer. How can you suppose to verify the serial number on the gun to make sure that it goes on the Yellow Form and not see that big ass crack?

Then the final incompetence/apathy/negligence/stupdity of the store manager who told the customer to resolve the issue on his own without explaining to him that it's in his best interest to go to Kel-Tec because the new gun would get to him faster than the store can get him a new one.

You're right though. The worker bees may not need to be fired but the store manager's got to go for damn sure. He is ultimately responsible for not only his action but the action of the workers underneath him.

Let me explain it like this. I have been a manager in retail and food service industries. You cannot fire every employee that makes a mistake or ticks off a customer. It will cost YOU in the long run.

Unemployment is a pool system. You pay a percentage into the your pool. When someone gets fired, they almost always get unemployment. When your people claiming unemployment goes up, so does your percentage. When you fire people for any little thing, and you end up with 4 or 5 people on unemployment, and you only employee 10 or 12 anyway, you are going to be paying a very high percentage into unemployment.

So, while you may say it would make the customer happy, or it would satisfy you to fire them, its not a business savvy thing to do. You should correct the employee, give them a few days off without pay, make them apologize, do whatever is necessary, and make a written warning of it. That way, when they do it again and you fire them, they cannot claim unemployment as it was an ongoing issue they were given written warning on.
 

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Let me explain it like this. I have been a manager in retail and food service industries. You cannot fire every employee that makes a mistake or ticks off a customer. It will cost YOU in the long run.

Unemployment is a pool system. You pay a percentage into the your pool. When someone gets fired, they almost always get unemployment. When your people claiming unemployment goes up, so does your percentage. When you fire people for any little thing, and you end up with 4 or 5 people on unemployment, and you only employee 10 or 12 anyway, you are going to be paying a very high percentage into unemployment.

So, while you may say it would make the customer happy, or it would satisfy you to fire them, its not a business savvy thing to do. You should correct the employee, give them a few days off without pay, make them apologize, do whatever is necessary, and make a written warning of it. That way, when they do it again and you fire them, they cannot claim unemployment as it was an ongoing issue they were given written warning on.
And I'm a manager for a multi-billion dollars constructtion company. I'd rather get rid of dead weights than having them dragging my company down. BTW, if you fire them for cause, they can't claim unemployment.
 

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Wow, there's a shop in Florida I hav'nt been to? I'll live without checking this place out I guess.
 

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And I'm a manager for a multi-billion dollars constructtion company. I'd rather get rid of dead weights than having them dragging my company down. BTW, if you fire them for cause, they can't claim unemployment.
For being rude to a customer would not qualify as cause. I have spent a lot of time dealing with unemployment claims. If you dont have at least one written warning in place you will be paying, in most cases. I am glad that you take the time out of your multi-billion uber important job, but I would think you would understand how a small business is impacted by Unemployment laws. Here are the basics, from both parties, and these are the admitted facts:

1. The clerk and the female customer both handled the gun in question before it left the store
2. The display model had a blued slide, the customer wanted a parkerized slide, thats the reason they pulled one from the back, the only parked on in the store
3. Customer finds problem and comes back to store
4. Customer wants an exact replacement, one is not available. The only model available is blued, customer does not want one. Customer brings up taking it to kel tec, the manager suggests its a good idea, as they will fix it while he waits.
5. Customer, without complaint, leaves store to go to kel tec.
6. Customer then posts on the internet about how horrible he was treated and how they tried to rip his wife off, etc.

After all this, the people on the message forums start making wild accusations based upon misleading information posted by the OP. If you go back to the original thread you will see that the OP admitted to the facts of the issue, he just "wasnt happy."

This is all a stupid argument that does nothing but badmouth a business that does not deserve it, they did everything they could. OFfered exchange of a different model, refund, etc. They cant make a new one.
 

