The Holy Bible is both historically and scientifically correct.

Discussion in 'Religious Issues' started by Peace Warrior, Oct 17, 2012.


  1. Peace Warrior

    Peace Warrior
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    Am Yisrael Chai
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    True. I stand corrected, and you're right, it was not my intent to plagiarize anyone. Copy and pasting sometimes leads to unintended consequences and errors.

    Now, where were we...? Lucy's knee?
     

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  2. ArtificialGrape

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    No, you previously stated that, "I reiterate, all available research I could find indicates that stars cannot form by themselves".

    We're still waiting for you to provide any of this wealth of all available research.

    Unless, of course, you're admitting that you're unable to provide scientific evidence that stars cannot form and you'd like to move on.

    -ArtificialGrape
     

  3. Peace Warrior

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    Gravity alone won't do it, but lets run with your foolish misunderstanding and reason.

    Tell me where the star(s) is(are) that formed on or in the Earth's atmosphere and I'll throw my Bible away. The closet thing even remotely resembling a star is roughly 93 million miles away from the Earth. You see, I believe gravity alone will not produce a star, we have plenty of gravity here and the best you can say that has been produced is an atmosphere around our planet, which ALREADY EXISTED.

    How do you get a sun, or star to form, from individual hydrogen atoms mind you, inside of the vacuum of outer space. To believe such a thing takes more faith than Creationists utilize.
     
    #203 Peace Warrior, Nov 15, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2012
  4. Peace Warrior

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    Absurd statements like the one he made only hurts the collective intelligence of the internet. :whistling:
     
  5. Peace Warrior

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    No, I had come back, but no response at that time, so I moved on.
     
  6. Peace Warrior

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    This is precisely my point, as I have had this debate several times before.

    There is no mechanism for the first star ever (I am speaking of the numero uno ORIGINAL star) to form given the tenets and posits of the Big Bang and or the Oscillating Universe theories. The first star has been created solely by faith from minds/hearts of the evos.

    Yet, as stellar evolution prescribes, new stars form due to matter created from existing stars, by reverse engineering the big bang, you ultimately come to a point of the first ever star forming, and this is a completely impossible event based on empirical scientific study/understanding.

    So knowing, if you cannot get a first star, then there are no subsequent stars. Period. ETA: Everything beyond the origin, be it from evos or Christians, is always going to come from their respective presuppositions of the origin, which these are based on faith and faith alone.
     
    #206 Peace Warrior, Nov 15, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2012
  7. Peace Warrior

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    By proxy I guardedly say yes, but with a caveat. BTW- It wasn't my idea, but empirical science backs up the assertion I am making. See, it is not so much about the mass as it is the mechanism(s) to facilitate star formation.

    Some on this thread insist the only mechanism required is gravity. Though ignorance is high amongst some, gravity alone is not the reason a star could form out of hydrogen atoms in outer space, but honestly, the problem is not SOLELY about lack of mass per se.

    So knowing, some fantastic theories have arisen to explain how stars are formed by "something" plus gravity. If you believe differently, please explain how you think atoms/molecules of hydrogen would join together sufficiently so as to produce a star.
     
    #207 Peace Warrior, Nov 15, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2012
  8. Geko45

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    What you believe is irrelevant. The math shows that a hydrogen/helium gas cloud in space can and will form a star through gravity alone given the right conditions. Conditions which were bound to occur (and have occured) billions of times in the vastness of the cosmos. No god required, just gravity and time. We've even watch it happening through the Hubble Space Obsevatory. I believe you were in provided pictures which you scoffed at. I'm certain you will scoff at this response too as you have already pre-determined that no evidence, no matter how compelling, will be accpeted by you.
     
  9. Peace Warrior

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    I admit when empirical science is lacking for a position that I take I have to utilize faith to believe in something occurring, which you and others on here obviously will not admit the same.

    Useless theoretical equations aside, please explain or identify these "right conditions" you speak of.

    IIRC, the theme was to use science to prove star formation, instead of science, some photos were posted with the proclamation, "A star is born" or something along those lines.

