On pnp rules and the right to gun ownership

Discussion in 'Band of Glockers' started by Punisher_nbi45, Dec 8, 2012.


  1. Punisher_nbi45

    Punisher_nbi45 R we der yet?

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    Well, here we go again...for the past 2 motnhs or so, the pnp has decided to turn all the tules of gun ownership upside down.

    As if they weren't flawed to begin with...jus like the fact that you have gun stores "expedite" the prrocessing of licenses that, as per the rules, you would need a drug and psych test before getting a license....not to mention the abhorrent and costly process of getting a ptc...

    But now (well, as of the last gunshow), if you don't register your firearm/s by dec. 31, you WILL be considered in possession of unlicensed (& therefore illegal) firearms, and will b subject to a possible police operation if you don't surrender the same....

    WHAT A CROCK OF SH*T!!!

    I've always held the belief that firearms ownership, as long as done responsibly and yempered with the right training and mindset, is a constitutionally guaranteed human right. It should not be subject to the whims and caprices of a certain government agency whose reputation is that of a tarnished and corrupt institution. Now, to be fair, not all pnp ate like that, and i apologize to my pnp brothers and sisters who go day in and day out upholding the noble principles that are supposed to be the very core foundation of the pnp. But it just gets my goat that those narrow-minded few, when faced with both the pressure to stomp the worsening criminality in our country, come up with a half-*ss idea that is only meant to line up their pockets.

    The bottom line is: if you restrict legal and responsible gun ownership, what are you left with? A nation of blind and mindless sheep? And who are you really helping out in the long run? The citizenry or the criminals?

    Or do you want to turn the country into a nation of criminals by taking the legal guns out of the handns of respinsible, God-fearing, and law-abiding citizens?

    Do you think your "clever" and partial rules would be followed (or even noticed) by the criminal elements?

    I think it's about time for the responsible gun owners sehment to stand up and be heard. Gun ownership should be made a priority issue, and we should start looking for and electing leaders who will make sure that our rights will be allowed to flourish, not infringed. Tightening down on gun ownership will not solve anything except the problems of criminals on how to move more freely.

    Once society is disarmed, who will protect us, the regular joes and janes? Frankly, i hate to thi k what i will do if it comes to that, but rest assured, i will not give up my rights without a fight.

    Message ends.

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  3. i think this will only promote more unlicensed firearms. who in the right mind will register their firearms knowing that any changing of guards or different interpretation of the rules will result in confiscations?

    to clarify, even if our licenses are not expired yet, we need to register by end of this year? is this another money making scheme?

    why do they always target responsible gun owners? they know where the "paltiks" are made, they know where to look for private armed groups, why don't they start there? do they honestly think that criminals will follow their new rules? they can have my firearm if they can guarantee my safety and security like in Singapore.
     

  4. What does register mean? Is this different from already having a licensed and legal firearm with an up to date license? Does this mean that apart from the updated license we still need to register our fa's separately?
     
  5. Brian Lee

    Brian Lee Drop those nuts

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    And what exactly does PNP stand for???
     
  6. Travelin' Jack

    Travelin' Jack Misinformed

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    Philippine National Police.
     
  7. I suppose ironically these are the individuals (criminals and illegal private armies) that the PNP could not control but would want to control through all these rules, which they are in fact immune whereas have resulted to penalizing the legitimate gun owners.

    Bottomline, it is not new or change in laws that is needed rather full enforcement of existing laws.This is where the focus should be.

    One could only hope that the changes in the laws are not simply to mask the failures of enforcement by showing the public that they are taking action by what - changing the rules of the game, which would by perception show they are taking action, though illogically targeting the responsible peaceful law abiding gun owners.
     
  8. Punisher_nbi45

    Punisher_nbi45 R we der yet?

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    To quote Thomas Jefferson:

    "The tree of Liberty must, from time to time, be refreshed with the blood of patriots and TYRANTS!"

