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Obama just said...

Discussion in 'The Okie Corral' started by Rabbi, Oct 16, 2012.

  1. Acujeff

    Acujeff

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    Actually, Romney was not yet in office and so did not sign the permanent 1998 MA AWB into law.

    If you actually examine his record it is clear Romney signed no anti-2A bills while he was Gov. of MA 2002-2006. Romney only reduced gun control, removed gun control from bills or signed pro-2A bills into law.

    What is known today as the highly restrictive gun control laws in MA were passed in 1998 by the Massachusetts legislature. It included MA’s assault weapons ban (MGL Chapter 140, Section 131M) that was more restrictive than the 1994 Fed AWB.

    Here’s the entire 1998 CHAPTER 180 AN ACT RELATIVE TO GUN CONTROL IN THE COMMONWEALTH OF MA
    http://www.malegislature.gov/Laws/Se...998/Chapter180

    If you actually read the law it is clear that this ban did not rely on the federal language, was not tied to the federal AWB and contained no sunset clause. The expiration of the Fed AWB in 2004 did not get rid of MA's own permanent AWB.

    MA Gun owners wanted to get rid of the ban in 2004, but did not have the votes in the state Legislature (over 85% anti-gun Democrat). When the Fed ban expired in 2004, Gun Owners’ Action League (the MA based pro-2A group) and Romney used the opportunity to amend the MA AWB by including the federal assault weapon exemptions and a few other improvements that were not in the state law and correct some abuses in MA‘s gun laws.

    CHAPTER 150 AN ACT FURTHER REGULATING CERTAIN WEAPONS
    http://www.malegislature.gov/Laws/Se...004/Chapter150

    If Romney did not sign that bill, the more restrictive AWB would still be in place today.

    So the actual truth is, in 2004, Romney signed a bill that amended the permanent AWB and made it less strict. Some folks are misrepresenting his record and claiming that Romney signed the AWB permanently into effect and that our AWB was set to expire in 2004. But, unlike those folks, I've posted the laws and facts. I challenge them to show us in those laws where their fabrications are documented.

    Let's look at the rest of Romney's record:
    During the Romney Administration he met and worked with Gun Owners’ Action League (the Mass. based pro-2A group) and no anti-second amendment or anti-sportsmen legislation made its way to the Governor’s desk. In addition, he removed any anti-second amendment language from bills like the Gang Violence bill passed in 2006, and signed five pro-second amendment bills into law.

    Romney‘s entire record:
    http://www.goal.org/newspages/romney.html

    Recently discovered report forces the question: Do I owe Mitt Romney an apology?
    by Chad D. Baus
    http://www.ammoland.com/2012/10/02/g...#ixzz28AyBR021
    - it appears that the central "fact" that most gun owners "know" about Mitt Romney - namely that he signed a new assault weapons ban in Massachusetts in 2004 - isn't a fact at all. My sense is that knowledge of the GOAL report may allow some pro-gun voters, who may have been hesitant to go "All In," to feel much better about voting for the only man who stands a chance at defeating Barack Obama. Mr Romney, for whatever it's worth, I apologize.

    Romney has already been politically tested on the RKBA against a congress that was 85% anti-2A and his record is all pro-2A which is very encouraging for gun owners.

    It is understandable that Obama supporters are going to come to gun forums and try to persuade us to avoid supporting and voting for Romney. The liberal mainstream media and politicians are using the same strategy to desperately misrepresent and revise Romney's record in all arenas and distract us from Obama's record and agenda. Expect to see a lot more leading up to the election.

    Here's President Obama's record:
    Fast and Furious and the subsequent cover-up (the biggest criminal political scandal in American history), which lead to orders registering gun purchases in the four southern border states, using the ATF to harass gun shops out of business and promoting the UN Gun Ban Treaty. He also appointed two anti-RKBA Supreme Court Justices and 125 anti-RKBA liberals to federal judgeships, including 25 to appellate courts.

    Under an expansion of the civil forfeiture doctrine, Obama has just given the ATF the power to seize your firearms if they choose to, without due process, and even if you are not under investigation. Under Obama’s new decree, if the ATF says they are going to confiscate your firearms, they can.

