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1911 and Glock, the bad and the ugly?

  1. "Finally , a topic about shooting
    I'm curious
    What is different sa glok and 1911?
    My friends shoot both w/ no prob naman please relate"

    First, these are just my opinions from my experience.

    Anybody who had handled a glock and a 1911 can compare the differences b/n these two great pistols. These are quite obvious. From design, manufacturing, materials used, weight, rifling, trigger,handling characteristics, feel, etc. THey are miles apart from each other. Different hardwares need different softwares. At least thats my experience. And logic.

    I had learned to shoot a pistol first w/ a glock in 2004. I shot it in Prod div in 9mm then later in Std div in cal.40. In my early days in std div w/ a glock, my buddies and most competitors are one in opinion that I was at a disadvantage w/ a glock competing w/ 1911-equipped shooters. But my belief was that I was at an advantage w/ a gk35. And my match results attested that I was right in my belief. In both divs I had good results w/ a glock.

    Then after the Bog Anniv shoot last Nov 2006, I decided that my 2007 new years resolution would be to shoot 1911 in standards.

    :hugs: I thought it would be a walk in the park. But, boy, I was mistaken! As all shooters who are in the same line of thinking, i think. Whatever skills I had for glock, I could not carry them over to my 1911! Oh yes, I can shoot the 1911 in any situation but not in a PPSA sanctioned IPSC match! And w/ not so good results.

    In the first 2 months, the moment I drew my para from my rig, my confidence was gone. Its s.a. trigger bothered me so i must be carefull or i might a.d. At presentation, the sights would not automatically align w/ my target as they used to be in my g35 bcos the grip angle is different and its weight is really heavy and balances queerly in my hands. Whenever I had to reload, my thumb must reach out hard to hit the mag release button and my weak hand had to firmly grab the spare mag bcos its much heavier and slippery. Its recoil impulse is different so much so that my glock timing is totally off. The first time I encountered these realities, I nearly gave up. Thought it was easier to return and shoot my g35 and improve on it than to shoot my para but start from square one and learn new technics thats applicable for 1911. The latter option though more difficult in my situation, got the better of me. Now, three mos. into 2007, Im still struggling w/ my para. But Im happy w/ it.:)

    I envy those who can shoot both 1911 and glock w/ profficiency. Me, I have to give up one to learn the other. I can only serve one master at a time. Or maybe, it depends on how I define the word "shoot.";)
     
  2. your answer is drifire. Si JR speed. uses a glock sa production and 1911 sa standard. he is very good with both platforms, but practice pa rin ang kailangan.

    Currently, I suck at steel with my LDA but im very proficient with my SVI on steel.

    this is due to lack of practice/dryfire. But i will concentrate using the LDA till i can see my name in the top 3 in production division like sa standard division.

    Ill give it 6 months, If i fail ill sell this sucker and go back to standard division:thumbsup:
     
  3. if i'm not mistaken...

    there was a timejerome morales and jag lejano briefly switched to glocks and had good results.
    anthony sy is now competing with a glock 17, iirc he would take 1st place every now and then
     
  4. Maybe I can switch btn 2 platforms after learning good the 1911. On 2nd thought, di kaya practicing on one platform eats up your time and attention you are supposed to spend on the other plarform? Also, maybe they can do it as long as the glock is 9mm and the 1911 is major cal. What if both are in .40? in my experience, the diff in recoil impulse is very noticeable when both are in .40. And diff. recoil management often results to different technic. Or, it is also possible to be good on both but not as masterfully if you only practice one platform.

    Too many variables, too many ifs...makes it more interesting. But if I try to tread each path of variables I might get lost and end up nowhere.:upeyes:
     
  5. What Im really saying is, transitioning from one platform to another requires lots of time and correct practice. I cant just jump from one to the other like flicking a switch. Each has its pecularities that require careful study and learning. As Jason says, dry fire, practice, range time, etc... whatever, it must be done correctly and cannot be rushed. Never a walk in the park. But never be afraid of change...
     
  6. mahirap talaga mag transition between platforms. dryfire and range time kelangan.

    but its more fun kickin' butt with your g35 all those 1911 jocks, di ba? :supergrin:
     
  7. Not exactly, doc. Though I admit kickin' butt is really fun, he he he...it doesnt happen often enough to earn braggin' rights;) The greatest satisfaction for me is the challenge. It is because of my great respect to you 1911 shooters.

    Btw doc, totoo ba abstain ka daw ngayon sa shooting? Yan balita ko sa BRPG nung hinanap kita.
     
