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Need a 45 acp +P recipe

Discussion in 'Reloading' started by Outer Rondacker, Nov 16, 2012.

  1. Outer Rondacker

    Outer Rondacker

    123
    0
    Dec 28, 2011
    I searched and check the first four pages and found nothing I was looking for so I will just ask.

    I am looking to reload some 45 acp+p cases (speer) with 230 g or 185 grain MG HP. I would like to use the 230s.

    I am looking to make this load good and hot for a Rifle not pistol.

    All are large pistol primers and I am looking for different recipes hoping I have the powder you are suggesting. I am only looking to load up 355 rounds since that is all I have for cases. Dont want to run out to buy a special powder I will never use again. But if I have to I will. That said. Please do share your info. OAL Powder Speed so on. Thanks
     
  2. GIockGuy24

    GIockGuy24 Bring M&M's

    4,037
    5
    Jul 14, 2005
    With Amber Lamps
    From the old hard cover Hodgdon load guide,

    185 grain JHP - 6.6 grains of HP38

    230 grain JHP - 6.0 grains of HP38

    In a 5 inch barreled Colt 1911 these loads gave me average velocities of 1129 fps and 955 fps.
     


  3. Kentguy

    Kentguy

    1,770
    115
    Nov 22, 2010
    Kent, OH
    NY Rebel,

    I'm not sure your going to get a lot of takers on offering +P loads. Perhaps you will. Those type of load are best worked up on your own using your equipment/pistols/rifles, as well as your level of understanding about ballistics. What I can tell you is your best bet is to copy factory rounds using your load books with the powder you have on the shelf.

    Use these numbers as your base of information, you can use whatever factory +P ammo you want, but the "Velocity" is what you focus on. When you check out your load books that will tell you based on which powder(s) you have on the shelf - how far you need to go in order to achieve "+P" range.

    Hornady "Custom" Ammunition (Factory Ammo)
    230g XTP HP +P
    Velocity - Box listed @ 950 fps / 887.6 fps my 5 shot average @ 75 degrees
    OAL - 1.230"
    Test Gun - Glock model 21 w/4.60" barrel

    Remember also that load book velocities for the .45 ACP are tested out of pistols (4", 5" barrels), If you are going to run these out of (I'm assuming a pistol caliber carbine?) rifle, you are going to achieve a higher velocity with that longer barrel, so keep that in mind.

    Primers - use what you have; Speer uses CCI #300, Hornady tests with Winchester's WLP, Lyman tests with both Remington 2 1/2 & CCI #300.

    I like the 230g bullet for this caliber over most all the rest. I have tested 2 other weights but I (or my G21) likes the 230g bullet best.

    I know this may not be exactly what you were looking for but I hope this gives you enough to start running your own tests.

    Good luck and please be safe. :thumbsup:
     
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2012
  4. Arc Angel

    Arc Angel Deus Vult!

    6,920
    6
    Sep 20, 2003
    Penn's Woods
    :goodpost: Very good post!

    No matter the gun, you've always got to work the load up in .1 grain increments for use in YOUR OWN gun(s). I'll give you a hint, though:

    Think, 'Vithavuori'! ;)
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2012
  5. SDGlock23

    SDGlock23 Glockoholic

    I tried a load found in Alliants reloader guide calling for 8.1gr of Power Pistol under a 230gr Gold Dot @ 1.260" (.45 ACP of course). It's the only powder I use in .45 Super, so I thought I would give it a try, but I don't have any Gold Dots. To note, this is not listed as +P either.

    8.1gr Power Pistol, 230gr Precision Delta FMJ @ 1.240", avg velocity out of Gen4 G21 w/5" KKM barrel : 993 fps

    Brass looked great as well.
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2012
  6. fredj338

    fredj338

    21,676
    902
    Dec 22, 2004
    so.cal.
    IF you are going off the books to make 45acp+P, do NOT use something like W231, you need to think slower powders. Unique works, WSF a bit better, about like PP. SInce none of us can measure +P pressures, what vel level are you looking for? A healthy does of BD will get top vel w/ lower pressures, so will LOngshot & AA#7.
     
  7. Outer Rondacker

    Outer Rondacker

    123
    0
    Dec 28, 2011
    I have the Lee second edition, Lyman 3rd, lyman 46th, hornady 3rd, speer #10, Hodgdon 25th and to be honest many more and not one list 45 +p or super. The rifle liked the speer +p 230 the best that is why I am looking to load up the same.

    Powders I have on hand without a hour trip to town are. IMR 4227, TiteGroup, Blue Dot, Imr HI-Skor 700-X, Reloder 7, and Unique. These are just some powders I have if none will work that is fine I was just looking to load a few up and step outback and give them a try today. Primers I will be using are WLP. I reload for my 45 Gap and use Titgroup and that seams to work fine but dont do much reloading of the 45 auto.
     
  8. fredj338

    fredj338

    21,676
    902
    Dec 22, 2004
    so.cal.
    Well TG & 700 are certainly out, pressure spikes will occur once you go past max. So of those BD or Unique. Again, what are you trying to achieve? A +P load is higher pressure, if you just want another 100fps, yo ucan get there w/o hitting +P pressures w/ either.
     
