Alternative trigger mechanism for The Glock 21

Discussion in 'General Glocking' started by TPATH Dwight, Jun 8, 2016.

  1. TPATH Dwight

    TPATH Dwight

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    I have been having trouble with my accuracy with my new G21.
    I talked with a member of my club who is an active police officer in Brick, NJ.
    He mentioned that there is an alternative trigger mechanism that is less likely to cause a muzzle movement during firing.
    I have done a seach for it on the web and have sent an email to Glock. As of now I have not received any information on this.
    If anyone can help or knows of this I would appreciate it.
    You can answer here or email me at [email protected]

    Thanks,
    Dwight
     
  2. Glockdude1

    Glockdude1 Federal Member CLM

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    Before you change any parts, go the range and put at least 500rd's thru it.

    :cool:
     

  3. TPATH Dwight

    TPATH Dwight

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    Thanks,
    It may not be 500, but its over 300.
    I have 2 revolvers. I shoot them both quite well.
    Love the Glock, but very frustrated.
    Dwight
     
  4. fasteddie565

    fasteddie565 Combat Diver

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    Try burying as much finger as you can in the trigger guard. I had this issue and Pat McNamara said he had the Army AMU coach tell him that. Worked for me.
     
  5. TPATH Dwight

    TPATH Dwight

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    Does that mean putting the trigger somewhere on the second digit pad?
    Just thinking about that, I guess it could cut down on right to left muzzle movement.
    I will give it a try.
    Thanks,
    Dwight
     
  6. L-2

    L-2

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    In no particular order, my thoughts on this matter:
    -determine if this is a hardware issue &/or a training & practice issue. You have 300 rounds through a new Glock platform and perhaps never before had a Glock. If right-handed, it's very common to push shots low & left. You didn't say what your accuracy issues are. If you don't have the time or patience after 300 rounds, you might be looking for a new gun forever.
    -"new" was mentioned but not the generation of G21. If a Gen4, you may want to shoot some amount of ammo using each backstrap variation (five variations, including no backstrap).
    -ensure the trigger bar and connector are lubed/oiled in the correct place to avoid any grittiness in the trigger pull.
    -if you insist on a hardware cure, you can try a 4.5 pound ("MINUS") connector. I'll recommend Glock's brand, only, as it should definitely work after installation. If you see your "active police officer" buddy, try to get more specific information next time. I'm an "active police officer" too. As you can see, that doesn't mean much here.
    -Other folks who may be more comfortable with double action revolver shooting may prefer a NY1 trigger spring, or combination of both.
    -Start close, 5-7 yards, with a good 2-hand hold and see how you do. If you're looking at one-handed 25 yard bullseye shooting into 2", I can't help you as I can't do it either, even if the G21(unknown gen) probably can.
     
  7. Bren

    Bren NRA Life Member

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    500 rounds are useless unless he learns to control the trigger.

    To be accurate with a Glock or any striker fired pistol requires a specific technique and you don't learn it by shooting revolvers.
     
  8. Glockdude1

    Glockdude1 Federal Member CLM

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    How else would you learn to control the trigger unless you shoot the pistol?

    :dunno:
     
  9. Bruce M

    Bruce M

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    I would bet that the advice at the range was probably referring to the Glock "-" connector. Someone at your club ought to be able to point you in the direction of an armorer or Glock dealer who has or can get one and install it for you. Someone there might be able to give you some direction in mastering the Glock trigger too which may well help even more than a change in the trigger.
     
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  10. happie2shoot

    happie2shoot

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    Make sure the gun is unloaded,

    Line up the sights on a blank white or light colored wall in your house and
    squeeze the trigger slow, keep focusing on the sights as you pull the trigger
    until the break. It is best if the wall is well lighted and no light is shining on the
    sights or gun, you can stand in a dark closet if you want, the sights should be
    dark on the bright wall.

    Take note of how the sights moved or did not move at the break, it's called calling
    your shots, if you don't learn this you will probably never be a good shooter with
    a handgun.

    If the front sight jumped left in the rear sight notch your shot will be left, jumped
    right the shot will be right and so on.

    You can also aim at the sky and do this, don't aim at a small target as it will kinda
    make you not focus on the front sight.

    Do this over and over until you can break the shot and not move the front sight in
    the rear sight notch.

    Experiment with different finger placements on the trigger to pull the trigger straight
    to the rear.
     
  11. TPATH Dwight

    TPATH Dwight

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    Hey,
    Well, there is much to digest here. Thanks to all of you.
    Sure glad I decided to give this forum a go.

    After reading the tip about using the second finger pad on the trigger I mentioned this to another police officer friend of mine at golf this morning. Rich is retired now but still shoots often. He told me that he was taught to use the second pad. So that will be my first effort at improving my accuracy.

