CCW Insurance

Discussion in 'Carry Issues' started by unit1069, Jun 5, 2020.

  1. unit1069

    unit1069

    Messages:
    10,545
    Likes Received:
    3,080
    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2007
    Location:
    So. Central US
    Two days ago I mailed off my check to join one of the prominent CCW insurance groups. Although the chance of my ever having to draw, brandish, or even --- God forbid --- need to fire a gun in a potentially deadly encounter is small that chance has increased substantially in recent weeks. I won't name the insurance provider because I feel it's the individual's responsibility to research the various plans, but what finally got me off the dime was the discovery that while on the job several days ago a street protest was occurring just blocks from where my job took me. That protest turned violent only a short time later, but thankfully I was gone by then. I will say the locale is one of the most dangerous cities in the US.

    The insurance doesn't afford me complete peace of mind but it does add a good measure of comfort in our new, crazy world where the "progressive" media has decided the descriptive "unarmed" renders every perpetrator a victim, no matter what the circumstances. If the shopkeeper beaten within an inch of his life by the violent mob had resorted to shooting one or more of his attackers I have no doubt he'd be persecuted by local officials and condemned by the media because his attackers were "unarmed".

    Has anyone else decided to get CCW insurance because of recent events?
     
    n2g likes this.
  2. AbeFroman

    AbeFroman

    Messages:
    30
    Likes Received:
    28
    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2018
    I actually just came here to ask about ccw insurance but I see this thread. I’ve been thinking about getting it, but in my mind, it seems expensive. Of course if I had some kind of situation, and I had been paying for insurance and the legal support, it would be a lifesaver and In hindsight relatively cheap.
     
    n2g likes this.

  3. unit1069

    unit1069

    Messages:
    10,545
    Likes Received:
    3,080
    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2007
    Location:
    So. Central US
    That's what the catch was for me. I pay car insurance every year and hope I never need it. Having the legal process in order before-the-fact would surely mitigate the after-the-fact trauma of having to defend myself, to say nothing of the ongoing process if I faced a charge in the aftermath.

    Another thread requests information on criminal defense lawyers; my thoughts are it would surely help to have firearms legal experts already lined up beforehand. The incident I described that pushed me to act was in the area where a second incident resulted in the murder of a retired police captain checking on a friend's business. I used to think I could stay away from trouble but these days trouble has a way of finding us. I expect these troubles will continue right up to November.

    https://www.kmov.com/news/watch-sur...cle_67705e76-a53f-11ea-b8f2-477d6e0f8b6e.html

    https://www.kmov.com/news/4-st-loui...cle_d8af5b24-a494-11ea-879e-bfa4a029a5ac.html
     
    DocPoison likes this.
  4. B58

    B58

    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    8
    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2020
    I have been strongly considering getting a plan but haven't yet. I have been reading the fine print on a couple of different policies and I'm not sold on the wording yet, the "up to" limits have me concerned. For example, in an instance where there were multiple attackers would each be treated as a separate incident or would would it be considered a single occurrence?
     
    pairof44sp likes this.
  5. ottomatic

    ottomatic

    Messages:
    2,924
    Likes Received:
    2,086
    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2002
    Location:
    SW Tennessee
    To the OP:
    I know that I'm being picky, but there is a big difference between "persecuted" and "prosecuted", even though Police these days are both done to them.


    And yes, I think that some relevant "insurance" is not a bad idea, ESPECIALLY now.
     
  6. porschedog

    porschedog

    Messages:
    4,967
    Likes Received:
    7,792
    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2009
    I’m strongly considering This option, too
    I found a link that compares coverage options; I’ll post it shortly
     
  7. unit1069

    unit1069

    Messages:
    10,545
    Likes Received:
    3,080
    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2007
    Location:
    So. Central US
    I'm hoping my membership package arrives soon. My state now has a general right to carry, but I got my State CCW license before that was the law. We had hours of classroom time and more at the range where we had to demonstrate the ability to shoot both revolvers and semi-autos.

    The classroom covered a little of where one could legally carry and a lot of "don't think you can do this just because you now can CCW", backed up with court cases. I'm sure I've forgotten a lot about legal nuances and much more has been added since then with the ever-changing situations in different states. I'm hoping to brush up on the latest legal issues that I may have not learned of. The violent protests have made me jumpy about even carrying, as I have no desire to become a poster child for the "progressive" Left's many agendas.
     