  8. I used to be a std shooter, nag production lang ako just when I stopped shooting
    Binigay lang ng PBD yung baril ko just a week before the Prod Nationals
    Parang buong linggo hawak ko yung baril pati pagtulog hehe

    The guys abve are corrct
    Dryfire lng katapat nyan ( wag mo rin bitawan ng isang linggo hehe )
    Pero stick w/ one gun muna gugulo lang muscle memory mo
    Pagsanay na sanay ka na sa isa , mas madali mag switch sa ibang platform
    Plus stop thinking mahirap , isispin mo madali :) it helps
     
  9. P-G: No, wala pa kasi yung PTT ko. Besides, Sat. may work pa ako. I just applied last weekend through armscor. Since nasunog Comelec building, baka matagalan na release ng mga ptt's.

    I tried Mark the Spark's G35 last weekend. Very good sight combo and trigger pull!

    the only thing that bothers me with the glocks is the high incidence rates of slide breakages. di bale sana kung madali magpa warranty sa mga local dealers.
     

  10. sakin di pa dating:sad:
     
  11. Pagnagkataon pala, you can't shoot the whole election season. Abt work, storbo talaga yan sa shooting so what I did was avoid it as much as possible. You can always follow my footsteps if you want. :supergrin: I wont charge any royalty to a BoG.

    Up to now, my g35 wears dawson fo front and glk rear. I use green fo, red/orange is too bright for me bcoz when the target requires greater precision I usually concentrate on the black outlines of the sights. And my trigger was stock w/ 3.5# connector. I was and will always be interested in improving the trigger as atmarcella had in another thread. I will try to see him in san pablo on the 31st to share w/ his trigger success. I dont know Mark the Spark. How improved was his glock trigger? Hope i can meet him in the future.

    I know you are aware of the breakage of my gk35 slide 2 yrs(?) ago. It can be avoided by using snap cap while dry firing., Or use a glockmeister trigger reset kit, w/c is the best option, I think. Otherwise, the whole pistol is very durable w/ or w/o any mods.

    W/ your predicament now, hindi ka ba nagkaka-withdrawal symptoms?:shocked: If it worsens, come to my range anytime. you can shoot my g35 there to your heart's content. Pati ammo mayron dun palagi. Sagot ko slide breakage, just in case. Sagot mo lang pamasahe... :wavey:
     
  12. PG,
    this is what JR of lonewolf adviced me to do. I did everything except the polishing part(tamad pa ako eh)

    For a great trigger I would go with the LWD 3.5 connector, LWD Ultimate Trigger Stop, Wolff 4 lb striker spring and Wolf 6 lb trigger spring. Polish these parts & the trigger bar and you should be in the 2lb trigger pull area.
    JR

    Mark
     
  13. Most shooters have the same experience as yours.

    The skill required to shoot each platform is different but the basics of good pistol shooting remain the same.

    - proper mental focus
    - breath control
    - balanced grip and stance
    - proper sight picture : front sight
    - follow-through

    With the 1911 and a light SA trigger, you can basically slap that thing around while with the Glock, you have to roll with it.
     
  14. I have never shot competition; although I know that "Production Division" is for factory double action pistols i.e.CZ75s, Para LDA,BerettaM9s etc -Glock pistols included while "Standard Division" is for SA Pistols like 1911 without optics and compensators/ports/...My question is this...What if there was another division wherein you merge standard and production together? Who/which do you think will win most if not all the time? Would it then be safe to say that the winning pistol is the better tool for what it is made for? To put it another way; the original intended use of a pistol is to kill; whether such action by the user is criminal or just is beside the point; when the pistols in question here are challenged or tested by proficient users in competition and one always beats the other, then again, is that pistol better? Just wondering because these 2 "platforms" are mostly used by us here in RP :upeyes:
     
  15. Advocates of competiton shooting will get a lot of people disagreeing if it is truly beneficial or not for everyday ccw situations.

    I view competition as a way to hone my shooting skills, but just that! Nothing else! It doesn't train me to think tactically or to be street wise.

    And I have no qualms that my being an ipsc shooter will get me out of a gunfight alive, if ever, but competition develops good shooting skills and that what I point my pistol at, I know I can hit accurately. Pag present mo ng pistol, naka align na agad sights mo and you are already on target and ready to shoot. Tawag nila doon, muscle memory.
     
