close

Privacy guaranteed - Your email is not shared with anyone.

45-70 vs 450 marlin vs 444

Discussion in 'Hunting, Fishing & Camping' started by tenn mickey, Nov 17, 2004.

  1. tenn mickey

    tenn mickey

    Messages:
    34
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2002
    Location:
    Chattanooga, Tennessee
    I am thinking of getting a Marlin 45-70 guide gun so...


    If you were going to pick between these guns for a hunting and an all-around outdoor gun, which caliber would you pick and why?


    I realize that all these guns are good out to about 150 to 200 yrds max and that they are good for areas with alot of brush and what not, but for those of you who have experience with any of the three, or more than one of the three please post your thoughts.
     
  2. vafish

    vafish

    Messages:
    16,581
    Likes Received:
    68
    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2003
    Location:
    Commonwealth of Virginia
    My Choice: 45-70.

    Why: Better bullet and load selection.

    Any of the 3 will do their job.
     

  3. dougader

    dougader

    Messages:
    2,980
    Likes Received:
    12
    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2004
    I don't have any of those 3, but I was considering this same question a few months ago and haven't purchased yet due to financial concerns.

    I figured the Guide Gun in 45-70 was the right choice for me. I like the simplicity of the case. I know I can reload my own shells and I dislike the added cost of 450 Marlin belted cases; I have never liked those belted cases.

    The availability of .458 slugs for reloading is pretty good (both jacketed and hardcast) and if you want extra punch from a factory load, Garrett Cartridges ammo is the ticket.

    I also like the nostalgic aura the 45-70 brings. In my mind, its a real keeper. The Guide Gun in 45-70 is still on my list of guns I need to get.
     
  4. mikedb

    mikedb

    Messages:
    215
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2004
    Location:
    brighton michigan
    I just bought a Guide Gun in 45/70. I have been wanting one for years and found a good deal. I like the 45/70 because of history, availablilty of ammo, and price of ammo. If I want 450 Marlin performance all I have to do is buy some Buffalo Bore or garrett Ammo. If all I'm after is whitetail I can buy standard factory ammo at any store. For a short 150-200yd brush gun it is great.
     
  5. G36's Rule

    G36's Rule Senior Member

    Messages:
    9,373
    Likes Received:
    85
    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2001
    Location:
    Spring, TX.
    I have a 450 Marlin. It is suprisingly accurate. Any bullet that will work in the 45-70 will work in the 450. While I don't have the number of loaded ammo choices that an owner of a 45-70 would, I reload so that is not an issue.
     
  6. muddydog

    muddydog

    Messages:
    78
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2004
    Location:
    Tulsa
    i guess..i'm just an outlaw..

    my buddies and i, 3 of us have .444's. 2 winchester XTR's (1 timber and 1 regular) and 1 marlin outfitter. the 1 who has the outfitter..wishes he had bought a full size rifle like my 94 XTR.
    not really a size difference..but the gun has a better feel..and we think a better finished gun.

    we all absolutely love this cartridge. look at its ballistics..not too shabby.

    no recoil- really my wife shoots my XTR all the time.

    i'm about finished up on my case of remingtons and i'm going to order a case of hornady's.

    i would not hesitate to shoot anything..on earth with a .444 under the right circumstances.

    several speciality loads are available for BIG spooky stuff. Garrett and Buffalo Bore come to mind.

    i finally got a reloader and i'm gonna play around some with this cartridge.

    i have dozens of rifles...but the .444 is one of the best shooting guns i have..very accurate..i have a AO tritium bead and williams open rear sight.

    big hogs are stone dead...
     
  7. duncan

    duncan Lifetime Member Millennium Member

    Messages:
    2,349
    Likes Received:
    76
    Joined:
    Feb 15, 1999
    Location:
    Seattle
    A 45-70G guide gun has been on my wish list for three years. Can hunt almost any animal in the US with one.

    The 45-70 is the more popular of them and you can find a nice used one too - sure of it.
     
  8. CanyonMan

    CanyonMan In The Saddle

    Messages:
    5,712
    Likes Received:
    26
    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2002
    I have used the 444 marlin, and the 45-70, i prefere the 45-70.
    I can reload it to do a lot more than the 444, and in a pinch, if you are out of town and need ammo, you will find the 45-70 a lot eaiser than the other two.

    As was said... all three are good, and will work. Depends on what you really want. Even with light loads, the 45-70 is very hard to beat.
    A 405 gr. cast bullet down range is a real freight train.


    CanyonMan
     
  9. paynter2

    paynter2 It ain't over Millennium Member

    Messages:
    6,653
    Likes Received:
    1,462
    Joined:
    Apr 25, 1999
    Location:
    upper mid-west
    I don't know much about these calibers - first hand anyway...

    I'm posting just to say a friend shot a nice bull moose in Canada with his 45-70 Guide Gun. Said it dropped right there - of course lots of calibers could drop a moose. But, I thought you 'old' caliber guys might like to hear it...
     
  10. Dogbite

    Dogbite DNT TREAD ON ME

    Messages:
    3,031
    Likes Received:
    73
    Joined:
    May 20, 2000
    Location:
    Tennessee
    The 45-70 marlin is my choice.My dad has one,it is amazing.With Garrett loads,it is equal to a 458 win mag,and has taken all of the biggest game animals in Africa.
     
  11. freakshow10mm

    freakshow10mm 10mm Advocate

    Messages:
    6,902
    Likes Received:
    13
    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2003
    Location:
    Michigan's Upper Peninsula
    I am looking at a 45-70 Guide gun myself. There was a 1895SS floating around a local gun shop a couple months ago. I'll have to check and see if they still got one.
     
  12. Researcher

    Researcher

    Messages:
    62
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2004
    Location:
    Pittsburgh, PA
    My dad has a 45-70 that he carries for bear hunting and if he is going to be walking alot deer hunting. The Marlin 1895G. Nice gun. Everytime we talked to someone this past Monday (first day of bear season in PA) they asked about the gun.
     
  13. MrMurphy

    MrMurphy ********* Moderator Lifetime Member Millennium Member

    Messages:
    12,972
    Likes Received:
    7
    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2001
    Location:
    Buried in the X-files
    The .45-70 would be my choice. The .450 Marlin is for hot loaders who want a maximum charge, and I wouldn't have much use for that, anything a .45-70 can't do, I don't want to tackle.

    The .444 is also a nice round from what I've heard, but ammo is a bit harder to find. I wouldn't hesitate to use it though.
     
  14. turbonatr

    turbonatr Senior Member Millennium Member

    Messages:
    1,100
    Likes Received:
    9
    Joined:
    Jul 4, 1999
    Location:
    N.E., PA
    In what respect? Certainly not power. The 458WinMag pushes a 500gr. bullet to 2260fps. The 45-70 Buffalo Bore 500gr. load is pushed to 1625fps. Garrett pushes a 500gr. bullet slower than Buffalo Bore. Comparing the 458WinMag's 500gr load (5670fpe) with Buffalo Bore's 500gr. load (2931fpe) there is a difference of 2739fpe in favor of the 458WinMag.

    The 45-70 does not equal a 458WinMag. In reality, the very best 45-70 loads approach low end 458WinMag performance.
     
  15. dougader

    dougader

    Messages:
    2,980
    Likes Received:
    12
    Joined:
    Apr 17, 2004
    He may be referring to penetration. In some testing done at John Linebaugh's place a few years ago they did some testing and the 530 grain Hammer Head from Garrett out penetrated even the .458 Win. Mag. load that was tested.

    http://www.sixgunner.com/linebaugh/penetration_test.htm
     
  16. turbonatr

    turbonatr Senior Member Millennium Member

    Messages:
    1,100
    Likes Received:
    9
    Joined:
    Jul 4, 1999
    Location:
    N.E., PA
    Yup, well aware of John's penetration tests. The most recent done included the 500S&W magnum which didn't do any better than the 454 Casull.

    The 45-70 and 458 penetration comparison isn't an apples to apples to comparison as the 45-70 slug that went deeper was 30gr. heavier. One of the things learned from that test was that bullet weight had more of an impact than velocity with regards to penetration. You also must take into account that the test bullet from the 458 veered off course during it's travel impacting the wood floor and then making its way back into the test medium. This, of course, will alter it's ability to penetrate. A shot straight through the test medium I am sure would result in deeper penetration.
     
  17. Dogbite

    Dogbite DNT TREAD ON ME

    Messages:
    3,031
    Likes Received:
    73
    Joined:
    May 20, 2000
    Location:
    Tennessee
    Oh--sorry.The 45-70 will approach the power level of the 458 win mag.The elephant that was killed with the 45-70 said he couldnt tell the difference.
     
  18. turbonatr

    turbonatr Senior Member Millennium Member

    Messages:
    1,100
    Likes Received:
    9
    Joined:
    Jul 4, 1999
    Location:
    N.E., PA
    So long as you have enough penetration, shot placement is the key with dangerous game. Naturally a heavy slug from a 45-70 will do the job. Of course, an even fast, heavier slug (like from a 458WM) will do it a bit better (or at the very least add a degree of insurance).
     
  19. muddydog

    muddydog

    Messages:
    78
    Likes Received:
    0
    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2004
    Location:
    Tulsa
    btw..

    2 more deer were DRT in phenomenal fashion last week to the .444.
    as always very little meat was wasted...but very impressive knock downs with lights out.
     
  20. freakshow10mm

    freakshow10mm 10mm Advocate

    Messages:
    6,902
    Likes Received:
    13
    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2003
    Location:
    Michigan's Upper Peninsula
    Went out and put a guide gun 45-70 on layaway at the LGS last Wednesday.