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Permit holder charged with failure to notify Officer

Discussion in 'Carry Issues' started by TBO, Feb 10, 2012.

  1. RussP

    RussP Moderator

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    Central Virginia
    Well, the sequence of events went something like this:
    • Made a lane change without signaling.
    • Noticeable increased speed after lane change.
    • Clocked at 82 in a 60 MPH zone.
    • When stopped by police, alcohol on breath.
    • Did not inform officer of carry permit and firearms in the back seat.
    • Officer runs info, comes back showing driver has carry permit...
    • Resulting charges:
      • Fifth-degree felony transporting weapons while intoxicated,
      • Fifth-degree felony improper transport of firearms and
      • Failure to inform an officer
      • OVI
      • OVI test refusal
      • speeding and
      • not signaling a lane change.
    oops...
     


  2. HerrGlock

    HerrGlock Scouts Out CLM

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    Sounds like someone they should publish his prom picture and say how he was turning his life around :supergrin:
     
  3. Dragoon44

    Dragoon44 Unfair Facist Lifetime Member

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  4. walt cowan

    walt cowan

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    Absurdistan
    can't be gunkid, no permit and still doing time at club fed.:supergrin:
     
  5. cpelliott

    cpelliott

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    Atlanta, GA
    His lawyer should be able to get the failure to inform thrown out, because the 2 charges related to the transport clearly indicate that he would be testifying against himself by informing.

    That is the crazy thing about failure to inform laws. They can only be used against people who are carrying perfectly legally.
     
  6. RussP

    RussP Moderator

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    Really? Do you have some case law supporting that?
    Well, there are other laws to take care of those carrying illegally.
     
  7. Bill Lumberg

    Bill Lumberg BTF Inventor

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    Once they fail to inform, they're no longer legal, in this jurisdiction.
     
  8. RussP

    RussP Moderator

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    That's what I was thinking.
     
  9. RichardinNC

    RichardinNC

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    Near the edge
     
    Last edited: Feb 10, 2012
  10. cpelliott

    cpelliott

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    Atlanta, GA
    Are you saying you don't understand how duty to inform are not enforceable when the underlying activity is criminal? Any law that demands reporting or licensing can only be enforced to the extent that they don't require self incrimination.

    As an example in Haynes v US, Haynes was charged with failure to register an NFA firearm. Since he was a felon, registering would be an act of self incrimination. SCOTUS agreed 7 to 1. The NFA was later modified to fix this. It's OK to make possession of something illegal. It's not OK to make the failure to report an illegal act a criminal violation.

    The 5th amendment issue is why most states don't have duty to inform laws for firearms. It can sink an entire case. Say someone follows the law and self incriminates to follow the law. A search turns up a dead body in the trunk. It could all be fruit of the poisonous tree.

    So back to my original point. Duty to inform laws essentially only affect law abiding citizens. People with illegal weapons do get charged, but the conflict with the 5th amendment is pretty easy to prove in court.
     
  11. AA#5

    AA#5

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    Teehee. His defense:

    "Your Honor, the failure to inform charge should be dropped because I was drunk at the time & we all know what alcohol does to memory."
     
  12. RussP

    RussP Moderator

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    So are you advising someone to just not tell law enforcement anything, even if required by law if they want to carry illegally?
     
  13. cpelliott

    cpelliott

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    Atlanta, GA
    I can't seem to find any such advice in the thread. My comments concern the legal issues of failure to inform laws. For some reason I can't figure out, a few people seem to regard the discussion as threatening. From the responses, it is clear that additional comment would not useful.
     
  14. He will get a lot thrown out and the carrying guns will be pbj or thrown out. A van/suv has no place to lock a gun so you throw them on a seat. But I think they will plea him out to a guilty on the drinking and then some classes. That is a guess. They really treat drunks seriously now. The leo took the "shotgun approach" to the charges. :whistling:
     
  15. I agree but they use the failure to inform as pc to go "fishing". :whistling:
     
  16. Ryobi

    Ryobi SummertimeRules

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    RS, not PC. And there's nothing wrong with someone breaking the law constituting RS. Break the law, and win prizes.
     
  17. RussP

    RussP Moderator

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    Central Virginia
    I didn't say it is there, therefore I asked the question to clarify. Again, would it be your advice that if one chooses to carry illegally, as in this scenario, one should not make statements that would reveal the illegal carry?
    Yes.
    Who exactly do you believe feels threatened by the discussion. We can ask them if they do and why.

    Why isn't the 5th amendment issue brought up in must inform states and used to overturn existing or defeat new legislation?