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Plated limitations, if any ?

Discussion in '10mm Reloading Forum' started by FlyBoy007, Nov 2, 2009.

  1. Loading some Berrys plated 180grs TCFP.

    Is there any limit I need to stay below FPS wise or can they be loaded to the limitations of the round.

    I am using a G-20 stock bbl.

    I really like AA #7 and AA#9 for the 10mm Jacked stuff but use Unique for range fodder, lead non-checked (<1100fps).


    Advice on plated please and thank you.
     
  2. MakeMineA10mm

    MakeMineA10mm * * * * Millennium Member Lifetime Member

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    Feb 13, 1999
    Central Illinois
    The quality, and more pointedly the thickness of the plating, on plated bullets vary from brand to brand. I like Berrys, as well as a couple other brands.

    No matter what plated bullet you use, my general rule of thumb is to keep velocities at or below 1200 fps. A couple brands flat-out say that you should stick to these velocities or lower, the rest don't mention anything about these limitations.

    The bottom line is that all plated bullets have a very thin plating (even those with double plating or other extra-thick versions of plating), which is subject to tearing and exposing the soft, pure lead beneath, especially in the polygonal bore of Glocks, HKs and other polygonally-rifled arms.

    Sticking to 1200 fps or lower pretty much keeps this from being a problem. I use plated for the same purposes I use cast lead boolits, which is plinking and practice, and I load to about 1100 fps with W231 for these loads.
     

  3. Taterhead

    Taterhead Counting Beans

    3,701
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    Dec 13, 2008
    Boise, Idaho
    +1 on keeping the velocities below 1200 fps. I notice some erratic and inconsistent results starting at about 1150 fps. I see some keyholing and accuracy begins to open up.

    I load and shoot Berry's 180 gr fp more than any other projectile and they work great now that I resolved some keyholing and accuracy issues. The single biggest factor to load consistency and accuracy for me is to load them long (1.26") and crimp only enough to BARELY remove the bell. You want to disturb that thin plating as little as possible. I have good results with 9.0 grains of Blue Dot @ about 1050 fps. Not hot for a 10mm. About like a hotter .40 S&W load. Great for trigger time and IDPA shoots.

    I shoot these in my stock G20 barrel with no fouling issues.
     
  4. Taterhead

    Taterhead Counting Beans

    3,701
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    Dec 13, 2008
    Boise, Idaho
    Do you have load data for the W231 powder that you'd care to pass along? Blue Dot has been working fine, but I don't mind expanding the recipe book a bit. If recent experience has taught me anything, is that the powders that one is used to finding may not always be available. I plan to diversify my loads a bit.
     
  5. MinervaDoe

    MinervaDoe

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    San Jose, CA
    http://www.rainierballistics.com/mainframe.htm
     
  6. MakeMineA10mm

    MakeMineA10mm * * * * Millennium Member Lifetime Member

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    Central Illinois
    Taterhead,
    Sure, I can share my load. Load about 5.5grs and you're right there with a 170-180gr bullet. If you use a heavier bullet, you'll need to adjust downward.

    I load 5.6grs, because that's what I keep my powder measure set at for several cartridges, including 45ACP, 10mm, 357 Mag, and 44 Spl. It's one of two "universal settings" for me and W231. In 45ACP, 44 Spl., and 10mm (with cast or plated bullets of the weight indicated), that's right at a max load.

    BTW, now that Hodgdon is distributing Winchester powders, they've admitted that W231 and HP38 are the exact same powder. Something we have known for some time. It's also the same as SMP231 powder that has been available from time to time on the surplus market. It's a ball powder made by St. Mark's Powder company in Florida.
     
  7. Great information guys, thanks.
     
  8. Taterhead

    Taterhead Counting Beans

    3,701
    170
    Dec 13, 2008
    Boise, Idaho
    Thank you for sharing the the info. I assume that you are using standard LP primers? Only 5.5 grains? Wow that would yield quite a few extra loads per can than I'm presently getting from Blue Dot loads. You mentioned that you were getting 1100 fps. Is that with the 180 gr bullet? I didn't quite understand your first paragraph here. Thanks.
     
  9. MakeMineA10mm

    MakeMineA10mm * * * * Millennium Member Lifetime Member

    1,955
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    Feb 13, 1999
    Central Illinois
    Yep, sorry - tried to not be so windy, because people have claimed I can go into too much detail... :supergrin:

    My load is 5.6grs W231 w/ Win. LP primers (they say "for standard and magnum loads" - so I consider them to be in-between a standard and magnum primer) and whatever brass I have that's been used up too much for full-power loads. This load is with a 175gr Lead TC (Lee 401-175-TC mould - NOT the tumble-lube version), but I sometimes substitute 165gr or 180gr plated bullets with no changes.

    Awhile back, Winchester listed 5.7grs as max w/ W231 for this load, with a book velocity of 1100-1125fps, IIRC. I get 1025-1125fps depending on the exact bullet loaded, the gun it's shot from (and barrel length), and the atmospherics that day... Generally, it's right around 1075 on average. I call it 1100 for shorthand.
     
  10. Kept loads below 1050 fps and they worked great, used Unique and found them very accurate, Thanks for all the great advice.
     
  11. Waffentomas

    Waffentomas Semper Fidelis Millennium Member

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    Blue State
    Berry's and Rainier have big-time keyholing issues when the velocity gets up there.
     
  12. My experience echoes what's been said by Waffentomas and Taterhead. That being that things get unpredictable above about 1200 FPS. I had keyholing and just poor accuracy in general with Berry's 165 grain bullets in 10mm once I hit the 1220 FPS mark. Thought maybe I was crimping too hard and breaking through the plating, so I lightened up on it and got the same results.

    I was trying to push them fast to find a good flat shooting 100 yard steel plate load that was cheap to shoot. Also theorized that it would make a good hog/deer load being that the core is so soft that it would expand when hitting bone. Alas, just couldn't get it to the 1350 FPS I was looking for.
     
  13. Mortech

    Mortech

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    Shelton WA
    PLEASE be windy , I appreciate the extraneous info , I'm a complete n00b at reloading and I'm paired up with a friend thats been doing for 30+ years . So far the only load I've done for my 10MM (my 10MMs are a S&W1006 and a 1066) is one using 155gr Berry plated bullets , over 9.3gr of 800-X using Eldorado once fired brass .
     
  14. preventec47

    preventec47

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    May 2, 2010
    Atlanta, GA
    I have heard but not verified that the brands Precision Delta and XTREME plated bullets
    have no limitation on velocity compared
    to jacketed bullets in pistols. Well I think
    Precision Delta told me 1500fps limit for their 165gr bullet.

    Just thinking out loud here, compared to
    Lead bullets, I think if the plated bullets were pushed at hi velocities, the only downside
    is accuracy. With lead cast bullets you would
    also contend with severe lead buildup in
    the barrel ... isnt that right ?
     
    Last edited: Jun 7, 2010
  15. ctkelly

    ctkelly

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    Precision Delta are copper jacket...not plated.

    I've launched berrys plated 9mm HP up to 1350 FPS with no ill effect.
     
  16. Anytime I pushed plated bullets in the stock GLOCK barrel, they frequently tumbled. Swap in the LW barrel, they shoot straight and clean.

    I'm finding that it just pays to run jacketed in the 10mm when shooting full-bore power levels. (That is why you're shooting a 10, not the 40S&W)

    'da Kid
     
  17. cwb

    cwb

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    I've shot Berry's and Xtreme bullets up to about 1450 fps with no issues. No tumbling, no stripping, nothing.