close

Privacy guaranteed - Your email is not shared with anyone.

What are the "left/liberal" things you get?

Discussion in 'The Okie Corral' started by Rabbi, Mar 7, 2013.

  1. Al Czervik

    Al Czervik My arm!

    2,845
    571
    Aug 18, 2006
    Bushwood
    Regarding the so called "separation of church and state."
    It seems that the interpretations of the First Amendment by the courts have morphed into freedom from, rather than freedom of religion as viewed by the public in general.

    No, I don't identify with left leaning things.
     
  2. Mrs.Cicero

    Mrs.Cicero Wayward Member

    4,592
    521
    Aug 13, 2004
    far from home
    Any person over the age of consent has the right to marry anyone of the opposite gender also over the age of consent. That spouse may certainly visit their spouse in the hospital. If anyone wants someone of the same gender to be able to visit them in the hospital, they can simply give that person healthcare power of attorney.

    The next argument I usually hear is that "I" have the right to marry the person I love, and everyone else should have that right, too. That doesn't work, though, because we don't allow pedophiles to marry the children they claim to "love," and we don't (yet) allow polygamous or polyandrous marriages among a crowd of people who "love" each other. We don't allow people to marry adult mental incompetents they "love." "Love" is a bs reason for the gov't to use to define marriage.

    My solution would still solve the problem better than anything anyone else has offered. Get the gov't out of the marriage business entirely. The gov't can offer civil unions to any mentally competent person over the age of consent, ensuring determination of next-of-kin, inheritance, benefits... hell if they actually wrote the law correctly, they could fix the current problems with alimony awards. Marriages would be performed by a church which determines whom it will marry and whom it won't, and neither a civil union nor a marriage would require the other.

    What is wrong with this? Everyone gets what they want. Civil Unions with bennies, Marriages with the blessing of God, churches that can act within their conscience, and the gov't still gets the price of the license. Why is this a problem?
     

  3. Abortion...although a personally repugnant procedure, having the GOVERNMENT tell a woman what she can/cannot do with her OWN body is even MORE repugnant.
     
  4. Mrs.Cicero

    Mrs.Cicero Wayward Member

    4,592
    521
    Aug 13, 2004
    far from home
    I find murder more repugnant.
     
  5. The gay marriage debate is all about the tax code...they want their bennies just like us "breeders". :supergrin:

    If we went to the Fair Tax or a flat tax for EVERYONE, this issue, IMO, would disappear.
     
  6. This is exactly the problem...

    No one side...the "No Abortions Ever" pro-life crowd and the "Abortions for Everyone!" pro-choice will EVER get what they want.

    This issue will never be resolved. I thereby default to the individual who, ultimately, has to live with the consequences of their decision.
     
  7. Diesel McBadass

    Diesel McBadass Tactically Epic

    10,316
    720
    Apr 15, 2011
    Dover NH
    seems a majority here are supporting gay marraige, or are against legislating it didnt think it would be that high. A good sign.
     
  8. Hawkwood

    Hawkwood

    1,085
    2
    Feb 9, 2009
    Oregon
    I have no problem with gay marriage whatsoever. I support a gay man or woman's right to be as miserable as the rest of us. :) Seriously...it just doesn't bother me, nor does it cheapen or demean my marriage, or my right to be married. If anyone or anything cheapened or demeaned my marriage, it would have been the two people involved in it.

    I am also pro-choice. My hope is that women would CHOOSE not to have an abortion. But I do not believe you can legislate morality. Moreover, since I do not have a vajayjay...I don't feel comfortable telling someone else what they should be doing with a situation that is completely their responsibility. Their body, their choice. Of course, this is in general conflict with the vast majority of liberal ideas, where they have no issue telling everyone else how to live and what to do in infinitum...but I'll let them shoulder the mantle of hypocrisy. For me, I'll have none of it.
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2013
  9. Will Beararms

    Will Beararms Millennium Member

    3,141
    2,285
    Oct 12, 1999
    Parts Unknown
    America no longer has the right to look down upon the SS or Gestapo or anyone complicit in the Holocaust. They only killed 6-12 million people. We have killed over 50 million in our death camps.

    ANY national politician should be forced to watch an abortion being performed prior to voting on any bill pertaining to it. The Catholic Diocese serving Wichita, KS showed one performed on a child in the latter stages of pregnancy one Sunday evening on local TV in the 1980's. I still squirm thinking of it. I became Pro Life that night.
     
  10. Diesel McBadass

    Diesel McBadass Tactically Epic

    10,316
    720
    Apr 15, 2011
    Dover NH
    problem with abortion is both sides are to the extremes. I say before life signs, yes, after, no. When the transition is made from group of celss to living human no more abortion.

