Home > Firearms Forums > General Firearms Forum > 9mm single stack.... worth it?

9mm single stack.... worth it?

  1. Single stack 9mm in a subcompact form seems to be the big craze these days, and there are many choices out there. I too have considered it, as m G26 seems a little chunky for its size (I have no issues with my 19's or 17's)

    I've checked out and handled some recently considering my options...... the new Beretta Nano, KT PF9, even the mighty Walther PPS 9. A few of these really feel great and fit my hand well and the trigger action feels good. BUT I am not an impulsive gun-buyer so I start researching and doing my homework.

    I have to say that I'm starting to get discouraged, as to the poor rap these micro single stack thin 9's seem to get. One has this issue, the other has that issue, another one has major FTE issues, and so on...

    Is it possible that maybe trying to make a pistol smaller than what the cartridge can do to it may be too much for such a small form factor can handle?

    I'm close to giving up on the search for a reliable small single stack and just keep the larger frame pistols and call it a day.....
     
  2. The biggest problem with tiny concealed carry gun reliability is the shooter. Lightweight gun + stiff recoil springs + small grip area = even a .380 is pretty snappy. You have to HANG ON to that thing to keep it happy.

    My PF9 has ~1k rounds through it. 100 percent reliable for me. I've had others shoot it who couldn't hold onto it well enough for it to cycle properly, but this hasn't been an issue for me.

    Edit: To answer your question, yes mine has been worth it. Same outline as my Glock, almost half as thick. I have no waist, so thin helps me conceal.
     
  3. Go buy a Makarov or a Tokerev, fits in your pocket and has a bit more field trials time under it's belt.
    Unless you want to roll the dice, or spend big bucks thats the cheapest way to go if you want it to go bang every time you pull the trigger.
    Or get the 26, which is the "Fat Chick" of Mini 9's. She's reliable, loves to bang, its just harder to get a grip on her.
     
  4. That's been my experience, although there are lots of GT members who have had great success with their micro 9mm pistols. Mine was almost reliable but the one-per-fifty FTE glitches gave me enough pause when considering CCW that I finally ended up with a larger pistol. With the micros it seems the record is you get a good, reliable one or you get one you're constantly fiddling with trying to make it problem free.

    I didn't have a problem with the "bulky" baby Glock, it is having to curl my pinkie under the magazine that I don't like. Anyway I ended up with a great Steyr 9mm sub-compact, although I still am tempted to buy a Glock G-33 because I like .357sig so much. I've been holding off, hoping to find one in a shop with the GAP floorplate so I can see for myself how that tweak makes a difference in the grip.
     
  5. Love my G27 for everyday carry ......... but if I went for a 9mm it would probably be the G26..........:wavey:
     
  6. I love my Glocks but I REALLY like having my new Kahr CM9 to carry IWB. It is so much more comfortable to carry and has been reliable for 400 rounds so far.

    But I also understand your concern about reliability. My first attempt at a single stack 9mm didn't work so well. I bought a Kel Tec PF9 last year and it was a POS! Worst gun I've ever had the misfortune of owning. Constant FTF, FTE, light primer strikes, mag falling out while shooting...you get the idea!

    I was very nervous about spending even more money for the Kahr this time around but I took the plunge and couldn't be happier! So for me, yes it's worth it. It might take some trial and error but I'm glad I gave it another try.
     
  7. As the gun gets smaller so does the "window" of reliability. Angles get steeper, the slide has less distance to travel, springs get more critical. If you feel the need for a micro 9 get the one that feels best with the assumption that you're going to have to experiment with loads and maybe do a little fluff and buff. If it works great out of the box, consider yourself lucky and rock it.

    Also consider that the vast majority of gun owners still don't participate in the various forums. Of those that do, there are probably 20 with any particular gun that runs fine to every 1 complainer. Just look at any thread on here complaining about model x. There are a ton of people chiming in how theirs runs fine.

