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Better yet, why was a backdoor open?
That is the big question. The school system sounds like it had all the right things in place.

My other question is why no one put a mental hold on the suspect for what he had been doing. That would have prevented him from buying a gun had it been entered in the system.
 

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Discussion Starter · #24 ·
Can’t get the reply button to work again

I’ll willing to bet that’s the door the SRO went out to confront the shooter outside the school . He did not exchange fire with the gunman until he entered the school . Then exchanged fire that pinned the gunman to one classroom. That’s when the gunman opened fired on the students.
I do not know why the teacher didn’t have the door locked. Maybe it couldn’t lock.

“Somehow, Ramos was able to get inside the school as the officer “followed him in immediately” and then gunfire was exchanged, McCraw said”

 

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I would say that on a national level, the singular mission of the SRO must be the same as a Federal Air Marshal.

I just watched Lawrence Jones interview the Border Patrol Chief Patrol Agent (Raul Ortiz). The BP in South Texas has always had a special relationship with the communities where they operate. That became really evident for me when I went through the Border Patrol Academy with most of my classmates being from “the valley.” Great people, even when they got routed to work in Southern California where none of us were really appreciated - tolerated at best. BORTAC has had a long rich history in its own right, including being part of the DEA cocaine lab interdiction operations in Bolivia in the late 80s - early 90s. They have stayed good at what they do throughout their existence.

Until we figure what we’ve really done to bring tragedies like this down upon us (See TX Lt. Governor’s messages), we need to do away with the gun free zone ordinances. We need to remove LEOSA restrictions and encourage retired LE to continue to train and stay current on the emergency response tactics emplowed by the first responders in the communities we reside. We need to figure out how to deal with mental health issues thst lead to this as well as how to stop imminent threats before they rise to these levels without destroying our civil rights.

May the Spirit of God continue to comfort and strengthen the people of Uvalde and everyone else effected by this tragedy.
 

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1. Democrats are not looking to solve the problem. They are looking to disarm the population
2. security is "inconvenient". You know, it's such a hassle to request entry, get buzzed in. C'mon, I'm in a hurry and need to get to work! And ya know, what are the chances of something bad really happening?

Memory fades quickly. This is why history repeats itself.

And let's not forget which party was pushing to remove SRO's from schools coz they are "racist".
 

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SRO was at Parkland too, it may have hurt rather than helped. If Coral Springs hadn’t arrived and handled their business…

SRO will not be where the shooter starts most of the time.

Randy


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I do hope this is one of those premature reports which gets later debunked. One source is claiming that it took 40 minutes to an hour after the murder engaged the SRO before he, himself was engaged and killed......
Onlookers urged police to charge into Texas school
Believe that’s true, but he had barricaded himself in the classroom and I assume not actively shooting anyone. At that point it’s a hostage situation, he may resume shooting if you try to break in, so probably trying to talk him out as long as he wasn’t shooting.

If you’re not sure how secure the door is, how long it’ll take to get in, and he’s stopped shooting, makes sense to hold.

Randy


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Lots of questions. The timeline looks like about 1.5 hours from first shots to suspect in custody and the guy that took him down was not there at the start.

 

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Believe that’s true, but he had barricaded himself in the classroom and I assume not actively shooting anyone. At that point it’s a hostage situation, he may resume shooting if you try to break in, so probably trying to talk him out as long as he wasn’t shooting.

If you’re not sure how secure the door is, how long it’ll take to get in, and he’s stopped shooting, makes sense to hold.

Randy


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Bad part about a hostage situation is that anyone he shot previously is bleeding out.

Maybe we should reevaluate the procedures for school shooter response.
 

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While I haven’t been employed in a capacity that would likely put me in a position to be one of the first LEOs on the scene for quite a while, I have tried to keep somewhat abreast of general changes in response tactics. The biggest was several years ago after a tragedy was that the first on the scene try to form up a team with what they had and enter. That was in response to policies requiring SWAT to handle entries. I don’t know what was really going on down in Uvalde, or what the policies were, but it sounds like a team was formed with who was available on the scene at the time. Also, if the gun fire is suddenly silent, no one inside to call out the killer’s location, and the building square footage is large, the team may have to search. And of course there’s no cookie cutter active killer template, these situations, while having some commonality, are also evolving. Individual skills, primarily being able to communicate, move tactically as an individual responder or as a team, and being able to consistently shoot accurately are still highly critical - probably the three most important beyond the individual commitment to enter in the first place with just what you’ve got.
 

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Sheriffs/police chiefs - and by extensions their communities - have to be willing to spend more on training. Officers absolutely cannot be proficient at dynamic entry, gunfighting, and hostage/victim rescue without proper (valid, current tactics taught be SMEs), frequent training and practice. If they want their patrol officers to aggress and stop an active shooter such as in a school, they absolutely have to do more. Good training costs time and money.

With low staffing, training time is more precious than ever. Regulatory agencies like POST need to eliminate mandatory training that isn’t there to win fights and solve crimes. Pretty much if it doesn’t require a safety briefing and a first aid kit on site, then it isn’t worth cutting a chunk of time out for.

Pony up.
 

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Texas has a training agency that goes all over the state teaching response to situations just like this. It's free. The prefer to teach different agencies together. They want everyone on the same page. If it lasted 45 minutes or more, their teachings weren't followed. Could be some valid reasons for that. I read that the door was locked and they couldn't breach it and had to find a janitor the get a key. I don't know, there are several conflicting reports out there.
Sometimes the best of plans won't work due to unforseen circumstances. Prayers for those who are injured and those left to mourn.
 

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The truth is normally easy. When lie or coverup involved. a hundred tales.not so much... Are they in hospital with 5.56 wounds? all 3 of who went after him. or bumps and scrapes from falling and running or dropping to the ground. I really hope for the parents of survivors, and the deceased The truth is all told. I have not commented much on this issue i found it really bothered me from the start. trying to tie up the stories the reports and remarks, we all should feel from this.
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I've read that the armed security at the school wasn't a cop, but just a security officer.
 
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