[MartinRiggs1987]

Has the Gen 4 experiment been a complete bust? I'm looking more at Glock Inc's motives and motivations, as well as the final product. Was the Gen 4 ready for public consumption in 2010? Why or Why not?

I have been watching and reading Glock Talk, and several other places since the beginning of G4. After two years, I've come to the conclusion Glock's new management thought a more cheaply made product would make the backend more lucrative.

They are now trying and succeeding at turning public opinion around. But the legacy of this thing can not be underestimated. Glock 9mms were slam-dunk buys before. And now, it's more he said/she said. 3,000 flawless rounds versus a FTF bounty.

1: How much damage has this done to Glock's rep and no-fear purchasing of Glock products, G4 and even more recently G3 19's with very familiar problems. One can come back and say Gen 3 had this, or Gen 2 had that. But the scale and the Energizer bunny nature of this thing is indicative of a problem greater than occasional QC lapses.

2. Will Glock be able to recover from this 5 years from now? Serious question. I'm seeking out pre-2011 Gen 3's, due to rising questions and complaints myself. I bought Glocks because they were "Glock Perfection." Out-of-date parts, metal injection, and a grey finish prone to scratching does not raise one's hope (Note: The Grey Finish is easier to hold onto, but that's why they make grip handles).

 

[Turbo810]

I have no fear buying Glock. Gen4 or otherwise. The fact that they are 100% taking care of the problem goes a long way for keeping their reputation.

So I don't think it will he business as usual before you know it.

 

[MartinRiggs1987]

I have no fear buying Glock. Gen4 or otherwise. The fact that they are 100% taking care of the problem goes a long way for keeping their reputation.

So I don't think it will he business as usual before you know it.

Intent and cleaning up the mess is one thing. 100% taking care of it, would be mean all models have been repaired and fixed? And no one picking up a Glock Gen 4 now, would have that problem... Is that true?

My question to Gaston's heirs is. Why go cheap to begin with? Look at what all the cost cutting has cost you. And frankly, it will take longer than months to get to 100%. I weigh my purchasing carefully. I bought Glocks because they were sure bets. Not for 2 years or so, from now, once everyone has sent their models in. And all existing product has the proper parts and QA, would I feel comfortable even considering buying a 2011 or later Glock. I'm not the only one.

 

[guinessman]

I have a Gen 4 G17 that will need the new extractor and ejector. Glock sent me the new and improved 0-2-4 RSA and my gun still dribbled WWB. It still eats +P, Nato, and 147 grain loads just fine, but the gun is still having erractic ejection issues. When I get around to it the gun will be sent to Glock for the new ejector and extractor.

It sounds like Glock has finally fixed the issues of the Gen 4 9mm's with the new parts. The ergonomics of the Gen 4 are awesome, and I can't wait to have the "Glock" reliability from my Gen 4 that we have come to accept after all these years.

 

[DWARREN123]

I believe it has hurt their rep and has helped others such as M&P's and XD's. I would like to see Glock keep the back strap and ambi mag release and go back to Gen3 on everything else.
Just my thoughts. :supergrin:

 

[Steve in Az]

Given European cultures' hate for change/practicality--I'm really surprised that Glock messed with success on these Gen 4's. I can understand the improved/customizable grip, but to mess with RGR's, trigger bars, and trigger assembly/connector angles?

Foolish.

 

[MartinRiggs1987]

Given European cultures' hate for change/practicality--I'm really surprised that Glock messed with success on these Gen 4's. I can understand the improved/customizable grip, but to mess with RGR's, trigger bars, and trigger assembly/connector angles?

Foolish.

Agreed, it blurred their market niche, and more importantly, their sense of dominance over the semi-auto market. They didn't need to answer the M&P, by making a Glock as variable as a M&P. And the consequence of their tinkering, did just that. If I want something more complex and prone to variability, I'd buy an M&P or XD. Thanks but no thanks. Especially, when you're going cheap (with production) while doing it.

 

[bac1023]

It has definitely hurt their reputation, no matter how the fanboys want to spin it.

Its totally inexcusable, especially with all the competition Glock faces these days. I would have expected better.

 

[tonyparson]

It has definitely hurt their reputation, no matter how the fanboys want to spin it.

Its totally inexcusable, especially with all the competition Glock faces these days. I would have expected better.

If its hurt their reputation you sure cant tell it around here. The 4 gun shops within driving range of me cant keep Glocks in stock. They sell them as fast as they can get them in from Glock. :dunno:

 

[cowboy1964]

How does the Gen 4 redesign increase Glock's profits on a per-unit basis? Other than maybe a MIM extractor where there was not one before. I doubt the new spring is cheaper than the old one. Plus now you have backstraps, which increases cost.

 

[todd_g]

With the number of NIB or used Gen 3's on the market that have no issues to speak of, I can tell you I have no problem holding out until Glock has cleaned up their design flaws, my Gen 3 23 and 27 work just fine.

