Privacy guaranteed - Your email is not shared with anyone.

Welcome to Glock Forum at

Why should YOU join our forums?

  • Reason #1
  • Reason #2
  • Reason #3

Site Description

Robots and Robber Barons

Discussion in 'Political Issues' started by muscogee, Dec 11, 2012.


    It doesn't have to be this way.
  2. countrygun


    Mar 9, 2012
    Oh, the rich have more than Muscogee, wait a second, I'll dial Whine-one-one and get you a Whaaaaaaambulance.

    I am not going to scheme to take something away from somebody else to make my life seem better.

  3. Atlas

    Atlas transmogrifier

    Oct 1, 2001
    north of the equator

    Well he makes the claim, but I do not see evidence cited..

    Which industries?
    Is that a bad thing?
    If so, how?
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2012
  4. juggy4711

    juggy4711 Nimrod Son

    Sep 20, 2006
    Galveston County, TX
    When people and the government realize that taxes and regulations that increase costs on corporation only cause corporations to pass those costs on to consumers and employees rather than accept lower/non-increasing profits, and remove those taxes and regulations it won't be.

    If you do not think computers, robots and other forms of automation have not reduced the need for employees in the last 60 years or so you would be wrong.

    Is it a bad thing? Doesn't have to be, however that reduction in need for labor provided by people is exactly the reason Marx accurately predicted that folks would turn against capitalism and then push for change to socialism.

    Doesn't matter if the slight is real or how detrimental it is, the unethical practices of capitalism, whether perceived or real are, combined with entitlements, the driving factor in the evolution of economies.

    Yet another example of why Marx's teachings should be taken seriously as warnings rather than dismissed as hogwash.
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2012
  5. evlbruce


    Nov 3, 2003
    Isn't Krugmann a punchline by now?

    What we should be doing, according to Paul, is start bombing Mars and inflating our currency at 5% per year.

    ETA: If business is making record profits, then why doesn't Team Krugman open up a firm and get while the gettin's good?
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2012
  6. Atlas

    Atlas transmogrifier

    Oct 1, 2001
    north of the equator
    Automation creates far more jobs than it replaces.
    It creates many, many production-line jobs that would not otherwise exist.

    I've designed and commissioned automation systems for more than 30 years in more types of industries than I can remember.

    In all that time, only once did a system I created or helped to create displace a worker..
    It was an extremely hot, nasty, and dangerous job and the company moved that employee to a different task in the same facility.
    He was quite happy about it, as he was the person with the lowest level of skill and education in the place.

    I have personally created automation systems that on a single project made possible secure production jobs for more than 200 workers at once. That happened a few years ago in western New York state, where those jobs were very badly needed.

    Many modern production processes could not be performed by human beings at all, regardless of skill, knowledge, or training.
    Almost every one of those processes requires human beings though to perform associated tasks that make the business possible..
    Those are human beings who have jobs in an industry that would not and could not exist without automation.

    Without automation, a Toyota Corolla would cost about $70k.
    How many workers would benefit from that?
    Could Toyota compete and stay in business to provide work to tens of thousands of people if they had to charge $70k for a dumpy little Corolla?

    Last edited: Dec 12, 2012
  7. PaulMason


    Feb 10, 2010
    You need to learn how to read an article critically so you don't become manipulated.

    "corporate profits are at a record high"
    - from what date to what date?
    - house builders?
    - if a company is great at exporting, can't its great profits be from that and not at the expense of the worker?

    - in a world market?
    - if companies in the USA had a monopoly they would be able to raise prices. But they can't.

    You should have seen the flaws in the article.
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2012
  8. janice6

    janice6 Silver Member

    Apr 4, 2006
    regarding Company profits and wages.

    I broached this subject with my Director of Engineering one day and he said, "They (workers) vote with their feet".
  9. Atlas

    Atlas transmogrifier

    Oct 1, 2001
    north of the equator
    This is exactly as it should be.
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2012
  10. certifiedfunds

    certifiedfunds Tewwowist

    Apr 23, 2008
    Last edited: Dec 11, 2012
  11. Syclone538


    Jan 8, 2006
    On machines that displace workers...

    Would it be better to dig a basement with a shovel or a track hoe?

    Would it be better to ship stuff by hand or a semi truck?

    We could have full employment by destroying all machines. It doesn't take much thought to realize that would be a bad thing to do.

    Machines that displace workers free up those workers to do something that machines can not. We get more stuff for less work, making us all richer.

    Tom Woods has some good stuff on youtube about the industrial revolution, but I don't have time to look for it right now.
  12. Atlas

    Atlas transmogrifier

    Oct 1, 2001
    north of the equator
    If by "full employment" you mean millions of people out digging up roots and collecting berries in a futile attempt to survive then I agree.
  13. QNman

    QNman resU deretsigeR Silver Member

    Oct 5, 2005
    St. Louis, MO
    It's too bad us mortals have no opportunity to cash in on some of those record profits. You know, something like:

    - buying stock
    - starting up a competitor
    - improving on an existing business model
    - working through the ranks of the corporations to become one of the "robber barons"

    Then, it might be fair...

    ETA: hey, I have an idea... Start up a company yourself and don't worry about those pesky "profits". Make sure all the workers make more than their contemporaries do, increase their cost of living more than inflation each year, regardless of performance of either the employee or the business. You know, to "be fair". Your investors will clearly see what a great business owner you are and reward you accordingly.
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2012
  14. Atlas

    Atlas transmogrifier

    Oct 1, 2001
    north of the equator
  15. QNman

    QNman resU deretsigeR Silver Member

    Oct 5, 2005
    St. Louis, MO
    According to whom?

    And apparently not.

    Learning and improving your skillset starts on your first day of life and should not stop until the first day of your wake.
  16. countrygun


    Mar 9, 2012

    ".......including workers with the skills that were supposed to lead to success in today’s economy."

  17. Krugman, seriously? I think I'll just leave this here...

    "Who is this Sean from Florida? He takes everything that [the] Professor [says] and shreds it, piece by piece. He shouldn't be allowed to post his comments on this blog since he seems to be winning all the debates. We progressives need to stick together and embellish our talking points without someone from the outside pointing out fallacies in our ideology." - latrina

    Last edited: Dec 12, 2012
  18. Paul Krugman is a prisoner of leftist collectivist ideology and pretty much a joke in the economic world.

    When people start quoting that guy....I go to sleep.

  19. barbedwiresmile

    barbedwiresmile Unreconstructed

    Feb 3, 2008
    Muscogee, read Hazlitt. "Economics in One Lesson"
  20. Bren

    Bren NRA Life Member

    Jan 16, 2005
    Wow - so the guy who invested his money and took the risk to start a business, then gave a job to the worker he was not obligated to hire, who voluntarily acccepted the job he wasn't obligated to take or continue working at - that guy has been profiting "at the expense of" the worker?

    Seems like the worker should have quit and gone to work for somebody not profiting...except you only keep a job if the employer is profiting.

    Seems like the worker should quit whining and start his own business. If he can't do it, he need to STFU and apppreciate the guy who pays him to help him make a profit.
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2012