    The life begins at conception crowd and the unregulated abortion on demand crowd are way too crazy to ever compromise.
     
  11. Glock20 10mm

    Glock20 10mm Use Linux!

    Pretty much my stance as well. In a truly free society the individual has the right to choose their course in life and they accept the consequences of those choices. Our society is not free and hasn't been for some time.

    Religion again is a personal choice to engage in and one mans religion should not be the dictate of law for all men, regardless what their dogma dictates. Again in a truly free society where the recognition of God's granting of free will all men should be able to live their life and exercise their choices without having others deny or denounce them for their choices.

    If you are of a religious bent then it is not our place to determine innocence or guilt of a persons choice of lifestyle and beliefs. That is for the deity to decide. Now in the case of capital crimes or crimes against others that do not result in death or injury then the onus falls upon we the people to try those accused in a fair court then punish in accordance with findings based on evidence and fact.

    Same goes with women and their right to choose what to do with their body. It is not mans place to dictate right or wrong, again if you are of religious bent then the deity will make the final arbitration. It is not ours to make.

    Also as pointed out by others, environmentalism to a point. I do believe we need to be better caretakers of our environment that we can find a nice balance of carbon based, nuclear and "green" energy production methods. I like clean air and water... but not at the expense of deterring the freedoms of people. I also believe we need to be better at managing our wildlife resources. We as a species are intelligent enough to see the damage we do, we can still enjoy hunting and such but we need to be a bit better at managing it. And I mean both ways.
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2013
  12. Glock20 10mm

    Glock20 10mm Use Linux!

    But you are basing your opinion of aberration based on religious text, the fact is evident in all of nature that it's not as much of an aberration as you believe it to be. A simple study of other mammals shows it's rather not an aberration and ironically we are the only species that seems to have an issue with it.
     
  13. Hauptmann6

    Hauptmann6

    4,270
    129
    May 22, 2002
    Portage, MI
    Pretty much anything that is the opposite of the religious views.

    Small government means small government. Not restrictive in other ways.
     
  14. HollowHead

    HollowHead Firm member

    24,456
    2,057
    May 16, 2005
    Where the buffalo roam
    People can marry trees for all I care. Just don't ask me to pay for it.

    On a more serious note, as someone who spends a great deal of time in the wilderness public lands must remain sacrosanct, untouched and unexploited. HH
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2013
  15. John Rambo

    John Rambo Raven

    12,745
    822
    Feb 15, 2010
    Tampa, Fl.
    Equal rights, partially socialized healthcare (not the abortion we've got now), the right to have control over your own body (suicide, abortion, etc), adherence to separation of church and state, due process, their approach of rehabilitating rather than incarcerating when dealing with people with mental or emotional problems...I'm sure there are more.

    I actually agree of a lot of what they stand for. Mind you the Democrats in office, as well as the Republicans in office, today do not represent the values of either party.
     
  16. Wow.....just.....wow.

    Marriage has been around FAR longer than any Christian faith group, so trying to say "it's a church thing" is incredibly arrogant. Staking a claim on something that existed before the Church? Really?

    And then you come back to the pedophile thing, and that stupid, STUPID comment that so many people have used about "any person over the age of consent has the right to marry anyone of the opposite gender also over the age of consent."

    Pedophilia is NOT THE SAME! You said it yourself, the determining factor is CONSENT. A child cannot consent.

    Think about it this way, if you insist on using pedophilia as an excuse: Gay marriage is illegal at the federal level right now. That has remarkably stopped all pedophilia, right? That's the same stupid argument as holding up Chicago's gun ban to demonstrate how gun control works: Guns were illegal there for nearly 3 decades, and completely did away with firearms homicides, right?



    The pure hypocrisy in some people between the gay marriage and gun rights issues is astonishing.
     
  17. I very much agree!! So sad to see all the support for murder and gay rights in this thread.
     
  18. Diesel McBadass

    Diesel McBadass Tactically Epic

    10,316
    720
    Apr 15, 2011
    Dover NH
    I don't see why people get so worked up by gay people getting married, do they stay up all night worried that gay sex is happening somewhere in the world? Is their day affected by the fact a couple down the street of the same sex is married? just stay out of peoples lives, they stay out of yours, alls good.
     
  19. RC-RAMIE

    RC-RAMIE

    2,700
    1
    Mar 8, 2010
    Just because one is against gov regulation on a issue does not mean they support said issues.

    I don't plan on having a gay marriage or abortion.

    posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire
     
  20. HollowHead

    HollowHead Firm member

    24,456
    2,057
    May 16, 2005
    Where the buffalo roam
    You not only hit the nail on the head, you did so with a sledgehammer...especially the part in bold. HH