    Imagine what he'll do if he gets a second term. In the very least, more regulations and executive orders governing every aspect of gun and ammo ownership and commerce, lots more anti-gun judges and up to four more anti-gun Supreme Court justices. Obama and the Democrats are campaigning not only on making the expired federal Assault Weapons Ban permanent, but also making guns “childproof”, banning private gun transfers and sales, and regulating ammo purchases.

    http://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/jul/30/second-amendment-at-risk-in-second-term/
    http://change.gov/agenda/urbanpolicy_agenda

    Romney is not "the same as Obama", the "lesser of evils" or "Obama-lite". In 2008 he was rated "B" by the NRA and Obama was rated "F". Since then, Romney has only become more pro-2A and Obama more anti-2A. The NRA is endorsing the Romney/ Ryan ticket for this election. Romney would be a much better President for gun-owners than Obama.

    Romney is campaigning on dismantling Obama's anti-gun actions in the UN and on the Southern border, appointing a new Attorney General and make sure Fast and Furious is actually investigated and prosecuted, stop the abuses of the ATF, and appointing up to four more pro-RKBA Supreme Court Justices.

    It's up to individual gun-owners to to get the facts and make sure we're not scammed into giving Obama another term.

    Romney‘s positions:
    http://washingtonexaminer.com/gop-se...rticle/2506043
    http://www.mittromney.com/issues/gun-rights
    http://www.mittromney.com/issues/courts-constitution
     
  2. ilgunguygt

    ilgunguygt Enslaved in IL

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    So given the choice we should vote for Obama, right? Because he is better for gun owners?:rofl:

    If you cant read the party platforms and listen to what they have to say in the debates to understand the difference, then you certainly the one lacking the common sense.

    Why dont you read the post between mine and yours while you are at it! Its amazing how smart some internet trolls arent.
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2012

  3. Schlitz

    Schlitz

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    [​IMG]
    You still think that someone HAS to be republican or democrat? :rofl: I don't advocate for supporting any of these guys.
    Listen to what they say in debates? Like when Romney tried to make us believe the AWB was about automatics? And when he said automatics are illegal here?
    >calling someone dumb on the internet
    >simultaneously failing to use apostrophes when needed
     
  4. Cubdriver

    Cubdriver

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    You STILL don't get the Supreme Court LIFETIME APPOINTMENT thing, do you? :upeyes: :dunno:

    -Pat
     
  5. wildmanjeff

    wildmanjeff

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    freakin guy flopin' around LOL
     
  6. redbaron007

    redbaron007 Some Dude Lifetime Member

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    It's the act of comprehension........ :dunno: :faint:


    :wavey:

    red
     
  7. Schlitz

    Schlitz

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    You STILL don't get the ASSAULT WEAPONS ARE 'INSTRUMENTS OF DESTRUCTION WITH THE SOLE PURPOSE OF HUNTING PEOPLE DOWN AND KILLING THEM thing', do you? :dunno:

    That's the guy you want appointing justices? lol!
     
  8. Acujeff

    Acujeff

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    Only Obama and the Democrat party are campaigning for more gun control and a permanent AWB:

    President Obama can use an executive order and bypass Congress all together. After all, as of October 2012, President Obama has already issued 140 executive orders.

    We know what the old assault weapons ban looked like, but what would a new, federal assault weapons ban include?

    http://cdn2.cheaperthandirt.com/blo...ampaign=20121103-Chronicle-Vol1Iss13+Campaign
     
  9. Providence

    Providence

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    This is fact. Remember, "This is too important to wait on Congress to act."? O. Stated he wants gun control. R. Has stated that he does not.
     
  10. Acujeff

    Acujeff

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    We were fortunate that 5 Supreme Court Justices in Heller and McDonald confirmed the Second Amendment as an individual right to armed self defense and must be applied to all levels of government. And, in case you forgot, we were fortunate that Bush, often labeled not pro-2A enough for making the same comment as Romney, appointed Alito and Roberts as Justices to make that pro-2A majority and obtain that opinion.

    However, the minority opinion by the other four Justices was that the Second Amendment:

    - did not protect a private right of armed self-defense
    - does not apply to the states
    - does not apply to individuals outside of the militia context

    If there were five, instead of four, anti-Second Amendment Justices the RKBA would have been effectively written out of the Bill of Rights.

    It could still happen. The composition of the Court can change and prior decisions can be overturned.

    Four US Supreme Court Justices (Scalia, Kennedy, Breyer and Ginsburg) will be 80 or older, and two, Thomas and Alito above 65, by the end of Obama's second term. He could likely appoint 4 more Justices if he is re-elected - all of whom will be making momentous decisions about our lives for decades to come. An anti-2A Court would be free to re-define and dismantle the RKBA out of existence. The current anti-2A Justices have already stated their intention to do exactly that.

