Aloha to a batch of guns in Hawaii

Discussion in 'General Firearms Forum' started by InValhalla, Aug 31, 2015.

  1. InValhalla

    InValhalla

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    So.... what's the consensus on this?

    www.foxnews.com/politics/2015/08/31/anti-gun-stupidity-honolulu-destroys-575g-worth-police-firearms/

    I can understand the frustration by some that a number of these handguns - especially the NIB ones, could have been sold to law enforcement personnel, qualified citizens, gun shops, etc and maybe brought in over $500,000.

    But.... and I know I'm going to get fragged for this... "what if" one or two of those handguns end up in the hands of someone that uses it for no good - and the result is one or two dead innocent people?

    Put yourself in the position of the mayor or someone high up in the Honolulu PD, and you decide to allow the guns to be sold to the public and LE personnel.

    Let's say that a NIB S&W 9mm is sold to someone in the department. He/She has it for a month and then decides to move back to the continental 48. He/She sells the gun to a dealer. That dealer in turn sells it to a man/woman.... who passes the background check with flying colors.

    Let's say this man/woman used to work for a few radio stations, but was let go for alleged, unspecified reasons.

    A few days later, that same man/woman, who bought the handgun that could have been destroyed, but was bought by a LE person, and then sold to a dealer, and then bought by him/her, allegedly takes that gun and shoots four past coworkers while they are doing a live report from somewhere.

    Granted, if you would have chosen to melt down all the handguns, this person would have still gotten a weapon. But you chose to sell them verses melting them and the end result is you put $500,000 in the coffers of the city and four people are now dead and were killed by a gun that you allowed to be sold.

    DISCLAIMER.... I'm not saying they should or shouldn't have destroyed the guns. I'm just hypothesizing a situation that the end result would probably be on a person's mind when they looked in the mirror every morning and thought about the past decisions they made / didn't make and the result thereof.

    I'm guessing the city officials were willing to take the heat for NOT selling the guns verses selling the guns, getting the money, and then waiting to see if someone was killed with one of the guns they allowed to be sold.

    IV
     
  2. ddbtoth

    ddbtoth

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    Abuse of public funds, malfeasance of office, and yes you are wrong. We paid for them (well, the Hawaiians did), why should public property be destroyed because it frightens people by what it might do? What if you sold a pistol to a father that used it to save his family from a murderous home invasion? Or you didn't sell it to him, and he couldn't afford retail. Now the death of him and his family is on the liberal democrats hands. It's all how you spin the story, spin it like the liberals.
     
    Last edited: Aug 31, 2015

  3. rock_castle

    rock_castle Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness

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    Once again the democrats show that they don't give a damn about the taxpayer. The dems really think that tax revenue is owed to them. I'd be pretty PO'd if I was a HI resident.
     
  4. arkdweller22

    arkdweller22 Cuhootnified Roamer

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    What about if that selfsame S&W 9mm was bought by a divorcee with an abusive ex and she uses it to defend herself and her kids from his murderous intentions?
    Or that same camera crew bought one of those guns and defended the crew from the ill intent of the crazed ex coworker.
    Or what about.... Well you get it. It works both ways and with legally purchased guns, it's heavily weighted to the good.
     
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  5. janice6

    janice6

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    God forbid the Indigenous people of the islands would get some and turn on their conquerors.
     
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  6. rhikdavis

    rhikdavis U.S. Veteran

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    Ever got hit in the head with a coconut?
     
  7. railfancwb

    railfancwb

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    Apparently Obama and Holder aren't remorseful about the Fast and Furious guns


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  8. janice6

    janice6

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    No. I was in Key West in 1958, and read the sign in town that said: "Watch out for falling Coconuts", I am careful now.
     
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  9. oldman11

    oldman11

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    Well of course they aren't. They got away with the illegal sale of guns across the border, they BS'd their way out of any charges and laughed at US laws.
     
  10. InValhalla

    InValhalla

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    I agree with the scenarios of them being used for protection. Probably more pros than cons doing it that way.

