Corporate Tax Cut Boondoggle

Discussion in 'The Okie Corral' started by Bill Keith, Dec 8, 2019.

  1. Bill Keith

    Bill Keith

    Messages:
    4,895
    Likes Received:
    4,355
    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2006
    Location:
    Humble, TX
    Corporations are cashing in on the Trump Tax Reform as the national debt skyrockets. The stage was set on January 21, 2010 when the U S Supreme Court gave the absurd decision that that the First Amendment protects corporate speech. The case was Citizens United vs Federal Election Commission. This decision allowed corporations and the wealthy to flood the electoral process with political donations. By 2016, the richest 100th of 1% of Americans, 24,949 very wealthy people accounted for 40% of all campaign donations. Corporations gave presidential, Senate and House elections $3.4 Billion in donations. Big corporations and the super-wealthy gave these donations to the Republican party because the Republicans promised them a giant tax cut.

    The investments have paid off big time! GE contributed $20 million and will get back $16 billion. Pfizer Drug company contributed $16 million to the GOP and will reap an estimated $39 billion in 2022. Chevron donated $13 million and will receive $9 billion. The Koch brothers spent $20 million promoting the tax cut, which will save them $1 to $1.4 billion a year.

    Tax cuts have contributed to record corporate profits but the promise of "Trickle Down Economics" the GOP has kept pushing since president Ronald Reagan have failed to materialize. Companies have had a field day with their extra cash in stock buybacks and dividends. This has given the stock market a boost but left little left over for the average Joe.

    The "free market" has been taken over by corporate bailouts, corporate welfare, and crony capitalism. Despite the longest economic expansion in modern history, real wages have barely risen and wages aren't back to where they were before the 2008 financial crisis. Citizens United is a corporate front group, founded by a Washington lobbyist funded mainly by the Koch brothers and corporations.

    The Citizens United case needs to be revisited and rescinded. Corporate greed is toxic in how it has corrupted the electoral process for its own economic advantage. Middle class Americans and our children and grandchildren are saddled with the US economic debt. Corporate taxation is at an historic low. National debt is at historic highs, Wealthy individuals and corporations have gamed the political system for their own greed. Enough is enough!
     
  2. P99er

    P99er GT Ombudsman

    Messages:
    5,245
    Likes Received:
    7,421
    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2001
    Location:
    Doing what ombudsmen do
    Who doesn't game the system? Citizens do so by using tax deductions on things like mortgage interest and other legal deductions. Who in America pays more tax than they have to?

    Let he who is without gaming, cast the first stone.
     
    norton, The Machinist, Ed1110 and 3 others like this.

  3. Rellik

    Rellik Kwisatz Haderach in Training

    Messages:
    3,661
    Likes Received:
    7,880
    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2016
    Location:
    Cen Tex
    Spending, not tax cuts, drives deficets. Just like with people living beyond their means.
    Stop paying people to poop out piggies and not have to work.
    Sent the useless nations to their new digs in port-a-prince. Let nato play with themselves.
     
  4. mj9mm

    mj9mm

    Messages:
    9,013
    Likes Received:
    7,483
    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2011
    Location:
    WI, i want my Walker back...
    :honkie:Really? ...

    :cow:
     
    Bill Keith likes this.
  5. evlbruce

    evlbruce

    Messages:
    7,093
    Likes Received:
    3,314
    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2003
    Money is Power. It therefor not possible to get money out of politics.

    If you got a problem with a group you don't like using money to gain influence then you might want to consider pruning that branch of government.
     
    The Machinist likes this.
  6. 4896worker

    4896worker

    Messages:
    219
    Likes Received:
    494
    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2014
    My 401 and defined benefit retirement system loves it when cooperations do good
     
    wprebeck, OldDad, pgg00 and 5 others like this.
  7. Jonesee

    Jonesee

    Messages:
    7,356
    Likes Received:
    7,571
    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Trickle Down Economics-Laffer Curve has never worked in the real world.
     
  8. Jonesee

    Jonesee

    Messages:
    7,356
    Likes Received:
    7,571
    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    Does your defined benefit pension vary with the stock market?
     
  9. Dave514

    Dave514

    Messages:
    39,006
    Likes Received:
    35,403
    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2013
    Location:
    USSA
    I'm always amazed at what percentage of the people, who are interested in others tax debt, happen to pay zero federal income tax.
     
  10. P99er

    P99er GT Ombudsman

    Messages:
    5,245
    Likes Received:
    7,421
    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2001
    Location:
    Doing what ombudsmen do
    For those who get too caught up in democrat talking points, allow me to illustrate a point.

