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Question for Frank, AG, AM, et al...

Discussion in 'Religious Issues' started by SawgrassRaven, Jul 13, 2011.

  1. SawgrassRaven

    SawgrassRaven

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    May 19, 2002
    I want to start off by saying I really appreciate the long, educated, intelligent, coherent posts you guys write. You have the patience that I lost a long time ago when dealing with believers, religious persons, etc.

    My question is, why bother?

    These faithful folks will never be swayed no matter how much evidence you present. They shove their index fingers first-knuckle deep into their ears and shout "LALALALALA" while you speak. Nothing will remove the Bible Blinders from their eyes. They will continue to hammer the square peg into the round hole as long as they have to make excuses for their beliefs. They argue with emotion, not intellect. And as the saying goes, you cannot use reason to argue away an idea that was not based on reason in the first place.

    I admire you guys, I really do. But these people will never pick up 'Atheist Universe' or 'God Delusion' (two of my favorites) or any other book that challenges their beliefs and will continue to put forth the same tired arguments in defense of the absurd, ridiculous nonsense that they want taught in schools.

    I love the debates and the stuff you guys post, but man it's got to be tiring. Keep up the good work!

    :wavey:
     
  2. FifthFreedom

    FifthFreedom

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    Pa
     


  3. frank4570

    frank4570

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    I was just kind of shocked to find people who were trying to discredit science and evolution, actually didn't understand it at all.
     
  4. FifthFreedom

    FifthFreedom

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    Frank.
    I am equally surprised that people can think "it's all a big accident"
     
  5. SawgrassRaven

    SawgrassRaven

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    May 19, 2002
    I used to be one. I have a great idea what believers think and what motivates them. Another fundie misconception; that us heathens have no clue about 'faith'.

    Thanks for playing.

    :upeyes:
     
  6. FifthFreedom

    FifthFreedom

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    Oh I don't think you are clueless, but you seem to think YOUR experience gives you the right to paint everyone with the same broad brush.
     
  7. SawgrassRaven

    SawgrassRaven

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    May 19, 2002
    Sources please of astrophysicists, geologists, paleontologists, etc. who have maintained it was "all a big accident".

    We'll wait.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2011
  8. FifthFreedom

    FifthFreedom

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    Pa

    Yes we will:cool:
     
  9. dbcooper

    dbcooper

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    Mar 2, 2011
    I find it equally surprising that people believe that to acknowledge evolution and the big bang is to deny their deity, I seem to recall something about his mysterious ways and such.
     
  10. FifthFreedom

    FifthFreedom

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    I am sure sawgrass never picked up a copy and read The Guide for the Perplexed by Moses Maimonides either.
     
  11. Now THIS I agree with. Whether evolution is true or not is yet to be proven, yet the evidence is considerable. The "big bang" even moreso.

    dbcooper, do you know who it was that proposed what became known as the Big Bang theory of the origin of the Universe, and what his occupation was?
     
  12. Smacktard

    Smacktard

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    I think the faithful should get down on their knees and pray that there is a God, and hope that God isn't planning on eating them in the future.

    ...
     
  13. SawgrassRaven

    SawgrassRaven

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    May 19, 2002
    More assumptions.

    Maimonides maintained that one should consider all theories. That's great, do you do that? If so, bravo! When does evidence do away with some religious theories? At what point does the idea become absurd?

    Why do we have to assign the universe to a 'god' of any kind? 'God did it' shouldn't be the default answer of something we do not know.
     
  14. dbcooper

    dbcooper

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    Mar 2, 2011

    Especially when you consider that in the history of everything known to man there was a time when it wasn't.
     
  15. It was Georges Lemaître. FATHER Georges Lemaître.

    "a Belgian priest, astronomer and professor of physics at the Catholic University of Louvain. He sometimes used the title Abbé or Monseigneur."
     
  16. yep, Lemaître suggested it in the 1920s, and it received little attention until 1965 when Penzias and Wilson, 2 scientists at Bell Labs determined (with a little help from scientists at Princeton) that the static they were picking up in their large antennae was cosmic background radiation predicted by Gamow in the 1940s as evidence of the Big Bang.

    The term Big Bang was coined by a critic to be derogatory of the theory, but the term was soon universally adopted. The term is actually inaccurate in that it does not describe the t=0 explosion, but begins with the very rapid expansion the instant after t=0.

    -ArtificialGrape
     
  17. dbcooper

    dbcooper

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    Mar 2, 2011
    I knew that one, just spaced out, parden the pun, I've been in brainlock for days now and just aint up to google today. The church has done alot in the field
     
  18. Regarding "why bother"...

    Why would anybody bother running on a 3rd party ticket for president?

    Animal Mother and others have been defenders of the realm (of reason) much longer than I.

    I may not sway a Christian to abandon faith in favor of reason, but perhaps they open their mind to the science, and they find a way to reconcile science with their faith, and they no longer maintain as adversarial an attitude towards science.

    Maybe a middle of the road lurker heads down the path of reason -- I do occasionally receive "thanks" from this demographic.

    Religious faith is on a collision course with civilization. How long before religious terrorists have nuclear weapons with some range capability? Blind faith that allows educated people from comfortable backgrounds to abandon reason and believe that they know what the creator of the universe wants from them is not a good thing.

    -ArtificialGrape
     
  19. SawgrassRaven

    SawgrassRaven

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    May 19, 2002

    Understood AG. Thanks for fighting the good fight. I need to get back in it. Like I said, I appreciate what you guys do.

    :wavey: