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Glock 29 kaboom

29K views 142 replies 37 participants last post by  Taterhead 
#1 · (Edited)
Kaboom happened today...kaboom part at the end of this important part of the story


hot ammo question
First, apologies as this relates to a 40 cal xdm. Why I am asking here is that it relates to some ammo Mike Willard made up for me before he passed, a scalding hot 165 gd at 1325 fps. What happened to me yesterday I have never seen or heard of before, so since this forum deals with issues of high speed and high pressure and all the surrounding issues, I come here. I have a g29 and am used to firing hot loads...but anyway...

Here's what happened. I was just going to shoot my xdm because I was bored, and it had been a while since I shot it, so I carried it outside with a few of Mike's rounds in it. Full mag.

I fired the first round, and enjoyed the feel. I looked down on the ground, and an unfired shell was on the ground. I shot a few more rounds, and went inside. The uncertainty of what just happened made me pause and think. So I loaded up the gun just like it was before, went back outside, and the exact same thing happened. I think the shell jumped out of the gun somehow....I don't know

Now I'm really perplexed. I fill the mag up with some 180 grain federal hst.....go back out, and viola....no problem, no issue.

So....I'm completely lost and perplexed. I think the issue was with the ammo...I do have a stronger recoil spring.

The xdm appears fine, fires normal ammo ok. Next weekend I'm going to shoot it more to try to figure out what is going on.

Any ideas?


part two
figured it out
Shot a little today...shot some regular 40 cal hst....no problem, smooth as silk.

Put a few rounds of hot Swamp Fox in....same as before except this time instead of the live round flying out of the gun intact....a stove pipe occurred, with a live round.

I was almost happy to see this, but I had to test some more.

Put regular ammo back in, smooth as silk. Swamp Fox...stove pipe with a live round.

If Mike were still alive we'd be in touch. But....I'll just use my regular ammo in the 40 and be happy. The Swamp Fox 40 ammo is hereby quarantined. I have no desire to mess with it anymore. As of this moment, it ain't broke.

kaboom part
My right hand is wounded and I am shaking as I type. My wife and I got the crap scared out of us. I say my right hand is wounded....fingers intact, but I am bruised up pretty bad. Most of us think about high speed loads etc....every now and then a dose of reality sets in...let this be the dose for all of us, not just for me.

I have a lone wolf conversion 10mm to 40 cal barrel, and I knew the Swamp Fox 40 cal ammo was no threat to the almighty Glock 10 mm, so I go out to shoot some of it up, to use it up and just shoot some. I shoot two rounds, hit my target, and decide to do a double tap. I am not sure where in the next part the crap hits the fan, but I pull the trigger and the gun explodes in my hand. I run inside and make sure all my parts are still there, I have my wife check just to be sure as my heart is pounding 7000 beats a minute. I go back outside and find that the magazine has blown out of the gun, and a small plastic piece on the right side of the gun has blown out as well, adjacent to the mag(somebody tell me what this is cause I need a new one, no patience at the moment, more important to give out the warning), there is a spent shell in the barrel, and a live round pops out of the gun. I have to move the slide back and forth to get the empty out of the chamber.

The magazine with the live rounds is in the trash, there was some melting. The Swamp Fox 40 cal ammo is in the trash, a promise I made my wife. My wonderful Glock 29 has a hole in the right side and is out of commission.

I am at a loss for words. My hurt hand is nothing....I can't believe what just happened, and I can't believe that as bad as this could have been, that I able to type out this warning. I saw the Ravens fan thing about a bad attitude being the only true disability. Dang it, I am ok....I AM OK!!!!And I am so grateful, and make no apologies for my gratitude.

But I have to look out for you, because I don't have all the answers to what just happened. I only hope and pray that someone wiser than I can sort this out, so that we don't have to live this again.

Apologies for no pics...best descriptions at the moment...explosion blew the mag out of the bottom, Swamp Fox 40 cal ammo, melting of the mag at the top, small plastic piece blown out on the right side, otherwise gun appears intact.