    Of course, I mostly carry a J-frame, so :dunno:
     
  8. Well, my LC9 is with me quite a bit, every time I go out of town and quite a bit when I go to the gas station or grocery store (even more now that I made a wallet style holster for it). My G19 has came with me maybe 5 times (it does go with me in the woods if I OC, hunting and such, but doesn't sit well with my gut if I carry IWB).


    So as far as me carrying them, yes the micro 9mm is worth it. Has been 100% reliable so far, I forget how many rounds I have through it, probably 600 or so, along with a few boxes of carry ammo. I never have any doubts about it going bang.
     
  9. Have you checked out the BERSA BP9CC?:wavey:


    Also, the KT PF-9 is a great gun! The PPS is over-priced and I have not seen a Nano in person yet.

    BERSA makes some of the finest guns in the world! Ask anyone (that knows about guns) and they will tell you that BERSA has a rep for quality that is unmatched in the gun industry!


    TGG
     
  10. I'd love to see more single-stack COMPACT size handguns. In my opinion, concealment has more to do with thickness than size. I could conceal a 1911 just as well as a G19, because its thin. I think a G19 sized single stack gun would be alot more reliable than the 9mm pocket rockets, but keep its concealment factor.
     
  11. I really like the LS9 from STI. A very high quality, slim, 9mm single stack. Not the most common gun on the shelf, but from a company that has a proven track record.
     
  12. I have been struggling with a Diamondback DB9 6+1 9mm that wants to be a Glock but it just isn't reliable enough for me to consider a true CCW. It will make a fine back up and I can always throw it at the BG if it fails!:supergrin:
     
  13. I have a G26, a Kahr MK9 and K9.

    For pure concealment, the MK9 is hard to beat. It is the same dimensions has the CM9 and PM9, but the MK9 is stainless steel and 6+1. The K9 is 7+1 and disappears in a IWB holster. I feel it's too big for pocket carry (that is what the MK9 is for) but others have said the pocket carry it fine.

    All the guns have thousands of trouble free rounds down the pipe.

    If I had to pick one, the MK9 would be the winner of the micro-gun shoot out.
     
  14. I've had no issues with the PPS and my friend has had no problems with his PM9. The PPS is great and fits the bill for what I wanted. The PM9 was a little small for me combined with greater recoil, but he's very happy with it.
     
  15. I love my 9mm Sig P239. Its a very reliable gun that is still shootable and feels nice in the hand.

    It is not LC9 or 938 size, but it is a good carry gun.

    I agree with you that the gun manufacturers are pushing the limit with size and reliability. I am not a fan of tiny autos. A jframe revolver is as small as I go.
     
  16. The OP expressed something I have been thinking for quite some time, beginning with the true "micro" 1911's. I think we are at the "point of diminishing returns in terms of the reliability we expect from the size we want. By a miracle the wifes Kimber Ultra Raptor, that she bought without involving me at all, has been 100% BUT I didn't and still don't expect it to work everytime (despite the fact that I implicitly trust my Kimber compact) If you look at the size and the weight of the "pocket nines" you realize that they are lighter and more compact than the .380s of a couple of generations ago. A pocket 9mm has to be some type of locked breech as opposed to a blowback and we are at a "zero tolerance" level as far as dwell time and feeding etc. IMO we have actually passed it. We are to the point of "You pull the trigger, it goes "BANG"....and then a miracle happens"
     
  17. I'd recommend a Ruger LC9 or any flavor of Kahr. I like the MK9 and T9. I really want an all black PM9 too.
     
  18. How good of a shot are you? If your good, take the single stack. It shouldn't be a issue.

    For ease of concealment and overall carry, a single stack pistol is hard to beat.

    Just get one in a respectable caliber.
     
  19. Good thread and ive been thinking the same. I keep going back to the Gen4 G26 though, reliability and capacity. Still thinking about a LC9 or MK9 but i think im gonna go with the G26 especially since i qualify for the blue label discount and i can use my existing holster. Can use my G19 mags too. More expensive than the LC9 but cheaper than the MK9. So happy medium. :wavey:

    Ill probably still add one of the others later just to try.
     