    Like I said, I'm not agreeing/disagreeing with their decision - I just threw out the scenario that I figured would get the most opposition.

    I still have a hunch that city officials decided to error on the side of extreme caution of not selling and therefore eliminating potential future lawsuits and push back for possibly helping cause a wrongful death with a gun ending up being used to commit a crime.

    Also, if the truth be told, you can't tell me that the guns being destroyed would bother companies such as Glock, S&W, etc. They've already got the sale once - when the departments/cities bought the guns initially or when moving to a new side arm. So more used guns in the market place means less sales for them. If the used guns are destroyed, the potential for the sale of a new gun increases.

    IV
     
  11. oldman11

    oldman11

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    I was in the service that year and there weren't any coconuts where we were. :D
     
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  12. MajorD

    MajorD

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    Also keep in mind guns in general and handguns in particular (similar to my native New York) are heavily regulated with a permit system each gun registered to a specific owner etc. under such circumstances ( again using my home state as an example) lawful gun owners who have jumped through the numerous hoops required to legally own a pistol who then go out and commit a gun related crime are real real close to zero. Multiple studies over many years have always come to the same conclusion - while you hear the media talk about a crime involving a gun and claiming the criminal obtained it legally , once you dig deep into the facts of the case it is generally found the individual had some mental defect not revealed on the 4473 or not duly reported by a mental health professional etc.
    Again like Hawaii ( but even more of a cumbersome mess) in my home state we have a permit system for all handgun ownership and the number of permit holders involved in a criminal incident ( out of hundreds of thousands of people ) usually runs a handful every year.
    Bottom line to deny a basic right of the availability of firearms to thousands of people in the hopes it might prevent a tragedy or two is fully illogical, and is blatantly unconstitutional.
    To use the vehicle example it would be like saying no one can have a car or drive because someone might get drunk drive and hurt someone.
     
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  13. China boy

    China boy

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    They may as well melt anything sharp, anything with a blade, all hammers, all baseball bats, most wrenches, rope large than the circumference of a human neck, fists...

    Oh wait, only guns are used in violent crimes...
     
  14. DaleGribble

    DaleGribble Liberals 'R Bad!!!!

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    I think you're an antigun troll and you're post is one of the dumbest things I've read in a long time.

    First of all, why should someone who legally sold a gun feel responsible for what a lawful buyer does with it after the sale?

    Should a car salesman feel guilty about a car he sold being used to kill a family in a DUI? Of course not, because no one blames a car for a DUI, but somehow, evil communist gun grabbers like yourself have managed to push this stupid narrative that guns are to blame for homicides instead of blaming yourselves for wrecking our mental health care system and shutting down lots of mental health facilities that used to house the crazy people that are now allowed to roam our streets and kill other Americans.

    Congratulations, you're what's wrong with America. Good job buddy, you should be proud...
     
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  15. InValhalla

    InValhalla

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    I hate to tell you Dale, but you're wrong with most of the drivel that you spewed out in your post. But since this is the internet and a forum to boot, you would have no way of knowing what I'm actually like and what my core beliefs are. You jumped in and made an "assumption" - which, you know what that makes you right? You just happened to be wrong is all, don't feel bad about it.

    Being a business owner and dealing one on one with people from all over the world, I like to think I'm capable of looking at things from different points of view. That doesn't mean that I necessarily have to believe in one over another - I just weigh out all the options. I'm pretty cautious, but usually right, and I always have a contingency plan.

    I've owned guns my whole life. Handguns, shot guns, rifles, so I wouldn't consider myself an antigun troll. I can still remember the first gun I ever shot, it was my dad's S&W 44 Magnum Model 29. I was only 12 at the time; I can still remember how huge it felt! I remember him warning me to hang on to it when I squeezed the trigger.

    I have my CCW, and I utilize it. My wife has her own Glock 19, her CCW, and she utilizes it. My son has his CCW also, but can't use it due to university policies. Why, we're just a pistol packin' family!