    Photos of space do NOT prove a star just formed. Maybe light finally reached the telescope. Remember the Hubble Deep Field photograph? Those stars had existed all along, yet we never once saw them until that particular photograph was captured.
     
  10. ArtificialGrape

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    misclick...
     
    #210 ArtificialGrape, Nov 15, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2012
  11. ArtificialGrape

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    Peace Warrior,

    You have asserted:

    current scientific knowledge and research indicates that either the stars were created, or although scientifically impossible, stars formed all by themselves anyway

    I reiterate, all available research I could find indicates that stars cannot form by themselves

    For 17 months now we've been waiting for you to back up these assertions with research that concludes that stars cannot form. Will you be providing the research, or abandoning your assertions?

    Thanks!

    -ArtificialGrape
     
  12. Peace Warrior

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    :rofl: clutching straws?

    Okay, let me re-reiterate: :supergrin:

    All the BELIEVABLE research, based on empirical scientific data, I could find indicates that stars cannot form by themselves.
     
  13. Peace Warrior

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    You keep quoting from another thread... hilarious :rofl:
     
  14. ArtificialGrape

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    They are your words, are they not? Do you stand by them, or do you abandon them?

    The only thing possibly hilarious is my expecting you to provide something now that you have been asked to provide since summer 2011. Actually it's more sad than hilarious.

    Anyway, you continue to make the same assertion in this thread...
    All the BELIEVABLE research, based on empirical scientific data, I could find indicates that stars cannot form by themselves.

    Given all this believable research, why are you so reluctant to provide any? Is it perhaps because your previous attempts at supporting it by citing Boyle's Law, D.B. Larson and Martin Harwit were all readily shot down for not supporting your conclusion.

    Given that you consider Boyle's Law and gases not collapsing on earth to support your argument that gases cannot collapse in space, you'll have to understand if I question your ability to determine what is BELIEVABLE. Is there any chance that you can share these scientific papers that draw the conclusion that stars cannot form -- it sounds like they're everywhere.

    thanks,
    -ArtificialGrape
     
  15. Animal Mother

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    To be fair, the Lucy's knee stuff predates the star formation stuff. On the other hand, PW seems eminently capable of avoiding answering two questions at the same time.
     
  16. Animal Mother

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    And yet there were already two posts from me at the time you said you'd be "right back" that have yet to be addressed. Why didn't you do so when you "had come back"?
     
  17. Peace Warrior

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    To be honest and fair, you brought up lucy's knee in this thread.
     
  18. Animal Mother

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    Yes, I did and yet you've still neither explained what it has to do with anything nor have you produced the supposed "BELIEVABLE research, based on empirical scientific data," which "indicates that stars cannot form by themselves."

    As I said, you seem fully capable of avoiding both questions at the same time.
     
  19. steveksux

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    Here's one.

    [​IMG]
    I'm referring to the shiny round thing in the image. The buildings in the foreground are not made of gasses clumping together.

    It is possible to see it from Earth with the naked eye. But you have to look in the daytime.

    Randy
     
    #219 steveksux, Nov 16, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2012
  20. steveksux

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    Well, Einstein, if gravity won't make gasses clump together , why does Earth still have an atmosphere made up of gasses clumped around it? What's your theory for what is holding down the air? Does God have the Earth wrapped in saran wrap? :rofl::rofl:

    So now you're claiming the sun is NOT a star, only something close to resembling a star? :rofl::rofl::rofl: You realize stars are made of hydrogen, and Earth's atmosphere has hardly any hydrogen? Even if the entire atmosphere were composed of hydrogen, it wouldn't even be close to being enough to form a star. Are you really that ignorant or is this a parody?

    Either you don't understand what hydrogen is, or you don't understand what a vacuum is.

    Vacuum implies the lack of hydrogen atoms, as well as other gases. If you can't even tell that a simple sentence you wrote contradicts itself, there's not much hope you'll see the flaws in the theories you try to construct out of thin air (again, that also would NOT be a vacuum) with even more complicated sentences.

    Randy
     
    #220 steveksux, Nov 16, 2012
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2012

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