  20. I think there are very good points there, and I agree that oftentimes the problem is with the shooter, since the tolerances built in these micro guns are minimal the room for errors is really not there.



    Two points: under stress, the risk is also a proficient shooter will probably not be at 100%, and the possibility of malfunctions might increase just as one needs it most. The second is that very often guns are grabbed from owners including police officers. The smaller the gun, the weaker the grip and the easier it will be to wrestle it away from the owner.


    Having tried quite a few, I would only recommend the Walther PPS, the G26 and the Sig 239 among the guns mentioned.
     
  21. The Gold Standard in small 9mm,s is the G26. It just plain works and is not limited by short service life,reliability,+P+,+P or standard ammo. It will eat it all and not fall apart like the Ruger LC9,Kahr,s,PPS,Kel-crap and all those other POS Junk cheapies.
     
  22. Like my G26, but my EDC is a Kahr PM9. It's been as reliable as my G26 but is a whole lot more comfortable to carry. If I'm going in an area where I think I'd like to carry more rounds then I take the G26.
     
  23. I used to CCW a K9 for almost 6 years. Never had a reliability issue with the gun itself. And the gun disappeared with a IWB holster. The only complaint I had was that (when compared to the G19), the grip was TOO slim. If size and weight are issues, a P9 would probably be ideal.
     
  24. I've been pocket carrying the .380 pistols for some time. Kel Tec P3AT, Micro Desert Eagle, Ruger LCP, etc, and all were pretty good (my SIG P238 and Diamondback sucked).

    The major problem is the minor caliber. I figure if I ever have to use the .380 the first thing that will go through my mind is, "I wish I had a bigger caliber gun".



    Last year I impulse bought a Ruger LC9. I did not like all the lawyer crap on the gun, such as magazine disconnect, thumb safety, big loaded chamber indicator, etc.
    [​IMG]

    In the first eight days I ran over a thousand trouble free rounds through the gun. I stopped counting at over seventeen hundred rounds and still haven't had any trouble with the gun.

    I got used to the safeties except the magazine disconnect, I hate those things, so I removed it from the LC9 (and my SR9C and SR40C).

    Now, when my pockets are deep enough the LC9 is my carry choice.
    I like it so well I bought a spare LC9.:)


    For a smallish 9mm the LC9 is quite accurate, even when standing and shooting back to 50 yards.
    [​IMG]
     
  25. I still can't get past the limited capacity of single stacks. The really itty-bitty guns are all trouble-prone to some degree.

    Here we have a Glock 17, 19 and 26.

    [​IMG]

    If you look at the actual size difference between a g26 and a g19, then add that many people put a pinky extension on the g26, the g19 (with 15 rounds) seems to be the ideal balance of capacity vs. size IMO. The 26 gives up 1/3 of it's rounds for not much smaller size.

    I carry the 19 IWB most of the time. (Sometimes a well-proven Kel-Tec P11 instead, simply because the built-in pocket clip is such a cinch to carry.)
     
  26. I've experienced nearly all the single stack 9's in search of a light IWB that can ride in a pocket if desired.

    No experience w/LC9, so I'll defer to M2Carb.

    KAHR CM9 - if you aren't looking at it, you are doing yourself a major disservice.
    MK9 as stated above is the same dimensions, but you can forget about pocket carry, as the all steel cousin is very clunky in pocket.
    KT PF9 is a good super cheap option, and the FLATTEST option if you do a 'fluff and buff' and pump some rounds through.

    Kahr has a good trigger, albeit with a long reset, flawless function, although sliiiightly thicker than the PF9, it's the only one I found short enough to have viability as a pocket gun.
     
  27. i have an Ruger LC9. if i can find a competent person in east Alabama to remove the mag disconnect and thumb safety id appreciate it....lawyer lock is a bit more of a trick id imagine. maybe should have gotten a Kel-Tek PF9.
     
  28. I am really curious about this new Bersa, but none of my local gun shops have one and the two or three gun shows I've been to recently haven't had one. This is surprising to me because Bersas are all over the place and I'm wondering if there's something keeping them off the market.

    Another GT member has the new Bersa and he wrote that he loved it up until putting about 600 rounds downrange, when it started becoming increasingly jammomatic. If I recall he said the extractor became worn and had to be replaced, so perhaps the new model rollout might be due to Bersa having to replace a sub-standard part.

    BTW, can the new Bersa handle +P and +P+ ammo or does Bersa recommend shooting only standard pressure ammo?
     
  29. I come to the conclusion that a Small Single stack 9mm is worth it, in a sense.

    Nothing beats a .380 pocket gun for concealablity, but a small single stack 9mm like the Kahr PM9/CM9, Beretta Nano, Kimber Solo, and the like is good for occasional pocket carry and will disappear with IWB carry.

    Will it carry well your pocket of your light dress pants, probably not, but in a larger front jeans pocket or cargo pants pocket, sure no problem.
     
  30. A P7M8 might do the trick. A bit girthy for a single stack, but as accurate as they get.
     
  31. I concur completely with your assessment of the CM / PM 9. A colleague of mine went from carrying a Ruger LCP to the CM9 and is completely satisfied with its concealability as well as its function. It is accurate and controlable. I highly reccommend this if a pocket/IWB small powerful pistol is what you are looking for.
     
  32. Its a nice backup option, if Glock made one it would sell like crazy, the new M&P Shield is interesting. Im very happy with my G26.





    :50cal:
     
  33. One of the chief reasons for carrying a pistol over a revolver is increased capacity, and the single-stack nines give up more of that advantage than I would like. I have no problem concealing my Glock 26, and it has had not a single failure in well over 4K rounds. If a single-stack floats your boat, I have no gripes, but they don't attract me.
     
  34. I carried an LC9, and when I bought a CM9, I cleaned and stored my LC9. I love that CM9. I changed the sights, and it splits time as my EDC with my G-36. I guess I'm just a singlestack kinda' guy.
     
  35. :rofl: :rofl::rofl:

    I EDC a 26. That's damn funny.
     
  36. Size, weight, and a fast magazine change have little to do with it? :tongueout:

    The G26 is easy to conceal, I EDC one myself. It's not however, a pocket gun. You need a pretty big pocket, for it. I'm 5'10, 36" waste. I stuff it in a pair of baggy dickies, it's very visible. IWB though, it disappears.

    I like the little single stack 9's. I was looking at the Diamondback DB9, but I guess it gets bad reviews :dunno: I wouldn't mind something small to throw in the pocket while I run to the convenient store real quick. ATM I use my walther p22. Better than a 1911 on the nightstand.
     

  37. I don't suspect you are going to share your specific experiences with any of those pistols by chance?
     
  38. While I will NEVER get rid of my G26 (unless for a G27), I do wish I had a smaller single stack 9mm and I plan on adding one to my collection this summer. The top contender is the Kahr CM9 by far, but the LC9, PF9, and P290 are other options. I am interested in checking out Smith and Wessons new single stack as well if they actually make it to stores soon.
     
  39. I'm sorry... did you include the pps in your list of "junk cheapies"? Get a grip.
     
  40. There is only 3 maybe 4 single stack 9mm that are cheaper then the glock. Everything else is will pretty much cost you more. Heck the just buying one Boberg or a Rohrbaugh will cost you the price of TWO Glocks

    The Kimber Solo, The Kahr PM9, The Sig P290 and the 938, and the Walther PPS, yea they are all junk cheapies :rofl:
     
  41. Just to say i have a KT PF9, and it is as reliable as my G;ocks, also very accurate for a little pistol, i got it for pocket carry as such it is a good, inexpensive pistol.
     

  42. +1.

    I carry the PPS daily IWB and a Glock 29 in my computer bag (yes, my BUG is a 10mm).

    I do have a PM9 and it has been 100% reliable, but I had a PM40 and it was horrible with FTF's. So I've never really trusted the PM9 since...