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Discussion in 'Cop Talk' started by RussP, Oct 2, 2015.
Here is the Charlotte Observer article linked above.
Umm, I see some legitimate constitutional issues with that idea. Laudable but . . . .
We just do stay away orders from the area they commit crimes in. Most frequently a box around our downtown. It generally goes away when they are done with probation. Of course we have people on probation on 5 or more cases at any one time so it effectively becomes a permanent ban. Timmy the hippie hasn't seen downtown in decades.
Maybe could fly as conditions of probation, but I don't see it being constitutional as its own offense.
The city needs to have the Chief given a Psyche evaluation if he thinks that is going to survive a court challenge.
Ludicrous. May as well post "Be excellent to each other!" signs around the city. Why would criminals obey these zones?
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I agree with the posters above. We've enacted area restrictions against people who've committed certain crimes. But they were only requested by the PD/prosecutor, and had to be put in place by the judge as a part of the sentence. Otherwise, no way.
From the Charlotte Observer article linked above.
Respectfully, that's an obvious, "Well, duh," statement. If criminal members from a specific group are "excluded" from a crime-free zone, shouldn't that encourage law-abiding members to move into the safe zones?
Here is the ACLU's report on the Portland Exclusion Zones.
Another article with some citizen perspectives...
The piece closed with...
Its because they are panicking because as of Labor Day they were at the same number of homicides as last year. Even though that was a historic low.
And Charlotte has a phenominal trauma center where they have saved people that anywhere else would be a homicide.
Isn't it obvious? Under penalty of law!!!!
Northwest Portland: Old Town businesses, residents ask for help from city to deal with drug problems
The remainder of the article is worth reading.
I think the prostitution and drug zones are a good idea though. Especially for tourists, they'll know where to go.
ETA: OH, i see they're exclusion zones, not zoning ordinances, never mind...
Bad, bad boy... Okay, it was funny.
Interesting idea, which made me think of "escape from New York" which then made me think: "what if we had whole areas where people with certain criminal convictions could be banished" - basically like felon states. A modern version of Australia. Non-felons could go there, but the felons, or select types of felons could not leave. Non-felons entering would facilitate trade with them.
In a short time, the thug culture, drug culture, various types of organized crime, etc., would be concentrated there and the rest of the country would be virtually crime free. A problem we have had recently is liberals getting the idea that they could change the criminal class by integrating them into better neighborhoods, but all they have done is pull down the better neighborhoods - so lets do the opposite.
The other benefits would include eliminating the cost of incarceration and probation and parole supervision, if we banish criminals to the felon zone instead. Elimination or near-elimination of most welfare programs; lower health and property insurance costs; and lots more. All those sex offenders who can't find a place to live now? Not a problem.
On the flip side of that - the criminals would be happy to no longer have to spend their lives in prison, so everybody wins to some extent.
To a large extent, we're not so far from that in Detroit metro area now. Probably a lot of places where there's inner city ghettos. Right next to Detroit's East side (very bad area, even by Detroit standards) you have the various Grosse Pointes, some of the wealthiest, most crime free cities in Michigan. Isolated only by affluence. A few short miles north is Troy, one of the safest cities in the country also.
Only problem is poor older people who bought houses before those neighborhoods collapsed and can't afford to move out, they're trapped, and other poor people who can't afford to live anywhere but where criminals destroyed the desirability of neighborhoods and collapsed rent prices as a result.
Just have to force the crooks out to live in some designated neighborhoods, consolidate the remaining poor good folks so they aren't so spread out. There are already pockets of nice areas in Detroit, luck of the draw as to your neighbors. My parents house still in good neighborhood, houses well maintained. Literally two streets over, two short blocks, all the houses are burnt down, falling down, or completely gone. There may be one house per block someone is trying to rehab and live in.
If Constitutional problems could be worked out, it would work. It's exactly what people have been trying to do on their own when deciding where to buy a house. Avoid the bad areas. They just don't have an official boundary now.
Ironically, back when I grew up there, police, fire had residency rules, we had lots of police and fire living in the neighborhood because it was as close as you could get to suburbs without leaving the city. Kind of the opposite of what you proposed.
We already have zones like that in CA. To be honest in 90% of the area of this state I can be safe pretty much 24/7.
Now that other 10%....
Sounds about right for the entire nation (maybe 98% for the whole country). Had my German 17 year old nephew visiting my wife and me on Cape Cod. We live in a really nice, small, outer Cape town. There is no violence here. Really. You can walk any street, any time of the day or night, any time of the year, and you will not be bothered. Our crime, when we have any, is mostly alcohol (or drug) related, often involving a motor vehicle. We have the very rare burglary. Haven't had a homicide in town for over 100 years (and the last one was a domestic).
My point is, I tried to explain to my nephew that our little town was NOT like the entire United States. Different places have different issues. I know the young man went back to Germany with a skewed (positive) view of our nation. Not a bad thing, just not accurate.