    I even hunt too. I usually get my deer on opening day - sometimes the second day, but play the part of dog for the rest of the week pushing the woods so the other guys in our group have a chance of getting theirs, especially the newbie we usually have with us each year. If the truth be told, I even go out and harvest a few bunnies and birds during the appropriate season. I trap too - but there's no guns involved in that.

    As for your assumption that I'm a communist... if I were a communist, I don't think I would be proud of the members of my family that have/are in the United States military. My dad served during WWII and was in charge of the railway operations of Operation Torch. He then supplied the Fifth Army during the invasion of Italy. I have two uncles that were in the Navy. I've got two nephews that are currently in the AF also.

    As for me being what's wrong with America.... I've spent the last 22 years raising a young man that will commission as a 2nd Lieutenant in the United States Air Force next Spring. His PCSM score was in the top 1 percent of the country. When he got his pilot slot last year, he was one of only 75 non tech majors that were awarded slots. His detachment commander told him that in light of his high accumulation of flight hrs, and scores, he's got a real good shot at going to ENJJET. If those acronyms don't mean anything to you, what it boils down to is that more than likely he'll find himself sitting in an F22 in the near future.

    In just a few short years, he'll be one of the ones out there protecting your right to go about your daily life. You said "Good job buddy, you should be proud..." Yes sir, his mom and I are damn proud.

    I'm pretty sure you know what I think of your post by now.
     
  16. CajunBass

    CajunBass

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    I think it's reasonable to assume that anyone who got one of these guns and used it to commit a crime, would have found some other way to get a gun or other weapon and used it to commit the same crime.

    Crimes are committed by people. Not by things. How many times will we have to hammer that point? A gun, no matter how it is obtained, or who it is obtained from, is just a hunk of metal/plastic/wood. It can no more spontaneously harm anyone, than a toaster can spontaneously make toast.
     
  17. DaleGribble

    DaleGribble Liberals 'R Bad!!!!

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    Great, you love yourself. I'm happy for you.

    Since you are so smart you should know that this symbol "?" is a question mark, it indicates that someone is asking you a question. Most people respond to questions with what are called answers. Now that you're done telling us all about your life story, how about answering those questions I posed to you. I'll even post them again for you, Super Man...


    See, if you're the great defender of freedom and the living version of Jeremiah Johnson as you claim to be, why do you believe that I, a person that lawfully sells guns, should feel bad about what a lawful buyer does with a gun that I may have sold? Why should I carry around some sort of moral baggage because a person does something with an inanimate object that I used to own?

    Again, should a car salesman feel bad because a car he sold was used in a DUI in which an innocent person was killed?
     
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  18. MajorD

    MajorD

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    Circling back to the subject my home state many years ago used to sell off surplus police firearms - by the thousands! One ( yes one) ended up being used in a crime half the country away. And this was after it had changed hands multiple times and perhaps even been stolen. The state passed a law any surplus state owned firearms had to be transferred to another agency or destroyed. A big waste!
    During the height of the federal awb glock offered to replace all the state police glocks for free in trade for the old ones and pre ban magazines- due to this regulation it was a no go!
    As a result cops continued to carry older guns and mags ( later replaced by newer glocks at a much higher cost) and legitimate gun owning civilians were denied the chance to get them. Even retiring troopers were not allowed to buy the old duty weapons! A lose lose lose proposition!
     
  19. InValhalla

    InValhalla

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    A lesson in the English language from someone that has no command of it, now that's amusing.

    You need to either Google it, get a tutor, or take a class at a community college. Just do something and learn how to use the English language. You're inability to use a contraction properly shows your inability to use the language of the country you live in. See, that's how to use the words correctly in a sentence.

    I think you just need to go to the house and play inside.

    If you'll excuse me now, I've got an upcoming book burning and gun melting rally to plan.

    IV
     
  20. DaleGribble

    DaleGribble Liberals 'R Bad!!!!

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    Here ya go, Your, you happy now?

    Now answer the questions I've repeatedly asked. The more you avoid those questions the more you look like a lying troll.

    Here they are, again...

     
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