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I bought my glock from this store and they have EXCELLENT customer service. At least to me they did. The case was sealed when I purchased it and it wouldn't surprise me if this Keltec case was sealed when they delivered it to the customer.

The owner has also offered some free goodies in his e-mail response but the customer did not accept them.

I stand behind the store on this one. If I buy a defective product it is the manufacturer's responsibility to fix it, not the store's.
 

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B&H gun rack will never get my business. I don't care that they offer a law enforcement discount. While I was attending the police academy, I went in had them put me on the 3 day waiting list. I had them order a Glock 33 for me I even asked if they needed money down I got Oh no, no problem your in the academy we will hold it for you. They called me about 5 days later told me it was in the store and ready for pickup. I get to the gunshop and I was told *WE JUST SOLD IT*, we can order another for you it might be here in about 2 weeks. I was so incredibly pissed off. I left and havent been back.

If you ever talk to someone on the phone at B&H get their name and note the day and time.
 

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Wow! In days of old, when a man or woman made a mistake they were stoned or beaten to death. Now "The New Breed" tries to destroy them on the internet.

I am familiar with B&H Gun Rack and, although I am out-of-state, I know several law enforcement officers that do quite a lot of business there. B&H is a stand up company that is willing to resolve issues. Please be merciful and spare their lives. Many of Florida's finest law enforcement officers depend on them and are quite satisfied with them.
 

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I stand behind the store on this one. If I buy a defective product it is the manufacturer's responsibility to fix it, not the store's.
You have got to be kidding me?!!

It's the store's responsibility to address any defect before it gets to the customer, especially something as glaringly as a big ass crack that ran down the side of the pistol. It ain't like the machinist missed polishing a spot on the feed ramp and caused failure to feed. IT'S A BIG ASS CRACK ON THE SIDE OF THE PISTOL. How can the shop employee(s) not have caught it when they were logging the gun in from the distributor?
 

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You have got to be kidding me?!!

It's the store's responsibility to address any defect before it gets to the customer, especially something as glaringly as a big ass crack that ran down the side of the pistol. It ain't like the machinist missed polishing a spot on the feed ramp and caused failure to feed. IT'S A BIG ASS CRACK ON THE SIDE OF THE PISTOL. How can the shop employee(s) not have caught it when they were logging the gun in from the distributor?
+1

Even if they can legally get away with forcing the customer to deal with it, that's not how you build a loyal customer base. The stores that stand out in my mind are the ones that go the extra mile to make sure the customer is completely satisfied.

Anyway, I'm not sure what to make of this case. It sounds like the customer overreacted, but at the same time, the dealer should have checked the merchandise more closely before selling it to an inexperienced shooter.
 

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What kind of crack was in that gun?
:whistling:

fearnuts
 

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Here are the basics, from both parties, and these are the admitted facts:

1. The clerk and the female customer both handled the gun in question before it left the store
2. The display model had a blued slide, the customer wanted a parkerized slide, thats the reason they pulled one from the back, the only parked on in the store
3. Customer finds problem and comes back to store
4. Customer wants an exact replacement, one is not available. The only model available is blued, customer does not want one. Customer brings up taking it to kel tec, the manager suggests its a good idea, as they will fix it while he waits.
5. Customer, without complaint, leaves store to go to kel tec.
6. Customer then posts on the internet about how horrible he was treated and how they tried to rip his wife off, etc.

After all this, the people on the message forums start making wild accusations based upon misleading information posted by the OP. If you go back to the original thread you will see that the OP admitted to the facts of the issue, he just "wasnt happy."

This is all a stupid argument that does nothing but badmouth a business that does not deserve it, they did everything they could. OFfered exchange of a different model, refund, etc. They cant make a new one.
Here are some facts too:

1. The gun must have been logged into the book (by law) when it was arrived. The only way to do this is to look at the gun's serial number on the frame. For some reasons the crack was not identified at this point so that tells me:

a. The employee; whomever that was, did not do a proper serial number verification and instead went off the serial number on the box = neglect or incompetence.

b. Assuming that the employee who logged the gun in did it properly by eyeballing the serial number off the frame, somehow after that was done, the gun cracked on its own out of magic or something = the little green men/UFO/gremlins did it.