    ;) ;)


    posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire
     
  9. Re: ptt's
    FED will check daw applicants if they do compete monthly and kung member ng ppsa kung bibigyan ng ptt to all accredited ranges
    Matrabaho yata yan or do they just plan to google every name that applies for a ptt? :)
    O well, may reason na ulit para pumutok
     
  10. glak

    glak perpeksyon

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    Pahingi Ng Pera. :whistling:
     
  11. From what I can see, they are trying to implement what the commonwealth states are doing, i.e. Australia, UK, New Zealand, Canada etc. In these countries and some EU member countries require competitors to at least show that they are active in the sport by at least attending once a month competition may it be an interclub or a competition within just the club itself, which is designated as the club day of the week.

    Note that these countries dont allow the use of firearms for self defense with the premise that it should be the police and its armed offender squad (i.e. SWAT) responsible in upholding the law.

    The problem in the Philippines is that crime is more violent than what is experienced in these commonwealth states that it requires lethal force response most of the time, whereas crimes in the commonwealth states do not usually involve weapons and if it does involve a gun, the AOS, aka SWAT are called in and are at the scene in less than 5 mins and they are known to relentlessly pursue the offender.

    So the Philippines in my opinion should be somewhat more closely resembles the US in which gun laws should be somewhat similar to that, tempered to some degree in order to avoid something like Columbine from happening. Then again if something similar to Columbine does happen, it is very likely that it would be an unlicensed firearm as it is still relatively easy to source as long as one is determined to get hands on those "paltiks"
     
  12. horge

    horge -=-=-=-=-
    Lifetime Member

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    Registration and licensing go hand-in-hand when you buy
    or otherwise acquire a firearm. After an initial registration
    and licensing, you're obligated to renew licenses every 2
    years.

    Note that in the Philippines, it is the firearm, rather than
    the owner, which is licensed: PNP does not run a FOID-
    based system.

    Who are affected by the recent change in policy?
    AFAICT, the PNP is NOT saying that firearms with valid
    licenses will need registering anew. Only firearms with
    expired or nearly-expired licenses are affected.

    How are they affected?
    Formerly, if you were a little late in renewing your firearm
    licenses, you only faced extra penalty fees, IIRC scaled
    to your tardiness. Also (and again IIRC), you would have
    had to neglect your renewal for 2 whole years before the
    concerned firearm(s) might be deemed "loose", and you
    thence could be charged with the illegal possession of a
    firearm, punishable by up to 8(?) years in prison, with the
    confiscation of all your firearms and related gear.

    The recent changes?
    PNP is now saying that the second your license expires,
    you are treated as if chargeable with illegal possession.
    This has harsh implications for those whose gun licenses
    have expired only in the last several months or so, most
    especially provincial owners who face delays in renewal
    processing, owing to PNP's Manila-centic registration
    system. Not only are affected gun owners under threat
    of being raided and charged with a crime, but even if
    they should fulfill their obligations to renew their licenses
    before anything unpleasant DOES befall them, they may
    now have to re-register their affected guns, with all the
    considerable cost and effort involved, even though their
    affected guns still remain recorded in the PNP registry!

    Still other changes are discussed in this recent thread:
    http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1454799

    If someone knows a better assessment of the situation,
    kindly correct me, but in the case of expired licenses and
    renewal/re-registration...

    The excuse for this arbitrary change in policy is cited by
    PNP as a directive from the President to account for all
    loose firearms (literally, guns that PNP cannot account
    for) before the General Elections in May 2013.

    Note that PNP's new policy does little for the problem of
    firearms that were NEVER registered, a serious issue in
    the Muslim south which PNP seems too timid to face.*
    Law-abiding gun owners in the Christian north are easier
    targets, perhaps.


    So...
    What happened to all the hype that a "pro-gun" President
    such as Noynoy Aquino would mean better times for legit
    gun-owners? Just how far can reality swerve from popular
    impressions and expectations?

    For example...
    I see plenty of reasons to vote Jack Enrile for senator, but
    if Pres. Noynoy's post-election record is to serve as guide,
    should I now fear that once senator, PPSA honcho Enrile
    will also go against perceived grain, and facilitate further
    restrictions on Filipino gun ownership?

    These are strange and troubling times.
    Keep fighting for your rights, and vote wisely.





