Considering between Kahr PM40, S&W 340PD, or Glock 27

Discussion in 'General Glocking' started by JakFrost, Aug 25, 2005.

  1. JakFrost

    JakFrost

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    I'm trying to decide between these three firearms for concealed carry since I filed for a license just recently. I've done a lot of research about each model itself but I'm still unsure which one to pick from mostly because I don't exactly have any experience carrying.

    I'm mostly looking at IWB (in-waist band) carry as a primary way and optionally for pocket carry. I am not interested in Ankle Carry or OWB (out-of-waist band) carry since these methods do not seem very sensible in keeping a firearm concealed.

    So far I have three models in mind with the Kahr PM40 Micro Compact being as a top pick due to the very small size and weight and its availability in the .40 S&W caliber, that matches one of the other current firearm that I already own. (Nothing against 9mm but I'm trying to keep caliber types to a minimum.)

    The other models include the S&W 340PD AirLite J-frame Revolver in .357 Magnum and .38 Special and the Glock 27 Subcompact in .40 S&W. These last two choices are really in the Subcompact category that is larger than the Micro Compact of the Kahr PM40.

    I've read a number of past posts on this forum about issues with the Kahr PM9 and PM40 models but in all the issues it sounds like Kahr customer service took interest in resolving the issues and that most of the folks ended up keeping their pistols afterwards. So I'm hoping that in my case a little bit of "fluff and buff" treatment of the ramp and barrel and oiling of the right parts (including the ejector points) might deal with any feeding or extracting issues before they become problems. If I do have issues with the Kahr, I believe that I will be patient enough to deal with them and have them resolved.

    However, there are some things still on my mind.

    Since I am tall and built is the Kahr PM40 perhaps "too small" for me? (Too small for IWB carry, but too bulky for Pocket Carry.)

    Would a larger pistol be a better alternative for first time concealed carry in IWB? (Glock 27, or even larger 23, or something else?)

    Any advice would be appreciated.

    Micro:



    [​IMG]
    Kahr PM40 - .40 S&W


    Subcompact:


    [​IMG]
    Kahr P40 Convert - .40 S&W



    [​IMG]
    Glock 27 - .40 S&W



    [​IMG]
    Smith & Wesson 340PD - .357 Magnum, .38 Special
     
  2. baildoc

    baildoc Crime does pay

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    Any of the guns mentioned will feel "weightless" in an IWB holster. The S&W will fit large pockets and the PM40 will fit almost all pockets. I would suggest you shoot each if you have the opportunity as your decision may very well be based on your particular tollerance to recoil. With full house loads the S&W is a handful to say the least and the PM40 is also stout. The Glock is the largest and easiest to shoot. My experience with all three guns, YMMV.
     

  3. ericboo

    ericboo

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    I am picking up my PM9 today. My Sig 228 is probably the finest gun all around but I don't carry it off-duty because it is too big and thick. I tried a friend's G26, but after trying the PM9, there is no comparison in terms of size.

    I usually just carry my Sig OWB with a shirt untucked, but pocket and ankle are nice options to have.
     
  4. GlockFan9mm

    GlockFan9mm

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    I would not get the snub. It depends. If I wanted a real small gun I would go with the kahr. If i can carry something a little bigger get the G27. If i had to buy a kahr it would be the P40 or P9. The PM9 is to small for my taste.
     
  5. JKG

    JKG

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    I bought a PM9 as my first CCW. I think that the grip can be small for some people, but the PM40 maybe a little bigger. This may really be the key issue if you haven't handled one yet. For my body, I still have trouble concealing the PM9 IWB with a t-shirt. Must be the beer belly!

    I think that if I wanted strictly an IWB, I could have gone with a P9, since the PM9 doesn't conceal that good for me anyway. I think the bigger 7 round mag with the factory extension makes the total handle length similar in size to the P9 that's a 7 shot.

    What makes the difference is the ability to pocket carry with the short barrel/slide and the flush 6 round mag. This, to me, makes up for the poor concealability IWB on my frame (5'9" ,190#). I also looked at an Airlite with laser grips, but it wouldn't pocket carry for me.

    The PM guns are small, but they ain't tiny. Slim, straight body shapes maybe able to carry IWB better and other people have no problem concealing bigger guns. The beer belly definitely will conceal in a Mexican/belly carry, but I don't care for the direction the barrel points!

    I also carry open and the PM9 is so small that it doesn't attract much attention. It really doesn't even look like a gun unless you focus on it. I think its the tiny handle (with flush mag). I like having the flush mag for eventual pocket carry, and the long mag for a little more grip.

    I know you want the .40, but for some reason I remember reading on other sites that the .40 is hard to handle in the PM40. Also, *if* there were any feed problems or any structural failures, it was more likely to happen with the .40 than 9mm. I have zero experience with the PM40, but its worth considering or doing a search to see what you find. I have also read of people loving the PM40, so like anything else, its all about personal preference.
     
  6. AZ Traveler

    AZ Traveler

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    Consider the P40 Covert. It has many of the benefits of a P40 and PM40.

    The P40 Covert has the grip frame of the PM40 and the slide of the P40. It uses the same mags as the PM40, but has the single spring and simple recoil rod set up of the P40. The Slide is about 1/2 in. longer then the PM40. It does weigh slightly more then the PM40. It also has a longer sight radius then the PM40.

