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L.A.P.D. Qualification

Discussion in 'Cop Talk' started by Trigger Finger, Oct 13, 2012.

  1. Being a retired detective for LAPD this caught my interest.

    It's interesting but I don't see how anyone could knowingly say that the average shooter could not pass the basic LAPD qualification course! Almost anyone could pass it with a minimal of training. Now specialized units like surveilance units and SWAT have considerably higher standards, the basic course is not that difficult.

    The way they have it laid out is basically correct. The other information is also basically correct. You begin at the 7 yard line and their are more head shots but it is accurate in every other way as best as I recall. I did retire in 2005 so they might have changed it a little but certainly not much.

    http://www.guns.com/debunking-the-lapds-handgun-qualification-myth-11196.html
     
  2. SAR

    SAR CLM

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    A lot of cops can't even pass it. I see officers going through it time and time again, twice, three times, even more, until they get a passing score. Some give up in frustration and come back another day. Luckily, I am not one of those guys.
     


  3. Since more and more departments are hiring people that look good on paper but that shouldn't be cops, qualifications have been dumbed down to the point where the lowest common denominator can pass. I'm not sure if that is the case with LAPD, but it is certainly the case with departments in my area.

    I have had to change the qualification requirements when a significant number of people can't pass, not because the course of fire was difficult, but because certain people (admin included), don't deem it necessary to spend the small amount of time that is required to stay proficient.
     
  4. CW Mock

    CW Mock

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    Most qual courses are the "no cop left behind" type around here anymore. It's kind of sad to hear people sweating the "long range" shots at 25 yards.


    Outdoor Hub mobile, the outdoor information engine
     
  5. steveksux

    steveksux Massive Member

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    What's the problem, do they forbid the use of sights for the 25 yard shots, or are they not using them voluntarily??? :rofl:

    Randy
     
  6. Tiro Fijo

    Tiro Fijo

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  7. The scary part is that my organization allows people to stay on the street that manage to fail the rifle qual and they won't make them re-shoot it. The sad part is that our rifles have optics.
     
  8. RF7126

    RF7126

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    SAR,
    Slightly off topic but I'm curious; I know SWAT and SIS (is that correct?) guys can carry 1911s, can patrol officers also qualify with and carry a 1911?
     
  9. I was a Detective Supervisor but spelling was not part of the promotion process. Reminds me of a Lieutenant I worked for who would constantly tell us " Yes, it was a great shooting and all the reports are completed properly but you misspelled this word, here let me circle it in red felt tipped pen. Now redo everything." :supergrin::supergrin:

    That's what happens when an old timer tries to speed type. :rofl:


    RF7126, when I was on the job (prior to 2005) the only section or division authorized to carry a 1911 was SWAT. As near as I recall.
    Only after I retired, keeping in touch with old partners, SIS became authorized to carry a 1911, Glock 21 or 4506 if you carried a S&W prior to 2000 or 2001. Prior to that SIS used the S&W 4506 or 4566 that were engraved by the department.

    The average patrol officer is authorized to carry a Glock 21, or if you go through a two or three day school AND qualify every month, can carry a 1911. I believe SAR is authorized to carry a 1911 so he would know more about what's going on currently!

    SAR, I am sure your knowledge on patrol qualification is much better than mine and perhaps I spoke too soon. After about 1992 I had very little dealings with patrol.

    TF
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2012
  10. SAR

    SAR CLM

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    Patrol Qualification is no different from Detective qualification. Everyone qualifies at the same ranges; either Elysian Park, Davis or the Harbor. You can qualify on either the Combat or Bonus Course. A year or two ago, they changed the qualification dates for everyone. So it's no more Odd or Even serial numbers. Now everyone qualifies in two month cycles. I actually hate the new system and prefer the old way where the months you qualified were determined by your Department Serial Number. Odd Serials qualified in certain months and Even Serials in the other months. I just quit trying to remember the qualification cycle and qualify every month with my handgun and quarterly with my rifle.

    As for 1911 shooters, you have to first shoot Expert on the Bonus range to go to the 1911 transition school. Then you have to go to the 3 day school, and finally, 1911 shooters must qualify every month. But yes, Patrol Officers can carry 1911s.
     
  11. Goldendog Redux

    Goldendog Redux Shut your mouth

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    We qualify a gazillion times a year it seems...pistol, backup, off duty, shotgun, rifle, subgun, M14. Since I do a specialized thing, ours if different than the standard course. I gotta say, I hate qualifying. I do just fine, I just don't like it. I hate the bi-annual PT test too-even though I am pretty awesome at that.

    I like shooting and PT. I guess I pretty much don't like being told what to do:whistling:
     
  12. GRIMLET

    GRIMLET Deceased

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    Say wha....??????
    Do they, at least, take the rifles from them?
    If not, what a liability nightmare possibility.
     
  13. PEC-Memphis

    PEC-Memphis Scottish Member

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    Doh ?
    Good thing they didn't have spelling grammar tests back then. :tongueout:

    Before the Tn Department of Safety administered the HCP program in Tennessee, the county Sheriff's Department had their own permit program. We shot the same CoF as the Sheriffs, and later other LE agencies within the county. None of the CoFs were nearly as difficult as the LAPD CoF described in the article - although passing for permit holders was 70% (annual) and LE was 80% (every 6 mos).

    My average during these years was 99.3% with a S&W model 60. That was WAY before I even knew there were competitive action pistol sports.

    Here is the FAM qualification CoF - do you believe it to be easier or more difficult than LAPD?
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2012
  14. RF7126

    RF7126

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    Good to know, thanks! That does sound challenging to get, but it's a good incentive for us 1911 fans. Now if only my department would allow for 1911s! I tried talking to the chief, but he's pretty set with a universal sidearm.
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2012
  15. PEC-Memphis

    PEC-Memphis Scottish Member

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    Doh ?
    Is there reason or logic behind this requirement?
     
  16. RF7126

    RF7126

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    I'm going to suspect lawyers behind this one.
     
  17. SAR

    SAR CLM

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    Yes, the way it was told to me, SWAT and SIS have to qualify every month, so the Department wasn't going to make it any easier for the regular Patrol guys. On top of that, I actually think once a month is good. Shooting after all is a perishable skill. I've carried lots of guns, but the 1911 will get me in more trouble if I don't practice often.
     
  18. They are still allowed to carry rifles. One person hasn't actually passed the rifle qual in 2 years. The admin won't listen though.
     

  19. It makes me wonder why even have qualifications if there is no repercussions for repeatedly failing!!! :shocked:
     
  20. Beats me. At least I know who to tell to stay out of the way when SHTF.