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Glock generations, "gills", 2- & 3-pin frames, and other helpful photos/info

246K views 222 replies 95 participants last post by  Glock-23/23 
#1 · (Edited)
This thread is intended to show photographic examples of frame generation comparisons, common-use Glock terminology, less-common variations, and other things that are helpful to folks who may have never heard of or seen certain Glock-related items.

Below is a comparison photo of the various 9mm full-size frame generations with labels:



Most recent G17-Generation-Identification-by-grip-features photo:

Text Font Material property Silver Metal



Tags: What generation is my Glock, Glock frames, Glock generations, Glock frame comparison, Glock frame generations, Glock frame styles, Glock frame types, Glock Gen1, Glock Gen2, Glock Gen3, Glock Gen3 RTF2, Glock Gen4, Glock Gen5, Glock Generation 1, Glock Generation 2, Glock Generation 3, Glock Generation 4, Glock Generation 5, Glock photo, Glock frames photo, Glock frame types photo.
 
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#77 ·
If anyone else has this info handy and would post it, that would be great, and here's my "Thank You" in advance!

If not, I'll squeeze that info out of the serial number research thread and put it together in an easy-to-read format sometime in the next week or so.

I agree that this would be handy info to have at hand; thanks for the idea!
 
#79 ·
Here is what I have...
Gen1 1982-1989(~March)
Gen2 (~March) 1989-1997 (~August)
Gen3 (~August) 1997-Present
Gen4 2010-Present
Awesome! I was looking for this information for several days, and could only peice together what decade each Gen started in.
May I ask where you got this information?

______________________________
i am the one who rings the doorbell
 
#82 · (Edited)
It is my understanding that Glock originally designed and manufactured the orange polymer magazines as training mags for law enforcement agencies for several reasons, including:

- to prevent hard-used range training mags from getting mixed-up with duty mags, and

- to make it easier for range safety/training officers to see if a trainee had a magazine inserted in their handgun (even from the far end of the range). A black-polymer mag in the black polymer frame was difficult to see, but a bright orange mag was highly visible, no matter if the pistol was in hand or in holster.

Below are a few photos of some orange training magazines for the Glock model 19 9mm that I owned a few years ago (mags are now sold and gone; these are the pictures I posted when I offered them for sale). These are very early versions of the Glock 19 9mm magazine, as shown by the U-notch metal liner, the lack of caliber markings on the body or follower (indicates Glock was only making pistols in one caliber [9mm] at the time these mags were manufactured), and the non-locking floorplates.

Orange Font


Orange Leather


Orange


Orange


Orange Wood



The orange training magazines were rather rare outside of law enforcement circles until the late 90s or early 2000s, when the Assault Weapon Ban and its related magazine restrictions made full-capacity magazines both expensive and hard to find for non-police personnel. At some point, Glock realized that most of the orange training mags that it had built and warehoused, or had received during agency trade-in upgrades to newer Glock handguns, were legal to be sold, as they had been manufactured before the ban took effect. Eventually, these mags began to pop up at GSSF matches, available for purchase at very reasonable (for the time) prices. I bought the mags pictured above at a GSSF match in the early 2000s.

I have personally owned mags like these for the Glock models 19 and 17 9mms, and I have seen/handled similar mags for the .40 caliber Glock models 22 and 23. Additionally, I have seen photos of, or heard from people I trust, that there were also similar early U-notch/pre-ban orange training mags made for the Glock 21 full-size .45, and the Glock 20 full-size 10mm. Finally, I have seen online photos of other orange Glock mags that appeared to be post-ban (squared-off metal liner notch), in several calibers, along with the old-style +2 extended-capacity floorplates made from the same orange polymer, for 9mm/.40 Glocks.

These orange mags were eventually discontinued by Glock in favor of normal black-polymer mags with orange floorplates, which offered basically the same advantages at the all-orange mags. The Glock factory has made colored polymer magazine floorplates in orange, red, and blue, and the orange and blue can still be found and purchased fairly easily through various sources at this time.

(Various unofficial sources and personal experiences were used to compile the information presented in this post)
 
#83 · (Edited)
Great thread with lots of useful facts, thanks OP!

So here's my small contribution to this thread:
In reading Post 58, it is noted that the the 3rd pin molding mark can be seen on DT* series frames. I took a look at my DH series frame and believe that there's a 3rd pin molding mark on this frame. The DH was manufactured in 1999.



 
#85 · (Edited)
Interesting thread.