    Pretend that mean old GE didn't have tax loopholes to exploit, and all of a sudden, they were paying $50M in taxes every year. Who do you think they are going to pass that along to? The CEO, the CFO? No. The consumer. How much more will a microwave, refrigerator, or washing machine cost? You have to be an idiot not to know that.

    Make Wal-Mart or McDonalds pay more taxes, who foots the bill? Their consumers.

    How does anyone not know that?
     
    norton, surf n turf, wprebeck and 7 others like this.
  11. Jonesee

    Jonesee

    Messages:
    7,356
    Likes Received:
    7,571
    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    This is not correct.

    The tax reduction resulted in an increase in profits, not a reduction in consumer prices.

    Executives that have stock price incentives and who have stock options as a part of the compensation plan benefitted. Likewise, stockholders benefitted from the increasing stock price.
     
    Bill Keith likes this.
  12. Dave514

    Dave514

    Messages:
    39,006
    Likes Received:
    35,403
    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2013
    Location:
    USSA
    In the long run, the consumer will pay that tax debt. Corporate taxes are a tax on the consumer. If the Corporation's profits remain so dramatically high, they meet competition in the market and corrections occur.
    This is the case from the smallest flower shop all the way to Apple.
     
  13. P99er

    P99er GT Ombudsman

    Messages:
    5,245
    Likes Received:
    7,421
    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2001
    Location:
    Doing what ombudsmen do
    Bull****.
     
    pgg00 and RenoF250 like this.
  14. Jonesee

    Jonesee

    Messages:
    7,356
    Likes Received:
    7,571
    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    I'm not sure what part you disagree with.
    I suggest you do some research.
     
    Bill Keith likes this.
  15. Dave514

    Dave514

    Messages:
    39,006
    Likes Received:
    35,403
    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2013
    Location:
    USSA
    Again, it's profits in the short term but the long term...supply, demand, profit, competition...P99er is correct.
     
    pgg00 likes this.
  16. Jonesee

    Jonesee

    Messages:
    7,356
    Likes Received:
    7,571
    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2009
    You are supporting the Laffer Curve and in the real world, the Laffer Curve has consistently failed. I don't believe in the Laffer Curve theory.

    As Keynes said: "In the long run we are all dead".
     
    Bill Keith likes this.
  17. GlockPride

    GlockPride M&P

    Messages:
    5,388
    Likes Received:
    2,049
    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2006
    Location:
    Just OK
    And therein lies the PROBLEM, we do NOT have a democracy!!! Quit saying we do! We have a Constitutional Republic.
     
  18. BUG'S

    BUG'S

    Messages:
    976
    Likes Received:
    1,784
    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2011
    If your smart you will invest in those corporations and make money. Become a corporate stock owner.
     
  19. Dave514

    Dave514

    Messages:
    39,006
    Likes Received:
    35,403
    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2013
    Location:
    USSA
    I don't believe in the Laffer Curve either so you're wrong about what I'm supporting. You can't win by strawmanning me.

    My point is very simple in that, in the long run, ANY business passes ANY overhead cost onto consumers. And that the greater the profit, the more likely the business is to experience competition. Hence the free market system. A tax cut may mean increased profit in the short run but profits bring competition and lower prices.

    There is no Laffer Curve. There is simply a direct proportion.
     
  20. P99er

    P99er GT Ombudsman

    Messages:
    5,245
    Likes Received:
    7,421
    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2001
    Location:
    Doing what ombudsmen do
    I've worked for companies whose BOD set a goal of 15% year to year growth. When an operating unit didn't make the 15%, they cut staff, they cut hours, they limited raises, and they raised prices. What they didn't cut, was salaries for the executives or the number or executives. My current company cuts hours, but they keep adding management positions. Got to make those numbers.

    If McDonalds has their taxes increased, then so will Wendy's, Burger King, and the others. That means they will ALL have an increased tax burden, and can all raise their prices. If Wal-Mart has it's taxes go up, so will Target, so they'll both raise prices to offset the expense. They have to. And from the BOD directors viewpoint, they MUST make a certain percent of profit, or the stockholders won't get their dividends and might vote them all out.

    Major corporations are not going to be able to hire and retain people like Jack Welch or Bill George without a competitive compensation package. You are jealous of corporate executives, but they must not be too bad if they are willing to take pay cuts to offset taxes. But when times are good, they should make more. IOW, extra profit may benefit them, but additional liabilities will not come out of their bennies. That won't happen. I've seen them tell us how everyone has to give up something, but they don't. But I don't begrudge them that.

    Let me put it in terms you can better understand: Those evil senior executives of those evil corporations are not going to cut their own salary or benefits just because a bunch of pissant bureaucrats increase their tax burden.

    Increased tax burden is not going to come out of executive salary or benefits, but increased profit will go into executive and shareholder pockets.