Anyone familiar with the cold start "death rattle" on their vehicle?

Discussion in 'The Okie Corral' started by BSA70, Sep 6, 2018.

  1. BSA70

    BSA70

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    I have a 2007 Toyota Highlander, 120k miles. It has started about a 5 sec rattle on start up in the morning. Does not do it throughout the day.

    Done a ton of reading. Seems like the cam gears are getting oil starved over night. This is a major fix.

    Pretty mad. I bought this Toyota on the reputation of "yeah, drove it 300k miles and only put gas in it and changed the oil". I have seen where this may cost $3k-4K to fix. Going to start calling around.

    Anyone with experience with this?
     
  2. Walk Soft

    Walk Soft

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    My sister has a Corolla that has done that for Five or Six years. No problems otherwise. If it were mine I’d get rid of it, but it doesn’t bother her.
     

  3. WeeWilly

    WeeWilly

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    Not with a Toyota.

    My 2007 GMC Yukon seemed to develop a miss at about 95K miles. I figured maybe recommended 100K interval on spark plug changes was well thought out.

    I took it in and the first report was the plugs in a few cylinders were oil fouled. Turns out GMC had an issue with rings in the small block V8's in past years. As the engine was less than 100K GMC kicked in a big chunk and I had a rebuilt engine for just over $2K. The GMC area service guy said if it had been 101K, I would have been on my own cost wise, quite a few more $K.

    Even if I had to bear it myself, along with the new transmission and transfer case work I had to endure in the first 100k miles, it is still a lot cheaper than buying new. On top if that, I don't need to have the seat modified for my back each time I get a new one.. ;)

    I am a dyed in the wool fix it versus buy new guy when I have a car I like.
     
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  4. LEO/Dad

    LEO/Dad Navy Veteran

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    Friend was just telling me about cold start noises in his two year old Hyundai Santa Fe. He took into dealer, drive train still under warranty. They had him leave it over night so they could here. Dealer called their company tech service, they told them to drop the oil pan and inspect. They found metal shavings in pan. Hyundai installed new engine, no explanation where the metal shavings were coming from. In our old Ford Fairmont, six, the valve lifters would drain down overnight, then would rattle in the morning until they pumped up.
     
  5. UncleDave

    UncleDave

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    I had a Ford that did that when cold. Otherwise a terrific car. Apparently it was related to piston-slap in a cold engine when clearances are at the loose end of tolerance, but it went away quickly and I ran the car to 130k miles with no trouble whatsoever. If it continues when warm then you may have a problem.
     
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  6. Z71bill

    Z71bill

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    I had a 1999 Chevy Silverado that had the cold start knock / piston slap - using synthetic oil helped for a typical over night / start up in the morning. But when it sat for a couple days the noise was still there.

    The noise stayed consistent / never got worse - it was like

    Clack, clack - click click click click


    My 1986.5 Nissan developed a cold start knock around 100K miles - was getting progressively worse -

    I am talking about a little clatter - at start up - and over time the clatter would last for a few miles - then it would clatter all the time - I figured the engine was going to crater -

    I sold it at 115K and the guy that bought it put 50K more on it before he sold it.

    It is annoying as hell to hear this when you start up your vehicle -but I doubt it is doing much damage -
     
  7. powernoodle

    powernoodle

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    BSA, are you sure its an engine noise and not something like the shield on the cat converter rattling?
     
  8. Bourne911

    Bourne911

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    +1
    [​IMG]
     
  9. The_Dan

    The_Dan The underscore is silent

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    Lucas oil stabilizer. Change oil and replace a quart with it.
     
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  10. sombunya

    sombunya Use it up, throw it away

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    That’s an interesting font tweak.
     
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  11. LEO/Dad

    LEO/Dad Navy Veteran

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    In the 60's guys would use STP. The stuff had the consistency of molasses. You couldn't use it in the winter, because the 6 volt cars then wouldn't start.
     
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  12. sombunya

    sombunya Use it up, throw it away

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    I have heard rattles when I change oil and it takes a moment for oil to pump up. Not on all cars though. My Expedition with 120k doesn’t make any noise before the oil pressure hits. Other cars I’ve had did rattle pretty loud.

    I say drive it and don’t worry.
     
  13. The_Dan

    The_Dan The underscore is silent

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    Thick molasses! Although the Lucas is available in synthetic and isn’t thick at all. My last high mile vehicle was running 2 quarts of it at all times and kept it happy.

    My more extreme suggestion is to flush and drain the oil, replace with ATF, drive 100 miles, then flush and change with the oil/Lucas mix! ATF cleans the you know what out of an engine!
     
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  14. LEO/Dad

    LEO/Dad Navy Veteran

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    I remember the ole timers talking about adding ATF to regular oil changes. Related; The 78 Ford Fairmont I talked about previously, 6 banger. Wife went out to start one morning, in the garage. She came in the house and told me the engine was blowing up. I went out and started, and it was banging terrible. I called my mechanic friend, he sent his tow truck, towed to shop. He called that afternoon and said our car was ready...! Wife took me out there, he said a piece of carbon came loose in the combustion chamber and was banging. They just put some water in a squeeze catsup bottle, and squirt in carb while running, carbon dissolved. Never had this problem again. Wife did a lot of city driving.
     
    Last edited: Sep 6, 2018
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  15. Dynactus

    Dynactus The wind serenades a purified man.

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    I'd let good mechanic for Toyotas take a look at it. Usually expect way more miles from a Toyota engine. I'd try to stay away from the dealership though.
     
  16. Adjuster

    Adjuster

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    Two examples.

    Ford Explorer Sport Trac. The infamous Ford Exploder engine it was the plastic 'timing chain cassettes' they call them. The plastic disintegrates inside the engine around 70,000 miles causing the timing chain to be loose and flap around beating on the inside of the engine.

    Kia engines but this one is a simple fix. Some people like my father for instance did not realize with the engine top mounted oil filter there are two orings that need to be replaced at every oil change. The oring that goes on the filter and an oring that goes onto the filter carrier that the filter slips into. The carrier oring prevents the oil from draining out of the upside down oil filter when the engine is not running. If you don't replace this oring your engine will sound like a death trap every morning at first startup until it builds oil pressure.


    I also currently drive a brand new Nissan Rogue that rattles at first startup but Nissan has told me its normal and the engine is designed that way. Again something about it has to build up oil pressure.



    /
     
  17. BSA70

    BSA70

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    Talked to the towns foreign car mechanic today. This is a very common problem in these engines. There are plastic guides around the timing chain that has either worn or broke. The chain is slapping the cover due to the clearance.

    Anyway, he is going to listen too it next week and if that is the problem. close to a $2k fix. He said you had to take it apart.

    If that will fix the problem that highlander will be worth it. Really like it and don't like the price of the new or used prices on them.
     
  18. Schaffer

    Schaffer

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    Toyota's have just as many problems as most other vehicles.
     
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  19. pgg00

    pgg00

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    We even use ATF to clean the fuel injector pump
     
  20. shadowgunner9

    shadowgunner9 This used to be AMERICA........

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    My 25 yr old BMW does this very loudly after sitting a long time, but oil pressure builds quickly and it stops. My 4 year old F150 EcoBoost does this also; same scenario. No issues. I am not afraid.
    YouTube is your friend. Seek videos on this issue and learn more.
    I once replaced all the timing components on my 2000 Chevy Tracker, er, Suzuki, and it came back 6 months later. I was too tired to do it all again.
    It usually means nothing, but some engines, as my Eco Boost, may get worse until the cam phasers are replaced. It all works on oil pressure, and clean oil is a MUST.