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Tumbling Bumbling Bullets

Discussion in 'Reloading' started by batson35, Nov 4, 2010.

  1. At the range yesterday and today with my M&Pc 40sw.

    Well I tore the paper up and not in a good way.

    I load Berry's 180 & 165gr in front of 231.

    Range guy says the Berrys are plated and so that thin plating is being stripped off in the barrel and out tumbles bullet.

    Sounds good! Is it true?
     
  2. IndyGunFreak

    IndyGunFreak

    25,939
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    Indiana
    I've not had a significant problem w/ Berrys bullets(haven't used them to much though).. but I would think if the plating is peeling, you are pushing the loads to fast...

    Are you noticing significant lead/plating fouling in your barrel?

    IGF
     


  3. Bob2223

    Bob2223 Jack's buddy!

    1,232
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    Spencer Indiana
    I've loaded 1000's of Berry's in 357, 40 & 45 any they always worked great.
    Pushing too hard, maybe but over crimping would be my 1st guess?

    Bob
     
  4. do lighter loads reduce the possibility of key holing?
     
  5. Never had this issue with my SIG start shooting the M&P and its a whole new ballgame
     
  6. WiskyT

    WiskyT Malcontent

    11,682
    1
    Jun 12, 2002
    North Carolina
    IME, with CAST bullets, lighter loads or using a slower powder will stop a bullet from keyholing. As for plated, you'll just have to try. Back the 231 load down maybe 10% or try a slower powder like Unique or Power Pistol, or any of the other similar powders in that burn range.

    Load in small batches until you get things sorted out. I wouldn't roll more than 10 of them until you get something that works.
     
  7. Bogey

    Bogey The Mouth® CLM

    10,386
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    Sep 11, 2004
    Raleigh, NC
    What's your crimp?

    Should be no less than bullet diameter, plus double brass wall thickness.
     
  8. Bello

    Bello America/Italia

    2,346
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    Sep 24, 2008
    East Coast

    actually its just 20,000th of the neck size
     
  9. I've read that most plated bullets should be loaded as if they are lead only; that's apparently to keep the plating from giving out and letting the bullets "smoothbore" themselves. I shoot Rainier 124s using data specifically for those bullets and have had no problems. I have to keep telling myself that these are lead bullets decked out with a shiny coat, because I'm tempted to treat them as FMJs or TMJs. They're not.
     
  10. fredj338

    fredj338

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    so.cal.
    The plating isn't giving up because of vel but likely you are over crimping. If you reduce the bullet at all, it will be wobbling down the bore & tumble. LFCD maybe? Just one reason I am not a fan. Just enough taper crimp to remove the bell. I have no issue with plated @ any vel from 750-1250fps.
     
  11. oneofthose

    oneofthose

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    Years ago I had a similar issue, I think they were 9mm plated Frontier bullets. When fired from my new Springfield 1911 they tended to tumble, but not from my Glock 19. At the time I wondered if the sharper rifling of the 1911 was cutting through the plating. Never really figured it out.
     
  12. WeeWilly

    WeeWilly

    3,875
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    Nov 12, 2011
    Idaho
    Old thread.

    I have never seen a correlation between load range and plated bullet performance when using them at normal service caliber velocities. That is, in calibers like 9mm, 40S&W and 45 Auto, loading plated to any manufacturers jacketed data available has never resulted in plating being stripped, bullets tumbling, etc. OTOH, I have seen very poor results, regardless of the loading, if too much crimp is applied.

    IME, the foregoing doesn't apply when running some of thinner plated bullets (like the traditional Berry's) at magnum style velocities. I have experienced plating being stripped off the bullet when pushed to very hot 10mm ranges resulting bullets with a mind of their own seems to be the result.
     
    fredj338 likes this.
  13. fredj338

    fredj338

    21,996
    1,081
    Dec 22, 2004
    so.cal.
    I shoot plated in my 357sig. I've had Berrys & Ranier up to 1300fps w/ ok accuracy, like 3" @ 50ft. Dropping to 1250fps tightens groups up quite a bit. So while there are vel limits, just not the problem in most service caliber loads. Over crimping though, that certainly ruins accuracy. I've seen the bits of plating stuck in targets shot at contact distances of 5-6ft.
     
  14. Taterhead

    Taterhead Counting Beans

    3,623
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    Dec 13, 2008
    Boise, Idaho
    Good points and good advice. One other note. Berry's also likes a pretty good bell too to avoid any possibility of shaving copper during the seating step.

    No matter how I've tried, I just haven't every achieved consistent groups above 1100 fps with Berry's. Consistently good results up to 1050. Plated bullets with thick copper like PowerBond and Speer -- they load and shoot just like jacketed bullets.