    The tip about practicing dry trigger pulls also sounds like a good idea. I have of course practiced dry firing before but not in the fashion you suggested. That is trying to id the direction and amount of movement off the target. I will begin that drill before I return to the range.

    As I said I can place many rounds from my 38 revolver in a 3 inch circle from 20 paces. I like my S&W but there is something about the Glock that makes me want to master it. So the point that shooting the revolver will never help me with the Glock, is also well taken.

    Thank you all so very much. I'll get back to you after I work on these tips and after my next shooting day.
    Dwight
     
  12. Bren

    Bren NRA Life Member

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    You can't learn much from shooting. You practice what you have learned by shooting.

    As the saying goes, "practice doesn't make perfect, perfect practice makes perfect."

    In other words, if you are doing it wrong, practice just ingrains bad habits and makes you a worse shooter - you have to learn the right way, then practice that.
     
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  13. QNman

    QNman Old timer

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    Are you shooting consistently, just off aim? Or are you all over the map?
    Religiously low-left, regularly high-right?
    Right handed or left handed?
    Big hands, small hands, or medium hands?

    What kind of ammo are you using? What kind of stance are you using? What generation of Glock are you shooting?

    A little more info can go a very long way to helping offer more definitive suggestions. Perhaps jumping directly to the 21 wasn't the best starting point either. Depending on some of your answer above, a 19 or 17 may have been a better starting point.
     
  14. QNman

    QNman Old timer

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    Oh - and second pad is just plain bad advice, in my book. For a whole bunch of reasons. See Bren's last post.
     
  15. fasteddie565

    fasteddie565 Combat Diver

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    It worked for me, although my fingers are too short to get the whole second pad there. I get good advice from the likes of Pat McNamara.

    I agree with bren about practice, Just try it and see. Ask someone to put a dime on your rear sight and then pull the trigger. The dime should stay in place. In my opinion. what's bad advice is giving advice on something you have never done.
     
  16. Mayonator

    Mayonator

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    That's the most likely explanation. There are also custom trigger assemblies that you drop in, like the ZEV trigger, and there are shops such as JP Enterprises. who will put in polished and fitted parts, adjust the slide to frame fit, etc. Simply dropping a lighter connector in the pistol doesn't help much, in my experience. Learning the stock trigger is the best option though. Opinions vary on how to best go about that. Dry fire practice is what helped me the most.
     
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  17. glide

    glide Just sayin'

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    I like Zev Technologies trigger kits a lot. Nice feel to them and all been reliable through a couple years of ownership and about several thousand rounds. No issues to speak off. Shop around and do your research before jumping in. Enjoy and be safe.
     
  18. TPATH Dwight

    TPATH Dwight

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    You are so right about that. For years I have watched mediocre golfers practice, practice, practice and never get better because they do nothing but solidify every bad move they have.
    Stands to reason, the same goes for shooting. Thanks for that advice.
    Dwight
     
  19. harold63

    harold63 I'm not retired

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    I'm also thinking he may have mentioned the '-' connector. (aka 'minus' or '4.5lb' connector).

    Before you start changing parts, have you tried putting the pistol on a rice bag while you squeeze the trigger to determine if you have some human/mechanical error in the G21's inaccuracy? Revolvers tend to have forged trigger internals that don't have burrs and rough surfaces like a Glock's trigger internals and therefore do not 'stack' as much (or at all) during the trigger squeeze. Heck, my Taurus .44 mag revolver doesn't stack, but in shooting double action, it has a heavier pull than any of my stock Glocks did. I'd take heavier pull and NO stacking any day for accuracy 'cause you can always build some strength in your trigger finger flexors and extensors. Stacking can affect an accomplished bullseye shooter's groups, even with bigfoot strength, 'cause you have to pull through the 'stack', and if it stacks just before the break, that can pull your muzzle around, even with good technique.

    See if you can get a better group off a bag. If you can, you could consider a minus connector (if your pistol didn't come with one) and a good polish/dehorn of the friction points of the trigger parts. 10 times out of 10, a person will shoot better groups with a trigger that doesn't stack. Shooting those parts in or dry firing them in may take ages, especially if you lube your trigger part, friction points.
     
  20. QNman

    QNman Old timer

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    That's great... glad it worked for you. But the mechanics are still eff-ed up.

    For many, the "saucer and tea cup" works. For many, a side-stance and single rigid arm works. Point is - many little "tricks" work; that doesn't make them good practice, especially for someone who hasn't yet developed the bad habit.

    This is a public forum, open for public opinion. I think you'll find I'm not the only one who thinks sticking half your finger into the guard is a poor habit for a half dozen or more reasons. Don't like it? Ignore it and move on.