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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Well I picked up 1k of 165 grain (yes, 165) and am trying to figure out a good starting load. I want to use CFE pistol powder, but I can't find any guys loading anything over 147 grain bullets. I normally load 147 grain with 4.3 grains of CFE.

I was thinking of starting at around 2.8 grains and then working up. Or should I start a little higher?
 

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For 9mm minor, about where I would start, maybe 3-3.1gr? I have loaded 165gr with faster powders, just looking for 775fps. When working off the book, I will load 2 rds each, increasing 1/10gr at a time. Shoot them in order to verify functioning & any oddities that could be higher pressure (like no vel increase or spike in vel). So no issue starting really low & seeing how the vel per charge graphs out. I doubt you stick a plated bullet but just be cautious of that with starting charges. Of course as usual, YMMV, you are responsible for what you put into your gun. no choro, I wouldn't even go there.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I actually did some deeper digging and found a couple posts on the interwebs of guys using cfe pistol and 165 grain bullets.

I will try 2.8 to start and slowly go up of needed.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Just got done loading a test batch. I made 5 of each of the following charges.

2.8
2.9
3.0
3.1
3.2
3.3
3.4

I will see which yields the most desirable results. OAL stayed my normal 1.16" I'll hit the range after work tomorrow and see what I come up with.
 

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Just got done loading a test batch. I made 5 of each of the following charges.

2.8
2.9
3.0
3.1
3.2
3.3
3.4

I will see which yields the most desirable results. OAL stayed my normal 1.16" I'll hit the range after work tomorrow and see what I come up with.
Chrono?? I ran 3.3gr of WST, quite a bit faster, for 760s in a 5". It was a test run, switched to 160gr Bayou. The Bayou run over 810fps with the same charge.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Don't have one. I don't really care what the velocity is. I go for what feels good, shoots good, and is accurate. I know what low power rounds feel like and I know what +p charges feel like.

Between that and inspecting brass, I can get a good load developed. So far that hasn't failed me for any caliber I load.
 

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Don't have one. I don't really care what the velocity is. I go for what feels good, shoots good, and is accurate. I know what low power rounds feel like and I know what +p charges feel like.

Between that and inspecting brass, I can get a good load developed. So far that hasn't failed me for any caliber I load.
That’s fine for 124’s using book data. With 165’s in 9mm and 200’s in .40 it’s a good way to have a kaboom.
 

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Don't have one. I don't really care what the velocity is. I go for what feels good, shoots good, and is accurate. I know what low power rounds feel like and I know what +p charges feel like.

Between that and inspecting brass, I can get a good load developed. So far that hasn't failed me for any caliber I load.
Consider buying one if you are running w/o data. It helps you see a pattern of vel gain, it should always be linear, as in 1/10gr yields say 25fps. When you see smaller or greater than the linear progression, you are probably approaching max. Otherwise, sticking to book data is more prudent.
 
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What was the felt recoil like? I imagine these would feel crazy soft with some slightly faster powder.
Yes stupid soft & will run in most stock guns. I did not like the slide response in my 1911 though, too slow, you are actually waiting on the slide in fast shooting. In a g26, easy to shoot fast.
 

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Ban Hamster
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Don't have one. I don't really care what the velocity is. I go for what feels good, shoots good, and is accurate. I know what low power rounds feel like and I know what +p charges feel like.

Between that and inspecting brass, I can get a good load developed. So far that hasn't failed me for any caliber I load.
Then you've been lucky.
 
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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
I guess I don't see the need for my uses. I start with a definitely low charge, and try that, and then based off of the results of the low charge, I either stay with that, or go up until the gun cycles reliably and the accuracy is good. I'm not looking to meet any power factors or velocities. Just make some fun plinking ammo.

Perhaps some day I'll get one but for now this method seems to be working great.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
I understand that fully. But, with the powder I use, and how mild I am loading, I can't see how anything could go bad pressure wise. I could understand if I was using a really fast powder where a little bit of variation could mean a huge pressure spike, but CFE isn't all that fast, and I'm starting out well below what I've found as a good load.

I found guys reporting (and load data is always taken with a grain of salt, which is why I always drop it a bit) that they were running this exact bullet, 165 grain xtreme, with 3.6 grains of CFE. Another guy stated 3.5 gave him the best results.

I'm not trying to sound like a know it all and not listening but with the components I'm using, I feel that there isn't a risk of loading a round that will be over pressure. Or should I say, a starting round that is over.

If 2.8 grains cycles the gun reliably and doesn't show any signs of of over pressure on the brass, then I'll stick with that. My goal is to use as little powder as possible to obtain a round that will shoot good and cycle reliably. Cardboard doesn't seem to care if I meet a certain power factor. And it's not what I use for training. Just fun.
 

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If you're using range brass, you might want to pay attention to the headstamp. Particularly if it's IMT, Ammoland or FM. If you look inside those cases, you'll see a small stepped rim on the inside of the case towards the base. The Xtreme 165gr is a pretty long bullet and if you seat them deep enough, the base of the bullet will swage itself on that rim in the case and may make things more exciting than you want for plinking ammo...
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I use a mix of range brass and brass that I've shot from new ammo I bought.

I do however inspect each and every case before it get put into the case feeder or loaded.

If I don't recognize the head stamp it gets chucked and obviously stepped cases get chucked as well. So far I've only ever found 4 of the stepped cases. They were maxi tech iirc. I also usually ditch the aquilla brass. The majority are xtreme, buffalo, Starline, and R P. Some winchester and Sig mixed in.
 

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Ban Hamster
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Getting a chrono is just a suggestion.

Checking straight-wall brass for pressure signs is like reading tea leaves, in the dark.
 
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
I'm not sure what you mean by that? You mean there's no point in inspecting the case after firing a new load and looking for things such as the case being distorted or getting hammered on the head area?

For instance, I've picked up some 45 acp brass that was definitely loaded up pretty hot. The head stamp was pretty much smoothed out and the edges were rounded off. From what I gather that's from the round being slammed into the slide when fired and beating up the brass. Those cases were discarded but just something I noticed and researched. I haven't found any 9mm cases like that yet though.
 

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Yes, but off-the-books is off-the-books - 'feel' can be deceiving.
Feel can be irrelevant. I've sen guns come apart from what feels like a moderate load.
 
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