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Some Air Reservists Reject Uniform Rule

Discussion in 'The US Air Force Forum' started by Blitzer, Oct 1, 2007.

  1. Uniforms
  2. mitchshrader

    mitchshrader Deceased

    Jun 14, 2005

  3. G19Tony

    G19Tony Sneet CLM

    Mar 7, 2005
    Las Vegas, NV
    I was an ART in the the early 80's. We all wore our uniforms. What difference does it really make.
  4. RF7126


    Sep 19, 2003
    Western Florida
    I was never more than ROTC or CAP so please forgive my ignorance, but are these guys upset that they have to wear their uniforms when working on Air Force time?
  5. gamingoddess


    Sep 12, 2007
    Manchester, CT
    I really hoped that this article was a joke...until I clicked on the link. I've worked with many reservists/national guardsmen during deployments overseas. They were usually great people to work's sad that there are those few out there that tarnish their image. :(
  6. md2lgyk


    Mar 23, 2001
    Not exactly. During the week they are Federal Technicians. They are only on Air Force time when they're at drill or on active duty.

    For a time years ago, some Air National Guard Technicians had a uniform (non-military) they wore during the week. I don't think that's the case any more - at least it wasn't for any of the units I was in.
  7. Egyas

    Egyas Troll Hater

    Ok, I'm confused here. Are new new regs saying that they have to wear their uniform while on duty (during call-up and active time), or ALL the time (civilian time too)?
  8. RF7126


    Sep 19, 2003
    Western Florida
    I think I understand the dynamics slightly better now, thanks.
  9. meeko


    Apr 15, 2006
    I just retired from the Air National Guard. The ANG technicioms were required to wear the standard BDU duty uniform (with rank etc) on tech time (on their full time thruogh the week job) and on drill weekends, 2 weeks annual training etc. I am at a loss as to why the AF reserve have never required it on their end!

    the thing about saying no to AEF's is stupid. they can always just invoulentary activate a unit. then you would be under title 10 and it wouldn't be an issue. I spent some time as an Active Guard Reserve (AGR) position. that is the same as active duty except your a Guard asset for your particular base. No PCS's but you will deploy. It seemed like there was always animosity from the technicion side. Not all of them but quite a few had issues with darn near everything.
  10. Egyas

    Egyas Troll Hater

    Ok, so these guys work at the XYZ County Airport fixing small planes as they "primary" job. They are required to wear "the standard BDU duty uniform (with rank etc)" while preforming those duties?
  11. Sam White

    Sam White I miss you bud Silver Member

    Nov 17, 2001
    South Dakota

    These people work at Air Force bases (either active duty or reserve bases). The land and equipment are owned by Uncle Sam and he pays these people. The airports are military owned facilities, not civilian ones.

    These people work a job that serves a military purpose, and holding an Air Force AFSC is a job requirement to work the civilian position.

    That's what makes these people different than ordinary folks.

    When I switched to the Air National Guard from the Army Reserve it did seem strange to require technicians to wear BDU's while in a "civilian" status as a GS or WG gov't employee. All of the technicians on our Guard base wear BDU's all month. Our technicians in the USAR wore civies during the month. But the USAR relied mostly on AGR's (full time military) and used few technicians. My ANG base uses mostly technicians as full time staff.

    The article shows why technicians should be wearing BDU's during the rest of the month, since those technicians forgot what they are there for.
  12. Egyas

    Egyas Troll Hater

    Thanks Sam! That explains it all very well. Based on what you have said, I see no reason why they shouldn't wear the BDUs per reg.
  13. najaboy


    Mar 18, 2002
    Melbourne, FL
    Because it blurs the line of our actual status and causes us to incur additional out of pocket expenses that the .gov has no intention of compensating us for. While those expenses are minor, they do represent an additional financial burden that would not exist sans this policy.

    In addition, it's going to cost AFRC more money. In a time when overall operating budgets are being slashed, they're going to have to pay more to exchange uniforms due to increased wear and tear. In short, Bradley's little pet project amounts to nothing more than FWA at the present time.

    Additionally, it completely disregards 10 USC 772, which has resulted in at least one pending lawsuit and that I am aware of. It also places the Air Force in the dubious position of trying to enforce standards when it cannot do so. For instance, I can decide I want to stop off at Wally World on the way home- take off my bdu shirt, put on some mirrored sunglasses, and walk while talking on my cell phone with the other hand in my pocket. All of this is technically prohibited by AFI 36-2903. However, I am not in a military status and therefore not bound by the UCMJ, and it is outside of my normal duty hours, so I cannot be disciplined as a civilian.

    Unless on orders, ARTs are not functioning in a military capacity. Compelling the wear of the military uniform blurs this distinction and causes confusion for Active Duty officers who sometimes think they have some type of command authority over anyone in uniform.

    Had I wanted to wear the uniform on a daily basis, shave every morning, and get a haircut every two weeks, I would have stayed on Active Duty. However, I opted for a civilian job, electing to don the uniform for UTAs, AT, and any voluntary or involuntary activations. Hell, I'd have no problem wearing the uniform and being held to the same standard as Active Duty if AFRC were to make other facets of the job commensurate with those of Active Duty. Heck, even increase the available stripes for ARTs. Right now, the only hope that many ARTs have of seeing MSgt, even with 30 years of military time, is the PEP program- which has been curtailed.

    The main problem here is not that ARTs are not proud of their military service or that we are prima donnas. Rather, this was just one more step in the continued erosion of not only benefits, but also common sense. In short, it was the proverbial straw that broke the camel's back.

    I need to clarify a few things that have been stated...
    ARTs are legally prohibited from performing any duties or training that serve an exclusively military purpose while on the clock as a civilian. For example, if I needed to attend M-16 qualification, I would have to be in a leave status and on military orders. The same technically holds true for writing EPRs. I either have to be in a military status or on my own time.

    While membership in the Reserves is generally a condition of employment, this is not a hard and fast rule. If an ART loses their military status through no fault of their own, they can generally stay on in their civilian slot.

    ANG technicians wear the uniform daily, but took their jobs with that as a condition of employment. In the case of AFRC, Bradley's trying to implement it on a workforce where doing your job in comfortable civilian attire was touted as one of the main perks of the job.

    As for AEFs, an involuntary unit activation just isn't going to happen. The way the process works is if enough volunteers can't be found within a unit, the tasking is opened to the sister unit. If enough volunteers can't be found within those two units, then the tasking is opened AFRC-wide. If enough Reservists cannot be found to fill the slots on the DRMD, then the tasking is opened AF-wide, to include ANG.

    In closing, I'd like to relay a bit of info that was given to me secondhand, so I cannot verify its authenticity. At a recent manpower conference a couple months ago, Bradley indicated that he was interested in doing away with the ART program altogether.