2. When the gun was presented to the customer sealed in a case, that tells me that:

a. The employee, whomever that was, did not do a proper serial number verification for filling out the Yellow Form and only went off the serial number on the box = neglect or incompetence.

b. The employee done his/her job properly and inspected the gun itself, everything was good to go, but somehow between the walk from the back to the front the gun cracked on its own = little green men/UFO/gremlins did it.

c. Every store that I've purchased a gun in regardless of states and cities, the employee handed me the firearm for inspection, showing me the serial number to make sure that it matches what was on the Yellow Form. Why would this shop be different? Why would this shop hand over a sealed box to the customer?

Yes, the customer should have verified, but when he/she purchased the pistol NIB, the onus is on the shop and not on the customer make sure that the gun is at least visually functional.
 

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Maybe all the Glocks that "KB"ed came from that particular dealer? Haha jk

I am glad to hear that Kaltec is a good company to do business with and I'd chalk that up to a careless mistake on the business' end. Sometimes managers do not reflect the sales ethic of the entire company and I'd hate to see the owner lose a lot of business because of a manager's stubbornness.

Either way, I sincerely hope this situation gets resolved and all parties come out satisfied! :)
 

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Here are some facts too:

1. The gun must have been logged into the book (by law) when it was arrived. The only way to do this is to look at the gun's serial number on the frame. For some reasons the crack was not identified at this point so that tells me:

a. The employee; whomever that was, did not do a proper serial number verification and instead went off the serial number on the box = neglect or incompetence.

b. Assuming that the employee who logged the gun in did it properly by eyeballing the serial number off the frame, somehow after that was done, the gun cracked on its own out of magic or something = the little green men/UFO/gremlins did it.

2. When the gun was presented to the customer sealed in a case, that tells me that:

a. The employee, whomever that was, did not do a proper serial number verification for filling out the Yellow Form and only went off the serial number on the box = neglect or incompetence.

b. The employee done his/her job properly and inspected the gun itself, everything was good to go, but somehow between the walk from the back to the front the gun cracked on its own = little green men/UFO/gremlins did it.

c. Every store that I've purchased a gun in regardless of states and cities, the employee handed me the firearm for inspection, showing me the serial number to make sure that it matches what was on the Yellow Form. Why would this shop be different? Why would this shop hand over a sealed box to the customer?

Yes, the customer should have verified, but when he/she purchased the pistol NIB, the onus is on the shop and not on the customer make sure that the gun is at least visually functional.
I've seen plenty of guns sold with the label on the box still sealing it shut. Meaning it's pretty standard practice in the gun sales business to log guns into the book without opening the box. The distributors don't open the box, they go by what's written on the outside, so do many dealers.

The fault of this whole transaction lies with Kel-tec for putting a dangerous gun in a box without even looking at it. What type of quality control would allow that gun to even be put in a box?

Everyone praises Kel-tec for their great customer service. If Kel-tec gave half a damn about their customers no one would know how good their customer service was because the guns would leave the factory right the first time.

The title of this thread should be "Kel-tec sells broken new gun"
 

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The fault of this whole transaction lies with Kel-tec for putting a dangerous gun in a box without even looking at it. What type of quality control would allow that gun to even be put in a box?
You're right that Kel-Tec QAQC was at the initial fault. But for a shop to not verify the serial number on the gun and just rely on the box's label? That's just crazy, especially in this day and age of BATF cracking down.

My very first CZ-75B had the wrong serial number on the box's label. The shop caught it when they inspected the gun for serial number and told me about it. Since that it was the gun that mattered and I usually chuck the box right afterward, it wasn't a big deal for me.
 
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