    The P40/P40 Covert slide has been around longer and appear to have fewer problems. Besides when using the extended mag you have the same grip feel as the P40.


    Check it out.
     
  7. JakFrost

    JakFrost

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    I completely forgot about the Kahr P40 Convert that AZ Traveler mentioned. This seems like a in-between pistol to the Kahr PM40 and the Glock 27. The differences that I see in it are mostly that it is almost as long as the Glock 27, a little more than 6-inches, but it is just as thin as the Kahr PM40 0.94-inches.

    Now, that's even harder for me to decide.

    Subcompact:


    [​IMG]
    Kahr P40 Convert - .40 S&W
     
  8. USDefender

    USDefender Lay Them Waste!

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    I own the all-metal covert. While I found that I really didn't have difficulty with the grip when firing, I still elected to put 'pierce grip' x-tentions on my mags. World-o-difference.

    I can highly recommend the 'Covert' design, although, carrying IWB as I do, I sometimes think about the fact that it would be a lot more comfortable (especially when sitting) were it a Micro Khar.

    My next purchase perhaps.
     
  9. Dr. J Frame

    Dr. J Frame LSWCHP +P

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    I've owned three S&W Airlites; two 340PD's & a 342PD
    I've owned two G26's(Same dimensions as the G27)

    I carry a Kahr PM9. I only have one of these but there's more in my future. It feels incredibely thin when carried IWB.
    All are fine choices for CC.
     
  10. AZ Traveler

    AZ Traveler

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    I owned a K40 Covert (All Steel) and now own a MK40. They don't carry any different. The only difference is that the Covert slide/barrel reached to the end/bottom of my holsters, and the MK40 stops about 1/2 in short.

    The holsters that I own are Don Hume IWB, Tucker Gunleather Coverup Plus, and a Fobus Paddle. I prefer the Tucker or Don Hume, the difference is that the Tucker is tuckable and the Don Hume is not.
     
  11. JakFrost

    JakFrost

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    Deciding between the PM40 Micro and the P40 Convert, I tend to stray towards the smaller pistot because the small size is pretty much the selling point for me. I'm thinking that if I wanted a larger pistol with a longer barrel and slide I might as well go for something else than a Kahr, such as the Glock 27 that I mentioned.

    My guess is that the Micro size pistol would fit a more specialized nitch because its size would allow it to be a very small IWB pistol or a little larger pocket carry pistol. It just seems like it would be more versatile this way instead of the P40 Convert which would be too long for pocket carry but would be just about right for IWB.

    One thing the P40 Convert has going for me is that for a short time I carried a SureFire L4 flashlight in my pocket but after about 4-weeks I decided that it was just too large and awkward to pocket carry any flashlight in a pocket. (It's now in my backpack all the time). The flashlight was printing very badly in the pocket and caused two pairs of pants to wear through where the edge of the flashlight would make a buldge on the pants rub on things.

    I have a feeling that constant pocket carry for a pistol will most likley be the same and wouldn't be practical for long time and constant carry. So now the main selling point for me that the Kahr PM40 Micro has in its tiny size is kinda questionable since I most likely will avoid pocket carry with it. So now that IWB would be a primary way to carry the P40 Convert starts to shine out, but at the same time so does the Glock 27 which I would be more familiar with since I already own a Glock 22. Except that the Glock 27 is a lot thicker 1.18 inches versus 0.94 for the PM40 Micro and P40 Convert.

    See the dilema there? Different pistols are optional for different methods of carry. Pocket = PM40, IWB = P40 Convert or Glock 27.

    Honestly, I would have to get two pistols now. One for no-excuses carry in IWB or pocket carry that would be the Kahr PM40 Micro, and another little larger pistol for IWB carry such as the Kahr P40 Convert or the Glock 27. But there is always the revolver... which I love the idea of because it's light, always goes bang, and I already have a S&W revolver that I love.

    Aaaaah!!!! Can't decide. Need to buy them all!

    Honestly though, the Kahr PM40 Micro does fit a very specific nitch in my view... it is small enough to pocket carry on top of everything else it can do. There is just something unique about having the ability to do this with this pistol that the other choices don't offer (not unless you wish to carry a brick in your pocket).

    There would always be the possibility of purchasing a larger pistol for IWB carry when desired if one already has a Micro compact, but it would be very hard to go the other way if one already had a Subcompact for IWB since it would be hard to justify another expense for a pistol that is just marginally smaller. It's always easier to upgrade than downgrade in my opinion and the self-justification doesn't have to be so difficult.
     
  12. AZ Traveler

    AZ Traveler

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    Michigun has reported in the past that the Coverts fit in his pocket better. The slightly longer barrel/slide moves the grip up where it is easier to get a grip on it in your pocket. In fact he has sold all of his PM9's in favor of the Covert. Michigun prefers 9mm over 40 S&W, but the same applies to the PM40 and the P40 Covert.

    Take this info as third hand as I only own Steel Kahr's. The weight of the Steel Kahr is greater but the dimensions are not significantly different.

    The difference between the P40 Covert and the PM40 is less then 1/2 in. P40 Covert barrel is 3.5 inches and the Barrel of the PM40 is 3.08 inches.

    I preferred my K40 Covert over my MK40. However my K40 Covert was replaced by Kahr with the MK40 because of a cracked frame on the Covert. The crack did not effect the operation of the firearm. The K40 Covert has been discontinued so I could not get another one as a replacement, and the MK40 was the closest thing available to the Covert.