I am guessing the big boys, models 20 and 21, were always three pin models? I have a gen 2 mod 20 (no rail and no groves) that has three pins. This gun is around twenty years old.

Sent from my VS950 4G using Ohub Campfire mobile app
 
#87 ·
Interesting thread.

I am guessing the big boys, models 20 and 21, were always three pin models? I have a gen 2 mod 20 (no rail and no groves) that has three pins. This gun is around twenty years old.

Sent from my VS950 4G using Ohub Campfire mobile app
It certainly makes sense, but I'm not sure on that one; most of my experience is with the small-frame Glocks.

Maybe one of the large-frame Glock aficionados could post what they know about this subject? If so, thanks in advance!
 
#164 ·
It certainly makes sense, but I'm not sure on that one; most of my experience is with the small-frame Glocks.

Maybe one of the large-frame Glock aficionados could post what they know about this subject? If so, thanks in advance!
I have a gen 2 glock 21 with three pins and a gen 3 glock 34 with two pins. So it seems the large frame glocks may have had the three pins all along?
 

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#88 · (Edited)
So I'm window shopping in a local gun shop and see a compact Glock with a lower-than-normal price. It looks to be in very good shape, 98%-99%, but it's $100 cheaper than several other similar Glocks in the same display case. I peer at the tag, and the serial number looks strange; it appears to be a number, then 3 letters, then 3 numbers. So I ask to see/handle the pistol, and it all begins to get clearer.

Firearm Gun Trigger Gun accessory Gun barrel



A normal older Gen3 (flat non-LCI-extractor), in excellent condition. Frame looks positively minty, only minor exterior wear on the metal. Serial number on slide and barrel:

Material property Photography Black-and-white Monochrome



And serial number on the frame (normal location, under barrel and in front of trigger guard):

Technology Photography Electronic device



You might be thinking, hmmm, what's going on here; the serial numbers don't match (referring here to the added "1" at the front of the number, not the "US" which was a standard suffix on the frame serial number for many years, but has since been discontinued)?

Explanation: In 2001, Glock made a bunch of pistols that had a small problem with the metal frame rails that are embedded in the polymer frame. Some of the rails had been formed or hardened incorrectly, and after use, one of the rails would occasionally break off, often causing a stoppage and preventing further firing.

These pistols were all concentrated in the "E" series of serial numbers, such as the one pictured above. All serial numbers that began with "E" were not affected (only some of them had been built with the bad rails), but all the pistols with bad rails were in the "E" series of pistols.

Glock offered to fix (for free) any affected pistol that had a rail break, and also offered to replace the frame on any affected pistol (you had to call Glock Inc. and have them check your serial number to see if it was affected), again, for no cost. They also seriously annoyed many owners/users by terming this program an "upgrade", not a "recall", as in "We'll upgrade your pistol to one that works and shouldn't break." The response from users/owners was along the lines of "If it looks like a duck, sounds like a duck, and we see it in a duck pond..." Most folks treated it as a recall, it's just that the manufacturer never called, owners had to find out about it on their own (and most did).

Anyway, when the pistols were sent back to Glock, they would manufacture a new frame for it. However, there are strict Federal laws/rules about serial numbers only being used once on each model of any particular firearm, and so they couldn't make a new frame with the old number. If they did, even if they intended to destroy the old frame after replacement, for a short time there would be two frames for that particular pistol, both with the same serial number, and that (apparently) is a serious no-no. So Glock did the next best thing; they made a frame that included all of the original serial number, but with a number "1" added to the beginning.

In the case of the above pistol, the serial number does indeed fall into the range of guns that were caught up in the frame rail upgrade/recall. Now, that is not the only reason that a Glock can have a frame replaced at the factory. Another popular reason is because someone has blown-up the pistol, often with hand-loaded, reloaded, or even factory ammunition that was somehow defective. Sometimes the case will blow-out in a downward direction, and the high-pressure gas will damage the frame, with cracking and missing chunks of plastic being common problems under these circumstances. If the barrel and slide are inspected by the factory and cleared for re-use, the frame would be replaced (usually paid for by either the user or an ammo company) and the pistol would be returned to the owner.

Because there is no quick and easy way to know for sure WHY the frame was replaced, most folks tend to lean toward the worse-case scenario, and shy away from guns with mismatched serial numbers. For this reason, some dealers will end up pricing these guns lower, to get them to sell. I believe that is why the Glock pictured above had a significantly lower price than other similar pistols in the case, and that made it possible for me to pick it up quite reasonably in a trade. It shoots well, exactly to point-of-aim, and I am looking forward to using it regularly.

