CCW in a no CCW church

Discussion in 'Carry Issues' started by SCmasterblaster, Aug 21, 2015.

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  1. SCmasterblaster

    SCmasterblaster G17 carrier since 1989 Millennium Member

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    With the likelyhood of church shootings these days, my church has instituted a non-written (no signs), no-gun policy. They said that they told me, but I don't remember. So I am going to CCW my G17 there from now on. The only way that the G17 will ever be seen is when I shoot someone who has already open-fired. I won't be breaking any law, will I?
     
  2. MO Fugga

    MO Fugga Malt Liqra® Lifetime Member

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    You don't know the laws? Whoa....
     

  3. SCmasterblaster

    SCmasterblaster G17 carrier since 1989 Millennium Member

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    Whoa what? There are no signs up.
     
  4. Big1

    Big1

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    Well, in some state it's against the law,along you have to get permission from the pastor or both so check your laws in your state and see what can you do.
     
  5. SCmasterblaster

    SCmasterblaster G17 carrier since 1989 Millennium Member

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    It is definitely NOT against the law here in VT.
     
  6. legion3

    legion3

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    Private property owners can ban weapons. So if the church has such a policy, even if unwritten, and you are aware of that policy (and in some cases, even if your not), and you violate it, you could face legal sanctions.

    That said, if you wish to ignore or don't believe that you will face possible consequences, then why ask here, just go ahead and pack in church.

    Private property laws apply in Vermont, even if you don't need a permit to carry concealed.

    Unless you can show a statute that specifically exempts a private property owner or a church etc...

    Are you " allowed" to pack everywhere in Vermont? Schools, Courthouses, Jails...

    If not then clearly there are some restrictions and the Church may be fully able to say NO.
     
  7. Mas Ayoob

    Mas Ayoob KoolAidAntidote Moderator

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    SC, it actually is against the law. While you may have forgotten it, you've mentioned your church's no-gun policy in the past. The crime involved is Trespass After Warning.

    Time to either leave the gun at home, or change houses of worship to one with a different policy.
     
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  8. legion3

    legion3

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    Here is the Vermont law

    Title 13 Chapter 81 § 3705. Unlawful Trespass (a) A person shall be imprisoned for not more than three months or fined not more than $500.00, or both, if, without legal authority or the consent of the person in lawful possession, he or she enters or remains on any land or in any place as to which notice against trespass is given by: (1) Actual communication by the person in lawful possession or his or her agent or by a law enforcement officer acting on behalf of such person or his or her agent; or (2) Signs or placards so designed and situated as to give reasonable notice.

    They say they told you, is actual communication.

    You have made it clear here that you know it is not allowed.

    Signs are not required.

    You claiming not to remember being told is not a legal defense.

    Looks like a violation of the law to me.
     
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  9. GeorgiaGlocker

    GeorgiaGlocker Philippians 4: 6-7

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    In GA you may carry in a church but must have permission of the church.
     
  10. Mas Ayoob

    Mas Ayoob KoolAidAntidote Moderator

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    Fellas, since GT owner Eric wants GATE to be a "one questioner, one answer" express lane sort of thing, it might be time to move the discussion over to Carry Issues.

    Thanks,
    Mas
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 22, 2015
  11. Anomander

    Anomander

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    I am confused. Your church realizes that the chance of a church shooting is so slim that they have written a no-guns policy?
    Sounds redundant.
     
  12. legion3

    legion3

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    Except my answer actually has the exact statute posted. :supergrin:
     
  13. legion3

    legion3

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    I'm sorry "had" the exact statute. :whistling:
     
  14. legion3

    legion3

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    No more censorship or one stop shopping I see. :af:

    So the statute is back...:noevil:

    :supergrin:
     
  15. Stevekozak

    Stevekozak Stepping down to the gin palace

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    I think it is between you and God. I personally would not attend a church that did not value my life enough toallow me to defend myself, and dont think God would want that for me either.
     
  16. legion3

    legion3

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    Even in the valley of death "thy rod and thy staff" they comfort me.
     
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  17. SCmasterblaster

    SCmasterblaster G17 carrier since 1989 Millennium Member

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    My church has NOT written a no gun policy.
     
  18. RussP

    RussP Super Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    It was deleted in the GATE - Self Defense Forum because of a posting policy violation. Posts in threads there are limited to the OP and Mas Ayoob. Posts made by other members are being deleted.

    The Moderation Filter for GATE forums is not functioning at this time. We are looking forward to that returning.

    At Mas' suggestion, I moved the thread to Carry Issues and reinstated all deleted posts. Yours was not the only one.

    Hope that help...
     
  19. GeorgiaGlocker

    GeorgiaGlocker Philippians 4: 6-7

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    Guess I wasn't paying attention. I thought this post was in carry issues. Sorry.
     
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  20. NC Bullseye

    NC Bullseye

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    Just remember, in some states a sign isn't the only way to prohibit legal carry. Some states say that a "statement by the person in legal possession or control of the premises" which could be a verbal notice also carries the weight of law.

    As to the "only way that the G17 will ever be seen is when I shoot someone" statement, you forget about all those instances of hugs, having to aid someone stand or get up after a fall, the times asked to help move something, etc that leads to most concealed carriers being detected. Things like this happen in far greater numbers than the need for a weapon used for defense of a deadly threat.

    If you feel that you judgment on what is needed in a house of worship is more important that the ones running that house maybe you could find a new one where your views are held by the majority.
     
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