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The statement by the chief said they violated training, expe.ctations, etc. I don’t remember seeing anything about Detroit policy re: shooting at moving vehicle, could have missed it


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Someone in this thread posted it. It used to be in my patrol guide as well but was changed only after terrorists started using trucks to mow down people.
 

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Actually, I think that’s intended to prevent firing at a car that’s trying to get away in your direction,


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Yes, that was the intention. That policy has been violated many times in my department before they changed it for good reason. It’s how they wrote it up that was/is the problem.
 

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Sometimes it takes a bigger man to run away like a little girl
 

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Again, it depends on how it was written up. No need to lie on the report.

Should they be punished, hell yes. Is it a career ender? Maybe not. More of a career stopper. Patrol for a very long time.

Work a busy place with a lot of shootings/homicides. Mistakes happen and are tolerated more than in places where a few shootings occur. Think wartime army vs peacetime army. People can make all sorts of mistakes but slap one soldier kind of thing.
Calculated omissions are lies, paint it anyway you like.

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Calculated omissions are lies, paint it anyway you like.

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Omissions designed to keep you out of trouble for your actions (or inaction) are just as problematic as lies regardless of the semantics of if they’re actually lies or not.

Randy


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Calculated omissions are lies, paint it anyway you like.

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We can agree to disagree.
Keeping things “ off paper “ is done everyday and anyone who claims otherwise is not being honest with themselves, didn’t deal with real crime on a daily basis , or just doesn’t realize it.

Does the cop who write tickets always put the actual speed they clocked the person or do they sometimes put a lower speed ? That’s done all the time . Is it a lie that they wrote at least 65 mph in a 55 zone when it was above 85 mph. If the cop doesn’t write at least 85 is it a lie?
 

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We can agree to disagree.
Keeping things “ off paper “ is done everyday and anyone who claims otherwise is not being honest with themselves, didn’t deal with real crime on a daily basis , or just doesn’t realize it.

Does the cop who write tickets always put the actual speed they clocked the person or do they sometimes put a lower speed ? That’s done all the time . Is it a lie that they wrote at least 65 mph in a 55 zone when it was above 85 mph. If the cop doesn’t write at least 85 is it a lie?

Ummm NO.

What you are talking about is multiple officers lying in reports about serious criminal activity. That would implode in Court if a defense attorney found out about it, and video is everywhere.
 

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Ummm NO.

What you are talking about is multiple officers lying in reports about serious criminal activity. That would implode in Court if a defense attorney found out about it, and video is everywhere.
What are you talking about multiple officers in multiple reports ? What reports? Multiple officers? Please give details to which reports or do you think each individual officer files a seperate report or even two officers in a car each file a separate report ? That’s usually not the case. One victim, one complaint report.One report of medical aid (depending on the department) and witness statements - usually made by the detectives . Do you think these officers told the other officers ? I doubt it and even if they did. They did not lie in the reports from anything we know yet.

Go read a complaint report and how it’s worded. Even if the A/O witnessed the crime , it’s often not in the complaint report that the patrol officer might file. :
“ At t/p/o c/v was shot by perpetrator #1( m//b)….”—

Some places, patrol officers don’t do any paperwork on a shooting , and it all falls on the detectives . Heck, some places don’t let patrol officers take felony arrests and they are reassigned to detectives.

And the reports patrol does file often gets more intentionally vague the more serous the unsolved crime as not to conflict wit other investigation conclusions such as not listing witnesses and let the detectives determine who is a witness first no matter how obvious who is a witness.

His or her partner might not file anything . The two officers may have never actually spoke with the detectives.

Crime scenes are not like Law and Order or CSI. The initial scene is almost always contaimated if on the open street. EMS comes in and disturbs it in an effort to provide aid too, including kicking over shell casings. The first cop’s on scene might go to the hospital with the victim, be sent to hold the line on the outer perimeter of scene, etc. They might never talk to the detectives unless something stands out like the two officers coming forward to say what they saw. Otherwise, unless a video or another witness says they were there, the supervisors, the other cops and detectives could never know they witinessed something.
 

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We can agree to disagree.
Keeping things “ off paper “ is done everyday and anyone who claims otherwise is not being honest with themselves, didn’t deal with real crime on a daily basis , or just doesn’t realize it.

Does the cop who write tickets always put the actual speed they clocked the person or do they sometimes put a lower speed ? That’s done all the time . Is it a lie that they wrote at least 65 mph in a 55 zone when it was above 85 mph. If the cop doesn’t write at least 85 is it a lie?
Well number one that's not done all the time anymore due to body and in car cameras, they will write the actual speed on the citation in comments so their is no question . Huge difference and you know it, here the cop(s) are hiding their failing by trying not to tell "THE WHOLE TRUTH and nothing but the truth" they failed and DPD can be glad supervisors caught it before some attorney .
 
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Well number one that's not done all the time anymore due to body and in car cameras, they will write the actual speed on the citation in comments so their is no question . Huge difference and you know it, here the cop(s) are hiding their failing by trying not to tell "THE WHOLE TRUTH and nothing but the truth" they failed and DPD can be glad supervisors caught it before some attorney .
Shows how things can change in the short time way from it since retirement. But the words “ anymore” illustrates my point if you are admitting it was done.
(Edit: Most units here still don’t have dash cameras, so it’s still done )

Same at a crime scene, a person wishes to give information anonymously and off the record. Is it always written down especially if it is conjecture, heresay and “ word on the street”. The answer is no. They might tell a cop or detective , the rumor is the victim was dealing drugs or had a problem with the drug dealers. Unless they can get on the record person ( either as a CI or named) they are unlikely to write it down. Why? It’s Brady material and it might not be true or relate to the case but the defense now has their way in, even to just muddy the waters . It’s only used as starting point to angle to be looked at.

And sure as hell, patrol officers unless directed to, are not going to write a report on it and create Brady material even if it’s on the record interview. They would hand the person over to the detective or supervisor. They would make the report.
So these cops might not have actually done any written reports depending on their department procedures and practices.
 

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Well number one that's not done all the time anymore due to body and in car cameras, they will write the actual speed on the citation in comments so their is no question . Huge difference and you know it, here the cop(s) are hiding their failing by trying not to tell "THE WHOLE TRUTH and nothing but the truth" they failed and DPD can be glad supervisors caught it before some attorney .
PS -I sure as hell think they should be punished but it’s not a lie( just based on what we know as of yet)

Thank you for updating me too. Things do change and sometimes rather quickly.
 
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