The approximate serial number range for the frame rail upgrade/recall is EGX*** through ESK***, although you must call Glock Inc. to find out for sure if your pistol is affected by the upgrade (remember, not all pistols in this range will be affected, and there may be ones outside this range, too). As far as I know, this upgrade applied to all frames sizes and calibers.

Here is a photo showing the frame rails involved in the upgrade that break (most often the rear rails are the ones with problems; don't think I've ever seen/heard of a front rail break):

Photography Black-and-white



(Note: some of the information in this post was gleaned through discussions with factory personnel, some through discussions with other people like Glock/police armorers, some info was heard second- or third-hand from people that I trust, but most of it is not verifiable in any way, and that is why no sources are listed)

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#91 ·
Does anyone know if the gun would fit/ function with a gen 2 22 frame and a gen 3 17 upper/ ejector? Called glock and all they would say is that the parts don't match and that they don't recommend it. I think that the guy wasn't very knowledgable and was probably just referring to the ejector.
 
#92 ·
Does anyone know if the gun would fit/ function with a gen 2 22 frame and a gen 3 17 upper/ ejector? Called glock and all they would say is that the parts don't match and that they don't recommend it. I think that the guy wasn't very knowledgable and was probably just referring to the ejector.
You can attached a Gen 3 G17 slide to Gen 2 lower, as long as the lower has the Gen 2 locking block.

There are plenty of folks that use conversion barrels to shoot 9mm in .40 guns, so the ejector isn't a deal killer.
 
#93 · (Edited)
Here's a photo illustration showing the evolution of the Glock 17 with several examples from the late 1980s to today.

Font Metalworking hand tool Metal Tool



For more information on the items listed below, see the earlier posts in this thread, referenced by post number, next to each item.


Close-up photo of frame gripping surface and other frame differences between generations -- post #1

2 vs. 3 pin frames (the G17 Gen2 and the G17C Gen3) -- post #2

G17 Gen3 RTF2 -- post #3
Close-up of differences between Gen3 RTF2 and Gen4 grip textures -- post #21

Gen1 17L -- post #7
Lightening cuts on Gen1 G17L slide -- post #29
Gen1 G17L porting -- post #30

Gen2 G17 -- post #18

"+2" mag (seen in the Gen1 G17L) -- post #22

Gen3 G17C porting -- post #32


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#94 · (Edited)
Another round of thanks for everyone who has participated in this thread, or added kind words about its content. When I started it, I really didn't think it would draw this kind of traffic, but I even get nice notes about it when I'm on other forums, and an occasional email, too. Over fifty-two-thousand views in 20 months just boggles my mind. I hope folks continue to find it helpful and/or interesting.

Happy New Year, and Good Glocking to all!


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#95 ·
DJ Niner, thanks for creating this. I really enjoyed your posts and pictures.

I have a Gen 2 19 from December of 88'. DW prefix. Same year I was born.

I also bought my brother a Gen 2 22. It think it is a CCS or CCN prefix and dates back to 96.

The older Glocks really fascinate me and I find myself looking for them when I go into my local gun stores. That's how I was able to find the 22.

thanks again!
 
#98 · (Edited by Moderator)
Dear DJ Niner!

This is very awesome thread about GLOCKs! But can your make it more awesome by add more information (mainly pictures) of SMYRNA proof marks and Ges.m.b.H on slides, barrels and frames for Gen3 and Gen4 Glocks?

Like this:



There is also USA made GLOCKs with "GLOCK" logo and "P" logo.

+ GLOCKs assembled in Russia.



P.S. Haha... I am very rare poster. 3 post since DEC 2007.
 
#99 · (Edited)
I've never seen that LAST one before, that's for sure!

Have any more info on the Russian assembly location? I'm sure folks would find it interesting.

I don't have too many different proof mark photos that aren't already posted in this thread, but I'll watch for any more I can find.


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#101 · (Edited)
I believe that there was a change in the geometry of the rails that are insert molded into the Glock Nylon 6 plastic frames between the Generation 2 and 2.5 Glock pistols. If I have a chance I may post an X-ray image of a Glock Gen 2 and Gen 3 full size frame, which will show the differences between the rail geometries. The early Gen 1 and 2 rails were designed only to handle the 9mm Luger round. I believe they changed the rail geometry to handle the newer .357 Sig and .40 S&W.
 
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