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Florist
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Great job Officer! Prayers for a full recovery.

Kudos to all the LEOs (on duty and off duty) who responded. I heard LEOs from multiple agencies formed the stack that breached the classroom. Not bad, not bad at all for people who likely never ever met before!
 

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Florist
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I just read a CNN article where they said the SRO didn't shoot. Anyone know for sure? Also, anyone know how he gained entry to the school since they supposedly had everything in place to prevent something like this.
SRO didn't shoot or didn't have the chance to shoot back before he was hit? IDK.

What I saw earlier this afternoon was that the SRO "engaged" the shooter, causing the shooter to drop a bag containing more ammo.

I never heard the word 'shoot, fired at,' or any synonym indicating the SRO actually discharging his pistol etc... I can't imagine the SRO not engaging with gunfire if he had the chance, given that a long gun should/would have been visible. Unless of course the SRO was shot before he had the chance to draw and shoot.

The shooter gained entrance from a back door that apparently was unlocked (or openable from the outside).
 

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Florist
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How does the engagement change the number killed?
It lessened the number of children killed. After being engaged by the SRO, the shooter holed up in one classroom and "only" shot the kids in there. If the SRO hadn't engaged (causing the shooter to drop his bag containing more ammo), the shooter likely would have gone from classroom to classroom shooting up all the kids.
 

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Florist
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Oh, by this evening it was already apparent what the competing narratives are. My question is, in the next few news cycles, will the media paint the shooter Salvatore Ramos as black/brown or as white? And how about his LGBTQ status?
 

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Florist
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I hadn't read or heard that he was under hot/immediate pursuit by anyone from after killing his grandma to when he took the car and drove to the school.
 

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Florist
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The TxDPS briefing this afternoon produced more questions than answers. This is what can happen when an agency feels pressured to release information before they've been checked, double checked.

One thing is clear is that the shooter did the majority of his shooting very, very soon after he barricaded himself in the classroom, meaning he shot the kids within minutes.
 

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Florist
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So today’s SRO update:

The School SRO who was not present when shooter arrived on campus, was in fact one of the first LE to arrive after 911 call.

He entered parking lot, but did not see the shooter hiding between cars.

Then he proceeded to detain a teacher at the school, thinking it was the shooter.
Citation?
 

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Florist
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^^^. Even CNN hasn't reported this. Send me citation when you can.
 

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Florist
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Citation is from todays presser McCraw.

Sorry can’t quote/cut/paste from phone

eta repeated on NBC Special Report at 1550CT. by Pete Williams
Pls send a link. Couldn't find his report where that was stated. Thanks.

CNN is still coming up empty.
 

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Florist
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wfaa.com is where I saw it live on TV, then on NBC Special Report on live TV, not on the internet so you will have to search those sites.

Probably gonna be replayed on World News tonight also.
👍. Will look for it on live TV today and tomorrow.
 

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Florist
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In addition to wanting to know the SROs' training experience, etc... I also wonder how close a relationship the SRO chief had with the town and school. On the one hand, being emotionally close can cause one to act. OTOH, I wonder if he thought about how the community would react if he charged in and more kids were then killed. How would the parents react?

The lull in the shooting might have convinced the chief he made the right decision. His relationship with the community might have caused his inaction and froze his ability to be nimble and decisive in taking action.

What's the leadership doctrine if you're the scene commander where your own family are the hostages/victims?
 
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Florist
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Rectangle Font Parallel Plan Pattern


Which way does the classroom doors open? From the hallway (where the LEOs are standing), do the doors open away from them or into them?
 

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Florist
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We recently had an ”Active Shooter“ incident at our Agency where officers wasted zero time in making entry and seeking out the bad guy. Lead guy on point had a rifle and he fired on the bad guy as soon as he made contact. Tragically, one round penetrated a wall, and killed a young girl on the other side. He’s being vilified in the media for rushing things and he’s devastated beyond belief.
I well remember this. LE today faces damned if you do, damned if you don't.

Internet Billy Badasses never, ever, ever, never have to face the realities of what they post.
 
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Florist
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SWAT team does not have to be "activated, geared up, briefed, deployed". Members show up just like everyone else and do what needs to be done.
OK. Easy-peasy.
 

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Florist
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I just read an article quoting Rep. Tony Gonzales. He stated that the doors opened out.
OK. Different effort needed breaching a door that opens away vs one that opens towards you.
 
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Florist
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Let's not overlook that when BorTac entered with the ballistic shield, the shooter was waiting and shot the lead LEO in the head. Fortunately, it only grazed his skull (I assume he instinctively ducked).

Also, it was only a matter of time before the Blue/LEO Derangement Syndrome outed themselves! LOL.
 

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Florist
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But wrong in a potentially criminal sense though, right? Or am I missing something…. I suppose they can charge whatever they want, going to be hard to say no, prosecutors looking to make a name for themselves…

Randy
What you're asking touches on why indemnification is so important in police work. Without indemnification, all the LEOs there can (and probably will) be sued civilly as individuals. OTOH, if they had kicked the doors outwards immediately, and some kid(s) got shot, the LEOs can also (and you know they will) be sued civilly as individuals.
 
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Florist
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The report that a police officer called out and asked if anyone inside needed help and got shot for it was probably the killer pretending to be the police . ( Numerous active shooters have done this tactic). Even so, that gunshot should have initiated a breech by LE even if it was a hostage situation.
We're talking about if LE lost their indemnity as currently being considered by the Brandon administration. So if the breach resulted in a child(ren) shot and killed or seriously injured, the LEOs would be second guessed and very, very likely be sued civilly. And they would be open to personal liability since they no longer have indemnity.

BTW, I no longer trust any defense that the LEOs were acting as per their department's policy/training practices. Any slightest deviation from policy or textbook training practices would be enough for a lawsuit and potential guilty verdict. What if you had 3 agencies and each had different policies/practices? Have 3 separate civil trials?
 
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