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The triggers are the problem

Discussion in 'Heckler & Koch Forum' started by Retseh, Feb 7, 2010.

  1. Retseh

    Retseh

    1,981
    3
    Dec 18, 2007
    I own 2 HKs, 9mm and .45ACP stainless compacts, and I love them.

    But there's no getting around the fact that for a thousand dollar pistol, the trigger is a joke. I haven't tried the LEM yet, but a lot don't like that either.

    HK need a new trigger design, we shouldn't have to send them to Bill Springfield to make them work right.

    Just my 2 cents.
     
  2. majette

    majette

    989
    4
    May 1, 2008
    Norfolk, VA
    i had to learn the system. they are combat triggers, not match grade.
     


  3. JBnTX

    JBnTX Texas

    19,749
    3,828
    Aug 28, 2008
    Texas

    THANK YOU, majette,

    HK pistols are intended for combat/personal protection.
    They're NOT target pistols.

    There's absolutely NOTHING wrong with the trigger on any HK pistol.
    They work perfectly, just as they are designed to.

    Just my 2 cents.
     
  4. HAMMERHEAD

    HAMMERHEAD

    3,445
    18
    Dec 20, 2002
    Minnesota
    They are easier to master than a Glock trigger and I have no trouble shooting fast or getting tiny groups with the HK 45.
    What do you expect for a mass production DA/SA pistol with a trigger activated firing pin block?
    Ever try a series 80 Colt?
     
  5. Clem Eastwood

    Clem Eastwood

    1,667
    0
    Mar 7, 2004
    DFW, TX
    after 4K rounds through each of mine and using a decent lube on the friction points of the trigger mechanism, my V1 HK USP triggers are pretty sweet. everyone that has dry fired them has agreed. The DA trigger isnt quite as good as the SIG DA, but it also has a lot more spring tension and never needs trigger spring replacement. you dont put a trigger spring in a SIG or glock on a semi regular basis (5-8K rounds) and you are asking for a door stop. Ive had SIGs, Glocks, 1911s, K frame smiths and various other ****. The HKs are the only ones that have NEVER hiccupped. Ill stick with what ive got.
     
  6. blueiron

    blueiron

    11,145
    11
    Aug 10, 2004
    Americans have a fascination with target-grade triggers. No one else in the world places more emphasis on that design criteria than we do, yet on a self defense pistol or a military rifle they often are a liability.

    As long as the trigger is consistent from shot to shot, it can be learned.
     
  7. JBnTX

    JBnTX Texas

    19,749
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    Aug 28, 2008
    Texas
    And that is the gospel truth!:wavey:
     
  8. H&K 4 LIFE

    H&K 4 LIFE Leonum A Ignis

    3,381
    2
    Jan 27, 2009
    CT
    There's nothing inherently wrong with the trigger.

    Some people hate Glock triggers. I myself am not a big fan of the SIG DA trigger pull. Nothing more then personal opinion.
     
  9. faawrenchbndr

    faawrenchbndr DirtyThirty fan CLM

    36,093
    456
    Nov 24, 2005
    Troy
    I believe your expectations are the problem.
    A HK is a COMBAT weapon with MATCH GRADE accuracy.
    Nothing more, nothing less.
     
  10. HK Dan

    HK Dan

    1,402
    0
    Mar 27, 2008
    Don't get too worked up. They shoot in nicely.

    Heck, go shoot an IDPA match with one. After the first stage, tell us if you even noticed the DA pull...<g> The point being that when you have even the tiniest amount of stress applied, the long, snarky, grindy pull just disappears!

    Dan
     
  11. NEOH212

    NEOH212 Diesel Girl

    8,983
    11
    Mar 25, 2008
    North East Ohio
    Agreed! I have no problem with any of my USP pistols. HK does offer a match trigger for the full size USP. I don't think it will work in the compact though. I don't see the need for it anyways. It's a combat/defense handgun, not a gun that I would take to a bulls-eye shoot at Camp Perry for crying out loud! When it comes to the HK trigger, I will take mine stock. :wavey:
     
  12. D4RWlN

    D4RWlN

    451
    1
    Nov 5, 2005
    Southeastern, AL
    Are you guys honestly trying to justify the crappy triggers on most HKs? Combat trigger? Plllllleeease. 1911s are "combat" triggers and are great. My sig and and glocks are "combat" triggers and still waaaaaaay better than the heavy DA pull and long reset of my p2000. I'm not saying the p2000 or any hk is a bad pistol, I'm pretty fond of hk, infact the trigger on my p7m8 is pretty good but seriously stop drinking the kool-aid. I think hk makes some nice guns but I think the triggers are the weak point of most of their line up. I hope to eventually send my p2k to bruce at grayguns to remedy this.

    FWIW, I haven't tried a LEM yet.
     
  13. JBnTX

    JBnTX Texas

    19,749
    3,828
    Aug 28, 2008
    Texas

    The 1911 is limited to single action only and is a completely different kind
    of trigger. HK triggers are just fine for their intended use.

    blueiron said it best in his post:
    "Americans have a fascination with target-grade triggers. No one else in the world places more emphasis on that design criteria than we do, yet on a self defense pistol or a military rifle they often are a liability."

    "As long as the trigger is consistent from shot to shot, it can be learned."