  8. n2g

    n2g

    Messages:
    1,035
    Likes Received:
    2,801
    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2016
    Location:
    Georgia gal

    A year or two ago I got interested in this type of coverage, and I read the mice type on several of the more popular plans, and even emailed a few to ask a few questions. Do read the mice type--the devil is in the details. A lot of the available comparisons are done by those who sell the coverage, so you have to take some of them with a big grain of salt.

    I personally liked USCCA the best. If my understanding is correct, they pay up front, you don't have to pay them back win or lose, and they start paying from the first moment, not just after/if you are actually charged with a crime. They cover the use of any kind of weapon or none at all (hands, feet, etc.). They have a network of available lawyers (members can view them all on their website), but you don't have to use any of them. You can use any lawyer you choose. Family members are covered only inside your home, not away. About the only negative I saw is that I don't think they cover an appeal, if that came into play, although I'm not sure. This is from a couple of years ago.

    I have their cheapest plan, which is $13/month. I don't even carry most of the time (that may change due to the current climate, and when I stop staying home so much), but I do keep loaded guns in my home, and sometimes take one in the car with me. I enjoy their magazine and their website resources, so while it might seem silly to some, it's not a financial hardship and it's worth it to me.

    Do your own comparisons and pay attention to details; read the mice type and ask them if you're still not sure about something. Some details just aren't addressed in any of the ads.

    I'll just add one more thing, and that has to do with the "legal services" type of plan. These are plans offered by a group of attorneys or a cooperative that furnish their own legal services to you, so you must use those. The big negative for me is that THEY get to decide up front whether you were justified in using deadly force or not. If they don't think you were, they don't cover you; end of story. Unless that's changed recently, that's a total deal breaker for me.

    If anyone finds out any new info or changes contradictory to any of the above, please post them. I made my decision after I did a lot of digging, and I haven't reconsidered it since.

    These types of coverage are one of those "very low probability" but "very high stakes" things. The individual has to decide if it's worth it or not, and if so, which plan to get.
     
    tm255, DocPoison and RPK Clone like this.
  9. RPK Clone

    RPK Clone

    Messages:
    3,836
    Likes Received:
    14,128
    Joined:
    May 12, 2013
    Location:
    The Piedmont, SC
    I, too am looking at USCCA.
    I was thinking of going with the gold plan at $22/month.
    Can you, or maby someone else explain to me the civil defense protection?
    With the gold plan, they offer $500,000 in civil defense protection and 1 mil for the platinum plan. I'm assuming thats how much they will give of there is a civil suit field against you. Why wouldn't this be covered in full, I wonder?
    Also, is it worth it to get the 1 mil in coverage for the extra hundred bucks per year?
     
  10. n2g

    n2g

    Messages:
    1,035
    Likes Received:
    2,801
    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2016
    Location:
    Georgia gal

    I'm not an expert on any kind of insurance (or much of anything else!), but my understanding is that the stated limits are the maximum they'll pay under each plan for your civil suit defense and any judgment/damages awarded against you. I'd guess they don't have unlimited coverage because that would cause the premiums to be higher. ??

    In some states but not all, you may be immune from a civil suit filed by the person you had to shoot or injure if you are found to be legally justified by self defense. I don't know the details; I guess that might include a suit by the attacker's family members (if the person died) as well, but I'm not sure on that. Check the laws in your state. That might factor into your decision as to how much civil suit coverage you want.

    Otherwise, it's just a personal decision you have to make. Some places are more gun-friendly and have more legal protections for people who have to defend themselves against a violent criminal. I don't guess there's a way to know for certain what you might need ahead of time.

    Maybe someone with more knowledge or some actual experience will reply. Also, you can contact each organization you're considering and ask them questions about their coverage directly.

    That probably wasn't much help, but it's all I know.
     
    RPK Clone likes this.
  11. RPK Clone

    RPK Clone

    Messages:
    3,836
    Likes Received:
    14,128
    Joined:
    May 12, 2013
    Location:
    The Piedmont, SC
    I'll take that!
    Thanks for taking the time to respond
     
    n2g likes this.
  12. Themarinedoc

    Themarinedoc

    Messages:
    946
    Likes Received:
    702
    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2016
    Location:
    Midwest and Florida Gulf
    In St Louis, a retired police officer (St Louis city and former Chief at a local muni) was working a private security job at a Pawn Shop and was shot and killed by one of the rioters when he attempted to stop the assailant from entering and grabbing "free stuff" as was going on. Got very little press when compared to the death by a police officer of George Floyd, which was quickly an International event, blaming all Police for the action of one man.
     
    pAZ Ron and n2g like this.
  13. mmcbeat

    mmcbeat

    Messages:
    3,729
    Likes Received:
    5,999
    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2004
    Location:
    Texas
    I have good coverage at zero cost - my son is an attorney.