    * To be fair, PNP has had improved success in recovering
    loose firearms from criminal groups all over the country, via
    proper policework this year. There are between 350,000 and
    650,000 loose firearms estimated in the Philippines, the bulk
    of this number is taken from known-registers that have not
    been license-renewed for some time, and includes fragment
    records carried-over from as far back as the 1950's.
     
    #11 horge, Dec 10, 2012
    Last edited: Dec 14, 2012
  13. asian_glockster

    asian_glockster Hook Up!!!!!!!!

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    I think Jack Enrile's concern is only sports shooting. As long as shooting sport (PPSA) will still be allowed, then IMO, it's not a concern for him.


    As for our "Progun" President, he is not affected because he is being protected by a regiment sized unit.

    For us mere mortals, we are left to fend for ourselves...
     
  14. In Canada, you don't have to be a gun club member if you own non-restricted firearms. An Authority to Transport (ATT) is also not required for this classification of firearm. If you own a restricted firearm (pistol with a barrel length of 4.1" or more, an AR type rifle, or a rifle with a folding stock with less than 18" barrel length), you need to be a gun club member. You also need an Authority to Transport (ATT) for restricted firearms which covers all accredited gun ranges as well as gunsmiths in the province; which covers all the restricted firearms you own, in most cases, valid through the life of your firearms license (which is five years), and which is also free of charge.

    Firearms owners only need to pay a one-time fee totalling around $100.00 for the initial firearms license, valid for five years. After that, firearms license renewal is free of charge. There are now talks that the firearm license validity would be changed from five years to ten years (or even longer), courtesy of the level-headed Conservative Party who presently is the ruling party in Canada. The Conservative Party also ordered the Firearms Registry for Non-restricted firearms destroyed with the exception of Quebec, who fought to have the registry in their province retained.

    While the Conservative government in Canada is working to untangle the mess the former Liberal government created by relaxing gun laws, the Philippines is doing the opposite.
     
    #13 isuzu, Dec 11, 2012
    Last edited: Dec 12, 2012
  15. Found this on the internet, and it best summarizes the value of gun ownership:

    "A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have suffficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government." - George Washington
     
  16. I believe we follow the same rules across the ditch down under, with the only difference being all pistols are considered restricted weapons and require one to be active in a gun club. However we are not required to have any sort of authority to transport if one is bringing it to a shooting event anywhere in the country and license is for the individual and not the firearm which goes 10 years. In short, 1 license for all guns you own.

    Incidentally and on the side, rules were changed with regards to storage during the Australasian 2013 requiring all competitors to have their guns stored with the organizers but with normal shoots, a shooter can have it with him in the hotel, subject to certain conditions in which it is the responsibility of the individual to comply with the law.
     
  17. I wnoder if the PNP will have the same number of restrictions and requirements kung walang bayad ang license/ptt/ptc etc :)
     
  18. Correct me if I'm wrong, but are semi-auto rifles not allowed in Australia? Semi-auto rifles are allowed in Canada but are restricted to 5 round magazines with the exception of the M1 Garand and the AR-type rifles which can use LAR 10-round magazines
     
  19. PMMA97

    PMMA97 MNSAmessdetail

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    Kung wala silang mapapala lalong hihgpitan yan. Pati sumpit i-regulate.

    God Complex on! :supergrin:
     
  20. mikey177

    mikey177 Remember

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    I was pleasantly surprised to discover that the PNP Satellite Office in Metrotown Mall, Tarlac City processes FA license renewals. I was on my way to Manila last week to get my licenses renewed at Crame when I decided to pass by this mall for lunch.

    I saw the PNP office and inquired about license renewal. They said I could apply there and the license would be processed within 1 to 2 days. True enough, they texted me the following day to inform me that my renewed licenses were already available. (I think they have their own ID card printer there, at least that's what one of the devices in their office looked like).

    I don't know if they offer this same service in other provinces.
     
  21. horge

    horge -=-=-=-=-
    Lifetime Member

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    That's great news, Mike. :)

    They ought to, and down to large municipalities.
     
    #20 horge, Dec 13, 2012
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2012

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