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No Refusal DWI Checkpoints

Discussion in 'The Okie Corral' started by Random, Dec 28, 2012.

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  1. Mayhem like Me

    Mayhem like Me Semper Paratus

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    To El Conquistador..


    Since I track this stuff we don't use road checks they are worthless.

    We use the more effective saturation patrols.

    We hardly ever reach goals on arrests and we have never had or been threatened to have grant money pulled.

    Our fatalities from DUI drugs and alcohol are below the national average at 18% and our agency has won numerous traffic safety awards,guess what this year we are down 3 dedicated officers in our traffic section and our fatalities have soared upwards and increased by a large percentage.With no other significant changes in population or traffic patterns I can't say it is the only cause effect but I will track and compare.
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2012
  2. Mayhem like Me

    Mayhem like Me Semper Paratus

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    I could care less what you call me.

    I will call you Mr or Ms whatever your last name is , you can choose to show how much of an arrogant jerk you are and I will smile and be professional.
    I will introduce myself if you care to use my rank and last name great if not who cares .

    I won't get in the dirt with you , it is counterproductive.
     

  3. Sharky7

    Sharky7 Boomshakalaka

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    I think you are just mistaken about what is actually happening and basing this thread off a brief sitting on a bumper conversation.

    Do you believe they are forcing blood draws without warrants, without arrest, without probable cause, or all of the above?

    There are many checks and balances set in place for warrants...that is why it is unbelievable. Everyone who reads, signs, approves that warrant has to be "in" on it.
     
  4. DanaT

    DanaT Pharaoh

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    You have my title incorrect.

    But my substitute one is Pharaoh or Decius. However, those are not official.


    And going back many pages, what have I and others said about DUI enforcement? Seems like the exact same thing as here. No-one has argued that DUI enforcement is bad, we have said checkpoints should not be in place because of lack of probable cause and that they are ineffective. Since you contradict that checkpoints are the way to go I can only reach a few conclusions:
    1) You are unintelligent
    2) You are not a copp
    3) You don't know what you are talking about because of 1&2.

    I think I covered all the defenses of DUI checkpoints.



    That is different than the link that I posted. Not all areas work in the same way.


    Again, until you can show statistical significance against the null hypothesis, it is an interesting data point, but not does not mean anything. That is a problem with data like this. It is just like the gun control. People assume causation, because it fits their agenda, and absent proof it is "fact". You will see that gun control advocates talk about lack of assault weapons in Europe being why there are lower homicide rates, yet they leave Switzerland out. Why? Because they cannot make a statistically valid argument against the null hypothesis if they include it (FYI Switzerland has almost all male citizens with a machine gun in their house and yet has a lower murder rate than Germany)
     
  5. RussP

    RussP Super Moderator Moderator

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    "What" isn't that important.

    At what point in the encounter would you expect them to use your proper title?
     
  6. Mayhem like Me

    Mayhem like Me Semper Paratus

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    There are no Mandatory blood draws without a proper search warrant based on probable cause it is that simple , and can be the smell of alcohol on you and or you admitting to drinking, unsteady gait...blah blah..blah.
     
  7. RussP

    RussP Super Moderator Moderator

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    Did that, the part in bold, result in a loss of funding?
     
    Last edited: Dec 29, 2012
  8. Officer X

    Officer X

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    Probable Cause is not required for a motor vehicle stop or for a DWI checkpoint.
     
  9. Mayhem like Me

    Mayhem like Me Semper Paratus

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    You seems have trouble with reading comprehension.

    No where In the article you posted did it say grant money was lost due to not reaching arrest goals..
    Should be simple enough for you to prove, when did they loose grant money what year.

    If you were to also read my post I did not say the only reason fatalities increased was because of the lessened enforcement.
    We cannot actually scientifically track the cause and effect because the roadways are not a laboratory .

    Our best data tracking shows that targeting certain offenses In high collision areas reduces the number of crashes during and a short time after the increased enforcement.
     
  10. TBO

    TBO Why so serious? CLM

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    He has a problem with honesty and integrity.

    Sent from my Nexus 4 using Copatalk 2
     
  11. RussP

    RussP Super Moderator Moderator

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    How is that different than what is in the blog piece you quoted?

    Haven't you already said you didn't say Boulder lost their funding?
    What is the difference in what Mayhem said?
     
  12. RussP

    RussP Super Moderator Moderator

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    Don't know. Do you know?

    The 1,000 arrests goal, was that higher or lower than the preceding year? By what percent was it different? Did the 900+ arrests meet, fail to meet or did they exceed the preceding year's arrests?
    Yes, when zero violations occurred after the same efforts of previous years, that would be success.
    Maybe. Could also mean the location and or timing was wrong. But, yes, if the number of impaired drivers decreased, that is good.
     
  13. sombunya

    sombunya I Like To Watch

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    Long thread here. Take away the pissing matches and it would be 1/4 shorter.

    Every so often around the new year we hear about new DWI laws with "teeth" in them and yet the problem still exists bigly. The list of drivers with multiple DWI convictions is long.

    Put real teeth in the law and it will stop or reduce greatly. First offense, 10 year license suspension. Second offense, 10 years in the local jail, or something similar. And really do it. (Wait, that's Draconian, that would expensive, we don't have the room, blah blah blah, this is America, we can't do that.)

    I'm not a LEO or an expert, but I don't believe that people who have not drank a drop will be blowing .08's. This, based on jury service in more than one drunk driving murder case.
     
  14. RussP

    RussP Super Moderator Moderator

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    :thumbsup:
     
  15. rvanpelt

    rvanpelt

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    Refusal of the field or blow sobriety test will get you a trip to the station and refusal of a chemical sobriety test here in Nebraska will get you a one year license revocation, whether you are over the .08 or not. It's called implied consent law. Simple: Don't drink and drive.
    I used to teach a DMV required defensive driving class. The biggest percentage of students were drinkers and too many points under the age of 21 so I heard lots of stories aout refusals.
    Have a safe New Year's eve.:cool:
    Rod
     
  16. RussP

    RussP Super Moderator Moderator

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    Thanks, Rod.

    Any information on how they were arrested?
     
  17. w30olds

    w30olds

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    From my personal experience every time I've gone through one of these road blocks the cops already act like your guilty. No matter if you've been drinking, or not. It's like they are trying to trap you into saying something to incriminate yourself.

    The first question he asked me up front was "What have you had to drink". I told him. Then "Where are you coming/going to". So I answered his questions. Then he got an attitude like I insulted him.

    I was in my Mustang when I went through the road block. It's modified a lot and he proceeds to shine his flashlight around inside. Asks why I had a roll cage in the car. Then looks under the car to make sure I had the catalytic converters on my car. Was looking for anything to site me for. Cars street legal. Ridiculous.

    I'm all for getting drunks off the roads. No problems with it, but when the cops act like they are some sort of god that's out of line.
     
  18. certifiedfunds

    certifiedfunds Tewwowist

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    Unpossible


    Posted using Outdoor Hub Campfire
     
  19. w30olds

    w30olds

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  20. dino1

    dino1

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    Gee, it's ok to twist the 4th and 5th amendments how ever you see fit but by God you better not touch that 2nd....
     
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