  16. A very clear and precised quote there doc!

    :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
     
  17. Thanks for the info. I will try it.
     

  18. The winner will be the std 1911 ( hindi out of the box 1911 )
    It's just too easy to shoot
     
  19. Originally posted by maskytrading
    "...My question is this...What if there was another division wherein you merge standard and production together? Who do you think will win most if not all the time? Is it then safe to say that the winning pistol is the better tool for what it is made for? "

    Masky, think your theoretical "Div" always exist every time we shoot w/ our buddies, each using their competition guns either in prod, std, open or mod. In practice matches, there is no div classification, basta laro lang but w/ score/time. It always happens that the shooter who is most proficient w/ his gun wins. Proof that its not the gun nor the caliber, whether maj or minor, but the one behind the gun that wins the game.
     

  20. So dapat pagsamahin na ang std at prod division?
    I dont think the std shooters would mind
     
  21. P-G, they already said everything. Good luck na lang with your new 1911, i'm sure you will eventually master it and place on top of standard division.

    To answer masky's question, just by comparing hit factors in the batangas match, top standard shooters have higher hit factors than the top production shooters. That would mean if you combine the two divisions, standard shooters would beat production shooters. Open shooters of course will beat everyone....hehehe:bringiton: :tongueout:
     
  22. sir pano naman yung standard single stack? hehehe
     
  23. +1 mahirap talaga gamitin ang glock lalo na pag nasanay ka sa 1911. i have nothing against the glock, it's a great gun but it needs a lot of live fire and dry fire to master the trigger pull, yun pa naman ang nakakatakot gawin sa glock, yung extensive dry fire.
     
  24. What I was saying was not based on this matches but on informal practice matches we ourselves design, put up and shoot w/ our buddies in our own ranges. In such inf. matches, its not always the open shooters who wins and std beating pd shooters. It all depends on the skill level of each shooter not on their eqpt. Say, if the top pd shooter in the Phil would practice w/ me in a COF, I will surely loss even if I use the best std gun in the world. Got my drift?

    And aiming to place on top of std div is not my reason in putting up this thread. so dont be too sure on that.:shocked:
     
  25. Thanks, Im trying to find a way to acquire any of the 2. Best if I can try your set-up first but its physically not possible for now. TIA.
     
  26. If we are talking about same skill level, the gun will surely make a difference. The same shooter using an open gun, standard gun and production gun, considering that he have mastered all platforms, will have different results. It is just to easy to shoot an open gun compared to a standard gun, same as it is easier to shoot a standard gun compared to a production gun. So same shooter and same COF, shooter will get best results with an open gun then standard and least with a production gun.

    That's not what i meant about the purpose of the thread and aiming for top std. Ang alam ko lang kasi and from what i see eh talented ka talaga kaya someday you will eventually be one of the seeded std shooters. :thumbsup:
     

  27. sino na ba std shooters from bicol ngayon?
    does Jo Dacudao still shoot? great shooter and a good guy
     
  28. Amen to your 1st paragraph.

    Thanks to your confidence in me but Im not that gifted/talented. Its just practice, practice, practice...In my opinion, if all of you will practice as hard as I do, sigurado most if not all will beat me. Also, time is not on my side. I started in this sport at age 43-44 and at 47 now, its a bit far-out to aim for the top. Its just my attitude to do my best in whatever I do. But its a given that my best is not necessarily the best out there.

    To give everybody a hint on how hard I practice on and off the range, I developed a tennis elbow in my left arm from dry and live fire practices. I had it since last year, 2 mos. before the PPSA Natls in Paoay, Ilocos. I was injected w/ steroids 2x already in a span of 6mos. and advised to rest for a month or 2. But the injury persisted because I could not resist practicing. The injury is so severe now that the pain hinders my daily routine. Hope I wont need to give-up this sport in the near future...:sad:
     
  29. Maraming std shooters in bicol now. In fact, its the top drawer div here. Retired na si Jo d. Di ko na inabot pero magaling daw talaga. Same w/ Robert Chan. Robert was more in the Open pero unbeatable daw sa std in his prime dito. Virtually walang makapag-guide samin in our developments here now. Malas ko lang. Kaya gawa ko puro research in books, mags, internet and from YOU guy/gals. And experiment a lot.

    For info, Si Boy Tolentino, ang magaling naming gunsmith, is a great shooter in std here.
     

  30. Yeah , I know Boy
    Retired na rin pala si Robert
    Si Jo ang parati ko kabiruan sa matches dati , ang alam ko sa tennis na yata siya nahilig

    just to comment on your previous post
    Bihira naman ang talented
    Yung iniisip ng iba na talent is not
    Nakikita ko difference ng magagaling na shooter is the attitude


    I dont think age is too big a factor kung stad div
    Tingnan mo sa Pible , how old is he , 70 na yata yun pero mabilis pa rin hindi lang sa shooting hehe but he works hard and maganda attitude nya

    btw, I think your on the right track sa shooting career mo
     
  31. I've been shooting, plinking, hunting ever since I can remember except during several years of martial law but never in competition...I'm about to become T3 in a few months time but I'm giving IPSC competition(standard division) a second thought because of the post above...only problem is I have to buy a new holster again, the one I bought and never used(amadini) last year, I traded it in for .22AirRifle
     
  32. masky: it's never too late to try ipsc. gundog started 3-4 yrs ago and he's turning 61 this april. madami na yang pinaiyak na kalaban 1/3 his age! hahaha!

    what pistol will you use in standard division?

    CR speed holster and its clones pa rin ang safest design wise.

    paturo ka ng mga diskarte kay Edgar and Cute!
     
  33. Doc, so you shoot in PBD range,also; maybe you are one of the MDs who shoot there with Surgical Face Masks on??... I consider it my "home" range as it is near where I reside...I have an .45 Imperial Defence Platform HC with almost all the entrails replaced or extended and repainted...maybe will replace the old barrel unramped with a ramped bull...BTW, the cause of trade-in of the Amadini which PBD was selling at about 6.5K during that time was that my pistol won't lock in snugly. I'll try that CR holster you recommended ...Two weeks ago Cute offered me a brand new .40 SPS HC for standard div , was so tempted to get it but a prior commitment had to be resolved first
     
  34. Kung diskarte sa comp, okay naman seguro sina Cute and Edgar.
    Ingat lang na huwag mapunta sa lessons on diskarte ng concealed carry.

    I've said it time and again...
    Do NOT under any circumstances allow Cute to demonstrate the
    Pinoy-Mexican holsterless carry technique with any firearm you intend
    to handle afterwards... unless you intend to shoot with gloves on,
    or brought Lysol wipes/dunk for the blaster.

    :shocked: :shocked: :shocked:
    :tongueout:
     

  35. hehe patay ako kay tolits

    IPSC is not physicaly demanding so anyone can start at any age, the youngest I've seen was 11 or 12
    I'ts very similar to golf , more mental than physical
    Demanding din sa wallet
     
  36. hehehe! no, i don't frequent PBD as often as before. I'll try to pass by one of these days with pogi and taurus and darth board. what days are you there?

    sayang yung .40 hi cap na SPS, prob. belonged to one of the members of team PB who upgraded to an STI. Pareho naman performance ng dalawa.

    and as horge said, huwag na huwag mo pa demo pinoy-mexican carry kay CUte! hahaha!
     
  37. I have no "must" days going to PBD range, I just go when I feel like going or when my trigger finger itches but lately I come late at about 3-4pm till closing time 6pm...The owner of the new SPS .40 alleged by Cute is migrating stateside and wants to dispose urgently @140K iirc a week or so ago...doc EC, kindly tell me the background of Cute's pinoy/mex carry:upeyes:
     
  38. i'll just let horge tell cute's pinoy style mex carry! hahaha!
     
  39. This is strange!

    After practicing nothing but w/ a 1911 for months, I shot a glock pistol and I was amazed that the 1911 improved my glock shooting a lot! Hows that?!:shocked:
     
  40. btw, gano katagal bago napalitan g35 mo bro?sakin nasa HK na raw sabi ng trust trade, pero since Dec pa yun, parang natatagalan na ako
     
  41. Less than 2 months. Pinadala ko direct to glk Austria upon advise from glk HK. Glk HK then ask for the gunstore of my choice where they will send the new slide. At that time hindi pa trusstrade ang sole dist. ng glk dito. You may email glk HK to inquire its status at [email protected] . Hth
     
  42. Hahaha, the glock is your destiny. :supergrin:

    Regarding your tennis elbow, try mo yung titanium bracelet with magnets. Effective kay gundog, nawala yung sakit nya.
     
  43. san po meron ng t. bracelet? Nagkatennis elbow din si gundog sa kadadryfire?
     
  44. si gundog kasi puro rayuma na, tanda na e! pero he swears by the titanium bracelet with the magnets!


    Amega yung brand ng bracelet ni gundog. si Saki alam san nakakabili.
     
  45. Hindi, yung sa kanya due to age lang talaga...hahaha:supergrin:

    Si saki meron kilala nagbebenta, doon din nakuha ni gundog yung bracelet nya.
     
  46. Thanks mga bro. I will PM saki.