    Anti-Second Amendment Justice Ginsberg has stated that the majority opinions in this case are “grievously mistaken”, that minority opinions would be used to rewrite legal history and create a purely “collective right connected to the militia” and she looks forward to the day a “future, wiser court“ overturns Heller. John Paul Stevens recently told Time magazine the one thing in particular he would change about the American judicial system “I would change the interpretation of the Second Amendment. The court got that quite wrong.”

    Obama appointed anti-Second Amendment Justices, Sotomayor and Kagan. Given the opportunity he will do it again. All they need is one more like minded Justice to get a majority of five anti’s and implement their stated agenda through the courts.

    Valerie Jarrett, the most influential senior adviser to President Obama, was recently addressing other Obama senior staffers… “After we win this election, it’s our turn. Payback time. Everyone not with us is against us and they better be ready because we don’t forget. The ones who helped us will be rewarded, the ones who opposed us will get what they deserve. There is going to be hell to pay..... Congress won’t be a problem for us this time. No election to worry about after this is over and we have two judges ready to go.”

    If the Supreme Court becomes majority anti-2A, we’ll never see a pro-RKBA victory again in our lifetime.

    There are already more RKBA cases headed to the Supreme Court involving the private right of carry and armed self-defense outside the home, the heavy restrictions in places like Chicago and Washington DC, whether police can arbitrarily deny firearm permits to law abiding applicants, and whether governments can ban entire classes of popular firearms.

    http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/oct/1/gun-carry-in-the-obama-era/

    In addition, since taking office, Obama has appointed 125 anti-RKBA liberals to federal judgeships, including 25 to appellate courts. At present, there are 86 vacancies on district and appellate courts, 39 of which already have pending nominees before the Senate. It’s not in gun owners best interests to give him a second term and the opportunity to appoint more anti-2A judges and justices.

    Though there are a few folks revising and misrepresenting his record, Romney has a much better record and a much better choice for gun owners than Obama. He is campaigning on appointing pro-2A conservative Supreme Court Justices like Roberts, Scalia, Thomas, and Alito. While Justices don't always vote the same way, these four Justices have consistently ruled in favor of the RKBA.

    In order to do that, we have to fire Obama and hire Romney. If gun owners don’t care about a pro-RKBA Supreme Court, why should the rest of the voters?

    http://www.mittromney.com/issues/courts-constitution
    http://washingtonexaminer.com/gop-set-to-ok-most-pro-gun-platform-ever/article/2506043
     
  11. JFrame

    JFrame

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    This is another very crucial point. We tend to focus -- when we focus at all -- on the SCOTUS judges, and forget that the president holds the key in spreading federal judges throughout the land. These are the judges who are establishing decisions and precedence at their respective levels, and are cutting their teeth and establishing "creds" toward a SCOTUS nomination in the future.

    These ARE the breeding grounds for the Bader Ginsburgs and Sotomayors...


    .
     
  12. Cubdriver

    Cubdriver

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    I'd rather him than the one that's ALREADY appointed TWO fervently anti-2nd amendment justices to the SC so far. :shocked: :upeyes:

    -Pat
     
  13. Schlitz

    Schlitz

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    I'm going to remember this moment in glocktalk history when years from now down the road one of Mitt's (if he's elected) judges ends up being the one that goes south when a big deal 2nd amendment case comes around. brb, adding this thread to my bookmarks.

    +100000 internet points to me when it ends up being a assault weapons related case and Romney's judge says something along the lines of assault weapons being "instruments of destruction"
     
  14. kirgi08

    kirgi08 Watcher. Silver Member

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  15. Cubdriver

    Cubdriver

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    Riiiiiiiiight. Because of course if Obama gets in for a second term (which you've previously stated is what you'd rather see), he's certain to appoint justices that will wholeheartedly support the second, right? (That would be the polar opposite of the two that he's appointed thus far, just in case you weren't paying attention.)

    When given the option of supporting the guy who might possibly appoint a justice that doesn't fully support the second versus the guy who HAS ALREADY placed TWO that are flat out opposed to it and when the opportunity presents itself in the future will almost assuredly do the same again, it defies logic to want the latter to win over the former. :faint:

    Sometimes firearms owners are our own worst enemies.

    -Pat
     
  16. Peace Warrior

    Peace Warrior Am Yisrael Chai CLM

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    Obama just said,

    " I won *******!!!"

    " I got me four more years my nizzle!!! "

    "Hey, romney, you dumb *******, instead of $5000 for food, you should have given everybody on welfare free cell phones!!!"

    "It's how I roll."

    :tongueout: