Glock Talk banner
1 - 9 of 9 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
24,295 Posts
Well he had a radio but when you are engaging a shooter, that takes priority. News was reporting murderer went to one classroom but it was locked so he went to another. So the Q then becomes why wasn't that one on lockdown?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
24,295 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
24,295 Posts
No, the majority had every reason to believe the door was locked. They got that based on the first officers at the scene. Even the DPS officers saw how many officers were in the hallway and left. The Border Patrol SWAT team thought the door was locked too.
Yeah but the BP SWAT Team took action. I guess you side with the Mayor and what the DPS Director said in the Senate hearing is false or the mayor said, lies?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
24,295 Posts
And the SCOTUS has already ruled that the police have no responsibility to individuals.
Yeah, I am aware of that. You don't think some attorney will file suit and a judge will allow the suit? But let's get deeper into this. WHY were those officers there? It seems like they were there specifically responding to those individuals. They just responded in the wrong way according to most every agency out there. THAT is another reason they will be sued. THEIR INACTION contributed to the death of those murdered children and teachers. Do you agree?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
24,295 Posts
They took action AFTER they got a key. The DPS director did mislead the senate when asked why they didn’t take over. The ALERRT training says that if someone “goes in” to directly engage the gunman, even if they are senior leadership, they are no longer incident commander or tac coordinator. That position goes to a supervisor outside the hot zone. DPS or Uvalde was in charge but didn’t step up.
And the state senator mentioned how in the military if they are out of contact with their leader, someone steps up. The school chief was out of contact in a school that the radios didn’t work in.
Yeah, but BP SWAT TOOK action. NO ONE went in to engage the shooter prior to BP so you being stuck on WHO was IC is moot. There was no reason to set up anything outside the hot zone because well it was a hot zone with kids being murdered. You think in that confusion, a DPS Sgt. Trooper is going to take over command of a clear chit sammich? Is that how they do it in NYC? The radios, not checking the door, the open door into the school are all issues but has 0 to do with Officers coming onscene and not engaging the shooter for 45min. How you don't think that is a problem is beyond me.
 
  • Like
Reactions: warbow150

·
Registered
Joined
·
24,295 Posts
The answer is a Hell YES. Here the second supervisor stays outside the hot zone to be the tac coordinator. He or she runs the show. Not the first supervisor who goes into the hot zone, regardless of rank( politics aside).
So a hell yes, to that question. And if you don’t think NYPD isn’t going to take over the incident from some local department inside NYPD jurisdiction like the Sea Gate police or Co-op city police, you are crazy. Yes, that Lowly NYPD sergeant is going to takeover that scene from that sea gate police chief. If it happens inside a state courthouse, the jurisdiction of court officers, hell yes, that lowly sergeant is taking over.
Taking over a s-show with a school to keep kids from dying. Hell, yes.
That SWAT team was outside waiting outside even before the search for the key should say something. The IC or tac commander outside the hot zone would have known they were available a lot earlier.

And if they believed that door was locked and they lacked proper breeching tools or training , the shooting had stopped and someone ( the school chief) declared it a hostage situation, you might wait for SWAT. A SWAT team was there and waited for the word to go in, then waited for a key. That’s when that border patrol team said, we have to go in and did. If the tac coordinator was outside where he or she knew they had SWAT available, they would have been sent in earlier. The school chief didn’t have radio communication, remember.
Well I can tell you an outside agency here in TX is not gonna come in and take over (especially something like this) unless specifically asked. We obviously disagree but I say you are still missing the point. Forget IC and setting up outside the hot zone as you call it and telling the tac commander in the inner perimeter anything.
IF an active shooter is actively you know shooting people, you go in sans SWAT Team. I mean most agencies have had the discussion of solo officer and a team response of 2-4 officers (as many as you can immediately get). They had at least 3 officers initially, and it never sounds like they planned on going in because now we find they didn't even check the door. I don't think you can say they didn't hear the gunshots so what is your explanation for them not doing that? THIS has been my whole point from the very start a f this discussion. They had enough time to disarm a fellow officer trying to get to his wife. I mean WTF? How on earth do you have school police that haven't even discussed how to respond to this. Whoever decided to treat it like a barricaded person (Arredondo or someone else) really set the train wreck in motion.

Now once other agencies come onscene, I can see where they respond to what officers already onscene say.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Stevekozak
1 - 9 of 9 Posts
Top