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Need Absolved of Abortion? Hustle to Madrid.

Discussion in 'Religious Issues' started by ArtificialGrape, Aug 19, 2011.

  1. Paul7

    Paul7 New Guy

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    Why is this a story? Repentance and confession leading to salvation is quite common in the Bible.
     


  2. SDGlock23

    SDGlock23 Glockoholic

    You cannot have your sins absolved by anyone, they have to be forgiven by the King of Kings Himself, Jesus Christ.
     
  3. It seems that only a limited number of priests are normally authorized to absolve abortion within the Roman Catholic Church. However, for people that have been involved in abortion, and that happen to be in Madrid during this particular week, then they can be absolved by any of the priests administering confession for World Youth Day.

    It would appear that people that are not in Madrid for the week, and don't have access to one of the otherwise authorized priests are out of luck.

    -ArtificialGrape
     
  4. Sharkey

    Sharkey

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    Well I'm sure I will upset the "religious" Catholics but last I checked, I did not need a human priest to absolve me of anything. Christ is the Great Priest and my sins are already forgiven.

    Besides, have you seen the price of airfare to Madrid lately + luggage fees.

    This is a perfect example of religion vs. Christianity.
     
  5. Roering

    Roering Sorting nuts

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    Sometimes I wish Atheists would mind their own business and leave us believers alone.
     
  6. Like when Christians:
    • Tell consenting adults who to marry
    • Tell women what to do with their bodies
    • Tell researchers what can be done with a clump of cells
    • Tell people in AIDS ravaged Africa that condoms are evil
    • Are activists pushing to teach Christian Creation in science classes
    Is that the example of leaving alone that atheists should strive to follow?

    I would be glad to leave alone if religion was harmless, and I was left alone, but I don't see that happening.
     
  7. Roering

    Roering Sorting nuts

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    No, I was just speaking in terms of posting matters of the "other side" on internet threads. Let's not get off topic here AG.
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2011
  8. That wasn't clear from your previous message, but fair enough.

    I guess you didn't see the thread as a public service announcement for those that might be in need of absolution.

    Does it also bother you when snowbird and DonGlock initiate threads regarding matters involving the "other side", or does it all depend on who the "other side" is?
     
  9. Roering

    Roering Sorting nuts

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    A little. Probably why I don't look at them much anymore. And no, it really doesn't depend on who the "other side" is.

    You could do a search and find I have yet to post a thread about atheists doing this or that. Not my thing.
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2011
  10. You need to check again. Your beliefs are unscriptural and un-Apostolic.
     
  11. Sharkey

    Sharkey

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    Well I am definitely not a theologian but didn't they say the above about Jesus? I'll be doing my quiet time later so go ahead and point me to the scriptures I need to read to get my beliefs in line.

    So upon Christ's death, the curtain in the temple was torn apart for what reason? Accident?
     
  12. Not quite, but similar. Does that mean that everyone's addled theories are not unscriptural?

    Well, Christ indeed is the High Priest who forgives sins. But since He promised to ratify the decisions made by the Apostles (and Peter in particular), you need to go through the channels that He instituted. Yes, He can make exceptions, but to presume that you are one of the exceptions is, well, unsafe. As the Catholic Catechism says: "God has bound salvation to the sacrament of Baptism, but he himself is not bound by his sacraments." (CCC no. 1257). This applies to other sacraments as well.

    Start with these:

    Jn 20:22-23 - breathed on them, "receive Holy Sp." (recall Gn 2:7)
    whose sins you forgive/retain are forgiven/retained

    2 Cor 5:17-20 - given us the ministry of reconciliation

    James 5:13-15 - prayer of presbyters forgives sin

    Mt 18:18-whatever you bind & loose on earth, so it is in heaven


    You also said that "Christ is the Great Priest and my sins are already forgiven."
    This seems to imply that you buy into the "Once-Saved-Always-Saved" idea. If so, then there are dozens if not hundreds of places you need to read.



     
  13. Sharkey

    Sharkey

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    OOPS, I AM one of those folks
    . Are the dozens if not hundreds of places in the Bible or somewhere else? Hence my earlier statement of this thread being a good example of religion vs. Christianity. I think I am in the same camp as Billy Graham which seems like a pretty good camp to be in.

    Did you comment on the ripped curtain? If so, I missed it. Sorry.
     
  14. OK, that brings us back around to my earlier post, to wit:
    "Your beliefs are unscriptural and un-Apostolic."

    Did you bother to read the quote I gave earlier? I explained that there are exceptions.