 

[Cruiser1]

I realize this a Glock hate thread for some, but my Gen 4 G27 runs like a Swiss (Austrian) watch. Over 2000 rounds thru it and it goes bang everytime I pull the trigger.

 

[hddave]

You've raised some serious questions and i'm contemplating more gen4 purchases. Was looking at amother G19gen4. Buut was at a local gun show last weekend and came across a G19gen2 LNIB.It took the gen4 right off my mind.I truly think only time will tell the extent of the damage to the brand. I still believe they've got some work to do.

 

[.45Super-Man]

It has definitely hurt their reputation, no matter how the fanboys want to spin it.

Its totally inexcusable, especially with all the competition Glock faces these days. I would have expected better.

Agreed. Nothing changes the fact that the "gen4" wasnt tested properly, prior to release. I question why they would opt to mfgr a more costly recoil spring/guiderod, when they're still to tight to offer steel sights as standard? Early on, there was the rumor that the polymer being used in the gen4 frame isnt the same "polymer 2" that had always been used prior. Perhaps the original formula was more costly to mfgr and becoming obsolete and Glock got a great price on a cheaper, more modern material? And perhaps, the new stuff doesnt take impact quite as well, so the two pc guiderod had nothing to do with the perceived recoil to the shooter and everything to do with lessening the impact to the new, more fragile frame material? Two pc guiderods are far from "new", so then why would Glock opt to offer a more expensive 2 pc affair this late in the game, when they originally phased out the original steel guiderod, due to cost? Glock has a track record of lowering production costs, not increasing production costs for "user comfort". I'd say the gen4 is cheaper in ways that arent nearly as obvious.

 

[Steve in Az]

I realize this a Glock hate thread for some, but my Gen 4 G27 runs like a Swiss (Austrian) watch. Over 2000 rounds thru it and it goes bang everytime I pull the trigger.

Not a "hate" thread at all, just the truth mixed in with some major frustration. The numbers don't lie, many (not all) gen 4's have issues. I'm a Glock owner for 22 years, but you couldn't give me a gen4 right now. A defensive pistol has to inspire confidence, or it's worthless---right/wrong or otherwise, I personally have NO confidence in the Gen4. That's why my purchase 2 weeks ago was a gen 3 G26.

I love Rugers too, but when they released that abomination of a .22 pistol, the "new" MkIII, I was seriously disappointed--as were many other Ruger loyalist. I DID end up buying one, but removed the LCI, got rid of the magazine disconnect, and put mkII sear/hammer parts in it. If I would have found a decent MkII used, I'd a bought that first. Again, what was wrong with the MkII? Oh, that's right...IT WORKED...FOR OVER 25 years!

BUSINESS 101 FOR ALL YOU HIGH-DOLLAR "EXECS" OUT THERE....YOU DON'T MESS WITH SUCCESS.

 

[ron59]

I realize this a Glock hate thread for some, but my Gen 4 G27 runs like a Swiss (Austrian) watch. Over 2000 rounds thru it and it goes bang everytime I pull the trigger.

Most of the issues relate to the recoil assembly, which did not change not the subcompacts (27/26). MOST of the complaints I was reading about dealt with the G19 specifically. The stronger recoil spring change is what caused a lot of the problems.

 

[SCC]

Agreed. Nothing changes the fact that the "gen4" want tested properly, prior to release. I question why they would opt to mfgr a more costly recoil spring/guiderod, when they're still to tight to offer steel sights as standard? Early on, there was the rumor that the polymer being used in the gen4 frame isnt the same "polymer 2" that had always been used prior. Perhaps the original formula was more costly to mfgr and becoming obsolete and Glock got a great price on a cheaper, more modern material? And perhaps, the new stuff doesnt take impact quite as well, so the two pc guiderod had nothing to do with the perceived recoil to the shooter and everything to do with lessening the impact to the new, more fragile frame material? Two pc guiderods are far from "new", so then why would Glock opt to offer a more expensive 2 pc affair this late in the game, when they originally phased out the original steel guiderod, due to cost? Glock has a track record of lowering production costs, not increasing production costs for "user comfort". I'd say the gen4 is cheaper in ways that arent nearly as obvious.

Glock has never used a all steel guiderod ... :whistling:

 

[proguide]

The other gen's had issues as well. Looooong before EVERYONE logged into forums to compound every hiccup. The internet does a lot of damage

 

[bac1023]

The other gen's had issues as well. Looooong before EVERYONE logged into forums to compound every hiccup. The internet does a lot of damage

Any issues the other gens had were not nearly as pronounced.

 

[Glock40man]

Any issues the other gens had were not nearly as pronounced.

Yup, and that is the problem.

ETA: I bought my first Glock nine years ago was because, of their reputation for being one of the most, if not the most reliable pistols in the world.