    Take the time to learn and adapt to the HK trigger instead of demanding that it adapt to
    you and you'll be a far better shooter.
     
  14. D4RWlN

    D4RWlN

    451
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    Nov 5, 2005
    Southeastern, AL
    That statement just covers 1911s. And I'm pretty sure sure that Para make a 1911 da/sa.

    Glocks, Walthers, Sigs, and others have "combat" triggers that are way better than HKs. HKs should offer better triggers for the price they demand. I'm not saying that the HK triggers aren't usable or te worst I've used. What I am saying is for the money, they should be better. I'd personally would be happier with just a shorter reset.

    I agree the triggers are "fine." But that reminds me of the saying:

    Good enough is not the same as good to go.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2010
  15. JBnTX

    JBnTX Texas

    19,749
    3,828
    Aug 28, 2008
    Texas


    Para Ordinance makes a DA/SA "variation" of the 1911 pistol.
    The original and most common form of 1911 is with a single action trigger.

    The 1911 trigger cannot be compared to the trigger of an HK or any other
    modern DA/SA pistol as they're two entirely different designs.

    American pistol shooter's are spoiled rotten when it comes to their guns,
    primarily because some manufacturers try and cater to their every whim.

    HK has just joined that group with their "adjustable" backstraps for their
    pistols.

    Many American shooters complain about triggers, grips being too small or
    to large, doesn't have night sights (the latest fad), doesn't have a light
    rail? or the finish isn't what they expected.

    They say, "Oh, but I attended the latest "operator" training class and they told me
    that tactics today have changed and all this stuff is important."

    BS! Most modern pistols are just fine, for their intended purpose, right
    out of the box.

    If you want a target pistol with a target trigger then buy one,
    but don't expect all pistols to automatically come with a target trigger.
     
  16. ripley16

    ripley16

    360
    0
    Dec 10, 2007
    Virginia
    IMHO, if you can't shoot a HK well and blame it on the trigger, perhaps you simply can't shoot very well period.

    If the standard HK trigger foils your attempts at hitting something maybe you should install the HK Match Trigger. It is much lighter, crisper and resets in only 1/8", but is not suitable for a CCW if you ask me.
     
  17. Clem Eastwood

    Clem Eastwood

    1,667
    0
    Mar 7, 2004
    DFW, TX
    i usually stay out of this type of stuff because its personal preference and i know what i like and frankly, dont care what others like or dislike. but here are some points id like to clear up:

    look at the trigger springs. the HKs trigger spring is designed and is large enough to live the lifetime of the weapon. its huge compared to the SIG trigger spring. ive owned my share of SIGs, but the HK is more robust. SIGs have a pansy little trigger spring that is designed to be replaced every 5K rounds. field strip a SIG a glock and an HK and you will see the difference in trigger springs.

    as far as the walther, ive only shot a p99qa and i hate those triggers. now to the glock, i dont even know why people try to compare them to the DA/SA HK because they are completely different. look at the trigger spring in the glock compared to the V1 HKs and tell me which one you think has a longer service life. i wonder if that makes a difference. we wont even go into the fact that the DA/SA HK has second strike capability, but it is worth noting that the HKs heavier main spring that makes the trigger pull harder also hits the primer harder, significantly harder.

    heres an anicdotal tale from a few months ago. my shooting buddy and i got some WWB from the same distributor. they had hard primers. his walther p99qa and glock 19 would barely leave a mark on the primers. needless to say they wouldnt fire. put them through both those striker fired weapons a second time, still no bang. put them through the HKs and they went bang every time. the HKs hit the primer hard. we only tried to put a couple magazines of the hard primer stuff through the glock and walther before giving up and putting some old CCI blazer i had on hand through them instead. but my HKs ate everyone of those hard primer WWB loads without a single hiccup. about 10 boxes of the **** to be precise. which one would you rather have? ill take the heavier trigger thatll eat hard primer ammo like its candy. the difference in the dents on the primers between the striker fired guns and the DA/SA HK was no comparison.

    also, if you lube the friction points in the trigger on the HKs, and shoot them the DA/SA trigger gets to the point where it feels like a SIGs. problem is, most people pick up a new one that has no rounds through it, dry fire it and cry about the trigger.

    whatever, 1911, SIG, glock, HK, you name it. none of them have as good a trigger as my Clark Custom Ruger MkII pistol. and the rugers trigger wont touch the trigger on my CZ 452 that i put a shim and a spring in. its all relative. compared to the rifles i shoot, all the pistol triggers suck. so i guess i should be complaining about glock, SIG and 1911 triggers because they all eat a dick in comparison.

    they are just pistols. its not like they are accurate or powerful, so who cares if the trigger isnt perfect. pistols are a weapon of convenience. pick the one you like and call it a day.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2010
  18. D4RWlN

    D4RWlN

    451
    1
    Nov 5, 2005
    Southeastern, AL
    And they should. You are giving them your money. You are completely missing the point. Put your koolaid down for a second and read what I'm saying. HK makes great firearms but for the price, they should come with better triggers I mean these are not $400-500 pistol. The triggers should be better for the price.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2010
  19. grecco

    grecco

    2,331
    93
    Sep 12, 2004
    philadelphia pa
    I believe HK sells a Tactical trigger kit,
    its the same that comes standard on the tactical and expert.
    In single action mode it is a great improvement,