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What causes this?

Discussion in 'Reloading' started by attrapereves, May 12, 2014.

  1. attrapereves

    attrapereves

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    Sep 11, 2011
    Midwest
    I noticed that some of my 30-06 reloads appear to have copper or brass shaving near the case mouth. It's difficult to tell if the case or the bullet is shaving.

    Has anyone had this problem before? The bullets are Hornady 165gr SP boat tail.

    [​IMG]
     
  2. dkf

    dkf

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    Aug 6, 2010
    Looks like the copper was shaved off of the bullet when seating. Not good and it can negatively affect accuracy. Put an adequate chamfer on the inside of the case mouth.
     


  3. concretus

    concretus

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    May 3, 2014
    +1
    After you trim your brass, us a chamfer tool to bevel the inside and outside edges of the case mouth. The beveled edge will fall into the cannelure when you crimp it
     
  4. fredj338

    fredj338

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    First, you almost NEVER need to crimp rifle bullets. Yes, chamfer the inside of the case mouth, outside, just remove any burrs, no chamfer. Bullets with nicked or shaved bases never shoot well.
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2014
  5. concretus

    concretus

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    May 3, 2014
    I agree I don't crimp for any of my bolt guns. The only one I crimp is my reloads that match M80 specs for my LR 308... The guy mentioned hornady 165 SPBT which as far as I can remember has a cannelure and if you look at the case pictured looks like It has a factory type crimp.....
     
  6. fredj338

    fredj338

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    Well you really should not crimp unless there is a cannelure or crimp groove. Even then, you still need a good chamfer inside the neck top prevent bas scraping.
     
  7. attrapereves

    attrapereves

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    Sep 11, 2011
    Midwest
    No crimp on these. The markings must be from the brass when they were factory loaded.
     
  8. Wil Terry

    Wil Terry

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    Nov 28, 2001
    AND THE SEATING DIE is probably mal-adjusted with the crimp ring touching the end of the case mouth and not allowing it to expand as the bullet is being seated. The crimp ring should be kept out of the way by being ONE full die turn above the case mouth.
     
  9. Gpruitt54

    Gpruitt54

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    Jul 18, 2012
    This is a great thread. I am about to start reloading rifle bullets for an AR. First a comment and then some questions.

    For what the OP described and showed in his photo (excellent photo buy the way), for a handgun load, I would have expected the issue to be not enough case mouth flare. I did this on my first few handgun reloads.
    Questions:


    • Why is this not the case with rifle rounds?
    • I have started prepping (tumbling and de-crimping) a few .223 cases. Is there a case mouth flaring step with rifle dies?
    • Why do you crimp Semi-Auto rifle rounds but not bolt gun rounds?
     
  10. fredj338

    fredj338

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    Because unless you are loading lead bullets there is not need to flare the case mouth & in fact, (2) die sets do NOT have a flare die. They rely on a good chamfer on the inside of the case mouth.
    I do not crimp semiauto rounds, proper neck tension is enough to prevent setback. Some do, feeling that the self feeding action will cause a bullet setback. Maybe, maybe not, but my match bullets have no crimp ring or cannelure, so no crimp. Some say the LFCD for rifles aids accuracy, we'll see, I bought one for my AR rounds.:dunno: I do crimp rifle rounds for the heavy big bores. The recoil can actually drive the bullet back into the case. Really bad if you need that 2nd or 3rd shot to stop a dangerous animal charge.
     
    Last edited: May 16, 2014
  11. concretus

    concretus

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    May 3, 2014
    I only crimp on my AR with a bullet that has a cannelure. They are pulled 147gr FMJ and I load them to meet M80 specs for plinking. For my 308 target and hunting loads for my AR and my bolt guns the bullet does not have a cannelure so a friction hold is all That is needed. Rifle dies do not flare the case mouths.... What bullet are you planning to used in your 223 loads?
     
  12. Gpruitt54

    Gpruitt54

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    Currently, I have Hornady 100, 55gr soft tip with a cannelure. I will be trying out several bullet types and designs to see what works best for me. Have not loaded any rifle rounds yet.
     
  13. fredj338

    fredj338

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    I would start out NOT crimping, then try a light crimp if you feel the need. The only bullet setback I ahev ever had in an AR was with some of my home swaged 56gr. One bullet may have been just 0.0005"smaller.:dunno:
     
  14. concretus

    concretus

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    May 3, 2014
    Did you full length size or neck size your brass? if the marks on the case mouth were like that when the factory loaded them then you didn't trim the brass; correct?
     
  15. concretus

    concretus

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    May 3, 2014
    Crimping may not be required. For semi-autos; full length size and trim your brass, chamfer the case mouth, make primer pockets clean and flash holes uniform, Mic your OAL, to insure mag fit and bullet set back off the lands. You can be a little tighter / closer tolerances with a bolt gun but with semi autos, functionality is a must and then your accuracy will come with the right bullet/powder combination....
     
  16. attrapereves

    attrapereves

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    Sep 11, 2011
    Midwest
    Full length sized. Brass was trimmed, but very little as it was only slightly over spec.

    I bought a Lyman chamfer tool that is 200% better than the crappy Lee one.
     
  17. Gpruitt54

    Gpruitt54

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    I hope to make some .223 rounds over the holiday weekend. My first round to two will be with no powder or primer, must to be sure I got and measurements right. If I need to pull a .223 round, will a standard bullet puller work on a rifle round; with or without a crimp???
     
  18. Gpruitt54

    Gpruitt54

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    Jul 18, 2012
    I saw someone on Youtube testing the need to apply a crimp to a rifle round by pressing the tip somewhat hard, against a surface to see if it would set back. Does this sound like a reasonable test?

    How would you determine the need to crimp or not?
     
  19. F106 Fan

    F106 Fan

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    Oct 19, 2011
    What do you define as a standard bullet puller?

    If you mean 'ballistic hammer' then, yes, it will work. Crimped rounds may take more whacks.

    If you mean Hornady collet style puller - yes, it will work very well. I prefer the collet style for pulling rifle bullets. However, I don't reuse them.

    Richard