  9. F106 Fan

    F106 Fan

    8,033
    268
    Oct 19, 2011
    If you Google for '.45 acp rifle +p reload', you will run into Handloads.com and they have loads for .45 ACP +P

    I wouldn't use an Internet load on a bet because I have no idea where the data came from. Some is attributed to powder manufacturers, some is from guests. If you compare the manufacturer loads on Handload.com with those at their website, don't be surprised if they have backed off - a LOT!

    ALL OF THESE INTERNET LOADS ARE RISKY!

    .45 ACP max pressure is 21,000 psi
    .45 ACP +P max pressure is 23,000 psi

    And we have no way to measure pressure... I'm not sure it is worth the risk for only 10%,

    Any thought that looking at the primers from a pistol to determine pressure is pretty much debunked starting at page 59 of Speer #14 and page 194 of "Reloading for Handgunners".

    Richard
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2012
  10. Zombie Steve

    Zombie Steve Decap Pin Killa

    18,083
    18
    May 31, 2007
    Old Colorado City
    Sierra's data takes a 230 up to 6.8 grains of Unique with their JHP. I worked up this load years ago when I started reloading. Thought they were hot, finally put them over a chrono. At 6.7 grains / 1.210" OAL, I was getting 960 fps.

    :cool:

    Really have no reason to go that hot again.


    Definitely look for a slow burning powder. Blue Dot might be a good choice, but I wouldn't go faster than Unique.


    Also:

    http://www.handloads.com/loaddata/d...&Weight=185&type=Handgun&Order=Powder&Source=

    Take it with a grain of salt. Your fingers on the line.
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2012
  11. fredj338

    fredj338

    21,676
    902
    Dec 22, 2004
    so.cal.
    You are so wise for a guy living in a blue state.:wavey:
     
  12. Zombie Steve

    Zombie Steve Decap Pin Killa

    18,083
    18
    May 31, 2007
    Old Colorado City
    Yes, I've finally admitted that Colorado has fallen.


    I am still fighting the idea that the conservatives should be red states. Seems like the liberals are better suited to red.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
  13. fredj338

    fredj338

    21,676
    902
    Dec 22, 2004
    so.cal.
    Yeah, the libs took blue first as they knew the optics of red played against them. As long as guys like you & Jack live there, it isn't a total waste. I have my own little group of patriots here, but it gets smaller ever year as the smarter ones move out. I've got to get out soon. This state is completely doomed to fail sooner than later.
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2012
  14. snowwdog

    snowwdog snowwdog

    190
    2
    Nov 30, 2011
    georgia
    i have loaded 7.2 grains of universal clays under a 185 grain berrys for years. No pressure signs. please note i worked that up in my guns not yours. But it does have some serious bang. In a rifle it may go over pressure. Work it up and see what your cases tell you.
     
  15. RWBlue

    RWBlue Mr. CISSP, CISA CLM

    23,521
    832
    Jan 24, 2004
    1. What gun?
    2. Do you know how to read pressure signs?
    3. Do you have access to a chronograph?

    I would like to know the answers to 1, 2, and 3 before going on, but for expediency.

    I am not going to tell you what to do. I am just saying if I were to do what you are suggesting this is how I would go about it. If you decide to do this you are on your own and I take no responsibility for your actions.

    If I were to try to do this.....
    1. I think I would find all the reloading data I could for 45Super and 45Rowland.
    2. Then I would match up the data in a spreadsheet to the data I can find for 45ACP.
    3. Then I would find a powder that works in the 45Super/Rowland that I also have data for in the 45ACP.
    4. Then I would slowly work up my 45ACP until I saw a sign of pressure or reached the velocity I wanted. Assuming I was watching the primers I should be able to be safe.


    If I was not watching the primers and going very slow. If I were loading for a G21 I would expect to see signs of the unsupported barrel before I got a KABOOM. For the 1911, I don't think I would get that sign, I would just go over the limit and ....

    There is only one powder you posses that is a possibility and I wouldn't use it because I have loaded 45Super with it before and didn't like the results. I would buy a different powder if I decide to do this.
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2012
  16. Outer Rondacker

    Outer Rondacker

    123
    0
    Dec 28, 2011
    1. Marlin Model 45
    2. Yes
    3. Not at my house

    The day has ended. I will not be loading anything today. Powder is not an issue anymore as I can grab some while out shopping this weekend. Like I said was looking for something to do today but didnt work out. That is ok.

    What powders would you guys use, If buying to do this? I am sure I can use up the rest of the powder on a different load some day.
     
  17. RWBlue

    RWBlue Mr. CISSP, CISA CLM

    23,521
    832
    Jan 24, 2004
    I was under the impression that +p and Marlin 45 was a no no?
     
  18. Zombie Steve

    Zombie Steve Decap Pin Killa

    18,083
    18
    May 31, 2007
    Old Colorado City
    Where I live in El Paso County is one of the most conservative spots on the planet... Denver and Boulder (along with the limousine liberal towns like Aspen and Vail) are just too swamped with beings.

    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=icmRCixQrx8"]Idiocracy - YouTube[/ame]
     
  19. Zombie Steve

    Zombie Steve Decap Pin Killa

    18,083
    18
    May 31, 2007
    Old Colorado City
  20. fredj338

    fredj338

    21,676
    902
    Dec 22, 2004
    so.cal.
    ^^TRUE^^
    Same here in Kommifornia. Orange County is one of the msot conservative, but that is starting to change. Man I need to get out of this frickin state.