    Very true. And THAT, my friend, is one huge reason that Christ left us with a teaching office. Otherwise, there'd be tens of thousands of different contradictory opinions, as we see in protestantism today.

    He didn't want that. He wanted us UNITED in TRUTH:

    1Co 1:10 I appeal to you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that all of you agree and that there be no dissensions among you, but that you be united in the same mind and the same judgment.

    See also:
    Eph 4:3-6 - one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God &Father
    Rom 16:17 - avoid those who create dissensions
    Phil 2:2 - be of same mind, united in heart, thinking one thing
    Rom 15:5 - God grant you to think in harmony w/ one another
    Jn 17:17-23 - I pray that they may be one, as we are one
    Jn 17:23 - that they may be brought to perfection as one

    Not really, since this isn't the camp that the Apostles were in.

    Yes, there are dozens if not hundreds of places in the Bible that will contradict the idea of OSAS (which was a novel idea made up in the 16th century).


    Nope. Did you provide YOUR interpretation? How much are you reading your beliefs into this event? This is known as eisegesis.
     
  15. Paul7

    Paul7 New Guy

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    Bert, do you believe in 'once baptized as an infant, always saved'?

    There is far less disagreement among Protestants on the essentials (as stated in the creeds) than imagined. Most of the differences are on secondary issues.
     
  16. Sharkey

    Sharkey

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    Dang, what is it with this RI section? So many folks are so quick to criticize (yeah I do my fair share) but refuse to answer a question I ask about their beliefs. I'm thinking I just need to stick with the CCW, Cop, and Knife section. Someone warned me not to come here, but did listen? No.

    At least you'll don't want to exterminate the pit bull here....................yet.

     
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2011
  17. Of course not. Why do you ask?

    Perhaps.
    But one essential is unity.

    Eph 4:3-6 - one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God &Father
    Rom 16:17 - avoid those who create dissensions
    Phil 2:2 - be of same mind, united in heart, thinking one thing
    Rom 15:5 - God grant you to think in harmony w/ one another
    Jn 17:17-23 - I pray that they may be one, as we are one
    Jn 17:23 - that they may be brought to perfection as one
     
  18. Right. But you avoided responding to what I actually said.

    No, your remarks are based on YOUR interpretaion, which is in conflict with the way the Church has interpreted them from the very beginning.

    You see, one of the major things that drew me to the Catholic Church was the actual historic continuity of belief and practice since the very founding of Christianity.

    Jesus set up those rules; only He can make exceptions to them. He's the judge.

    No, those exceptions are NOT listed in the Bible; that's the point. That's why we can not rely on those exceptions.


    That's quite simple: you are.

    You were doing OK until that last part.

    I'll not that you did NOT address the scripture passages I provided above which contradict your mere human "opinion."

    It may very well mean something like that. We don't really know. For instance, the text doesn't specify WHICH curtain was torn (there were two).

    Please elucidate.

    And, what pray tell do you think THAT means?

    Since the Pope met with Graham, didn't Graham also meet with the Pope?
    Did Billy ever tell the Pope, "hey you're doing it wrong"?

    Maybe the Pope is just more respectful than Billy.

    The Church's teachings are already there for all to see.

    Including, but not limited to, the NT (which the Church authored, through the Holy Spirit, protected, through the same Holy Spirit, and ratified, again through the same Holy Spirit).

    Actually, it was a Catholic scholar & rogue priest that invented that idea (Luther). Many heresies were invented by Catholic scholars, going back to Arius.

    No, one way to determine the proper interpretations of scripture is to see how the early Church understood these teachings. If you want to know what John and Peter taught, you could go to the students of John and Peter, for instance. The very men who were discipled and ordained by these Apostles (and who died as martyrs for the name of Jesus). If they were silent on these matters, go to THEIR disciples.


    If your beliefs won't stand up to scrutiny, then perhaps you should have heeded their advice.
     
  19. Sharkey

    Sharkey

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    My beliefs stand up to the Bible and Christian scholars who interpreted the Bible so I'm not too worried. I wonder if the priests who forgive sins and require baptism for salvation ever consider Revelations where the warning is given to those who would add or take away from the Scripture.

    Well you are right on the last sentence. I got to get out of here and not return. Between the atheist criticizing everyone and you folks with you religious dogma, it is a no win situation.

    Christ died for ALL my sins and I sure don't need a Catholic priest to baptize me or forgive me in a confessional (or maybe other things in a confessional) to obtain salvation.


    See, I knew I would make some Catholics mad. See you on the other side...........................maybe. :wow:
     
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2011