    Seriously, we have discussed it. If the need ever arises, I am to first call 911 then my son.
     
    Sgtthump and n2g like this.
  14. rcems2000

    rcems2000

    Messages:
    127
    Likes Received:
    158
    Joined:
    Feb 19, 2020
    Location:
    Greensboro N.C
    I purchased USCCA last week due to all the recent events. Should have had ccw insurance before. I went with Elite membership. I figure if u every need it that it will pay for its self. I like all the videos and training you get with elite. Plus the extra civil ,bond money.

    I looked at several different ccw insurance and this one suited us. IM not saying they are better than another. You just got to read and call and ask them questions.

    Saturday evening I had my vehicle tinted and the wife took me to get it eith out six month old and we came up to major intersection and BLM were laying in road standing with signs. We were able to get heck out of dodge. My wife didn't give me anymore grief for the purchase. I'm for peaceful protest just not looting, property damage, and shutting down major roads / interstates.
     
    n2g likes this.
  15. unit1069

    unit1069

    Messages:
    10,545
    Likes Received:
    3,080
    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2007
    Location:
    So. Central US
    That was the incident I referred to, and in another area in STL County where I was another protest got out of hand. My job takes me all over the place, hundreds of miles one-way on a moment's notice, even up into Illinois where those of us who CCW have to jump through hoops before we cross state lines. I try to stay abreast of current law via handgunlawus.com but in my OP things have gotten to the point where having a legal backstop in place seems like a good idea.

    The murdered STL retired police officer was a Captain, and an African-American to boot. Needless to say there hasn't been a lot of coverage in the national media about his "life mattering" as you point out.

    (I'll have more to say about this once I've finished reading, viewing, and digesting all the information I've received.)
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2020
  16. 1canvas

    1canvas

    Messages:
    5,008
    Likes Received:
    1,552
    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2008
    Location:
    The Great State of Ohio
    Do a little research and you will find it only makes sense to have something if you carry a gun, especially in this political environment.
    I have been thinking also about supplementing my current plan.
     
  17. SrFox

    SrFox

    Messages:
    12
    Likes Received:
    12
    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2020
    I have US Lawshield for both me and my wife. I hope we never need it.
     
    PieceBwithU likes this.
  18. pairof44sp

    pairof44sp

    Messages:
    247
    Likes Received:
    241
    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2020
    I am looking into CCW plans to help out some friends. There is huge variation, and most of the plans I've examined have huge problems.

    I'm on the verge of hiring an attorney to review these plans, because as a layman it's impossible to do a competent review.

    My friends believe that you don't get charged in a self-defense shooting. My experience (23 year in criminal defense) is that you DO get charged, and that all you have is the oppotunity to do your best at trial. And the burden of proof will be on you, as self-defense is an affirmative defense. Technically speaking, the prosecutor will not be required even to put on a case, as self-defense necessarily presupposes you admitting that you shot the guy.

    A good lawyer in such a case charges $100K - 500K, btw. $100K being the extreme cheap end.
     
  19. 1canvas

    1canvas

    Messages:
    5,008
    Likes Received:
    1,552
    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2008
    Location:
    The Great State of Ohio
    ^^^^^ As a layman with 23 years in criminal defense:dunno:.
    It’s not that hard to compare plans it just takes a bit of research because the info is out there. You can start by checking out the book “The Law of Self Defense” by Andrew F. Branco.
     
  20. pairof44sp

    pairof44sp

    Messages:
    247
    Likes Received:
    241
    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2020
    "The Law of Self Defense" is irrelevant to the issue under discussion. Criminal law per se is irrelevant. For the "Law of Self Defense" even to come into play, you need an attorney and a venue.

    The issue is what CCW insurance plan, if any, will get you that representation and protect your assets from judgment.

    Comparing plans means canvassing attorneys to see whether they are willing to accept the terms of payment under the contract. If you get charged criminally and a prospective attorney says, "Great. Wire $100K to my bank account and feel free to go after the CCW insurance company to get your money back," you'll discover what it is you actually get for your years of $30 a month.

    I've read several of the agreements, including ones mentioned in this thread, and they do not commit the insurance company to provide you with adequate representation. In fact, they are not even insurance companies, and as such are unregulated. In some cases, you'd be better off taking your chances with a public defender.

    I'm doing this to help ccw'ers, the smart alecks among whom ("layman?") may well find themselves going down with an "L" on the end of their sentence.