G29 has 21 lb recoil spring

I am, at the moment, consuming a strong beer.

cause there for a moment, I thought I was really....


deadandgone



ed
 
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#105 ·
Spoke with Tech rep at Glock this morning. He was looking at the gun as we spoke. He said the blowout showed all the signs of an over pressure round failing. He examined the gun and said that the only permanent damage was the frame was cracked. He will replace the frame for 100 dollars and ship it back to me. He did say they would test fire it to make sure no other problems arise.


So....there it is. I should have my gun back in the next two weeks.

In my mind....this case is closed. Then again, my mind is kind of feeble....

Thanks everyone in their pursuit of answers and the truth.
 
#106 ·
not to change the subject but since swamp fox is fading and underwood is growing in popularity, I must ask if any would has pulled Underwood ammo and tested it for quality. After finding out SF record, I want to know Underwoods record on quality with the constancy on powder amount.
There have been quite a few tests and examinations of Underwood's ammo .... He uses tried and true charges of 800X in his loads. I have the data somewhere, or you can search in the 10-Ring

:wavey:
 
#107 ·
Hey boys... As you know, I always pull this out when I see a Kaboom post.


My late G20 with "Factory Winchester Silvertips."(WW did replace the gun, and this is a real looong story, if interested do a search please.)











The NEW one....













OP, sorry about your gun amigo ! Glad your ok, and I know how the hand feels. I got it in the face as well.. It happens from time to time.


Hope you get everything worked out.











CanyonMan
 
#109 ·
not to change the subject but since swamp fox is fading and underwood is growing in popularity, I must ask if any would has pulled Underwood ammo and tested it for quality. After finding out SF record, I want to know Underwoods record on quality with the constancy on powder amount.
I have only pulled a few of the Underwood loads, and they were consistent with what others have found...Data is posted here; http://10mm-firearms.com/factory-10mm-ammo/underwood's-lineup-135155165180220/

Those pictures Canyon Man posted really peaked my What The Heck meter! :wow: It stirred my curiosity enough to make contact with him and discuss the incident shortly after it happened. I think him and I came to the same conclusion...

My idea is to work to keep this from happening, thru understanding and education. :wavey:
 
#111 ·
CanyonMan, those photos give me the shivers every time you post them.

That is a pretty nice example of what can go wrong!


:wavey:
 
#112 · (Edited)
Damn...Silvertips did that to Canyonman's gun?

WTH happened? Were these the older, hotter Silvertips or the newer watered down stuff?

To be polite to the OP here, I'll make this the super short version...



This was about 4-5 years ago maybe.. I loose track . But I was shooting factory silvertips, in preperation for a trip we were taking. Just trying them out, "because" I hardly ever use factory ammo. I use my own reloads. Had just got through with a "hand load session." And yes the barrel was clear and all was well....

So, short plain and simple. I loaded up, fired, and about the 2nd or 3rd one went BAM!


Now, I had a used G20 barrel in the gun I had bought as a "spare" (why I don't know :dunno: ) from a Glock armorer at a gun show in Dallas we drove in to.

That being said. WW forensics, could never say with any shadow of a doubt it was or was not their ammo, "because" there was NOT enough evidence to go on. "Everything was gone." Brass everything.. Only 'powder residue' and that was 'tainted' by the previous handloads I had shot etc.

I sent in photo's of the pile of ST's on my table outside, and of my rainbow colored hand, and the eye doctor bill (yes I had on glasses (reading glasses ha) and they paid for the Doc, and replaced the gun with a NIB from Glock hot off the press G20SF.

WW are VERY good people to do business with !


I got to add. Glock would not even talk to me at all about it. They said... "Gary, we know you are a hand loader..." UH, excuse me Glock, I was not shooting han loads when this happened. Even had a couple signed and sworn statements from a couple amigo's that were there with me shooting to testify to the fact they were factory loads...

Glocks reply on the phone over and over.. "Sorry Gary we know you are a hand loader, you told us that on a phone call one time and we documented that statment..." :whistling:

So, Cheers to WW... Good folks !

In closing here on the "shortest version" I can give ya. We really do not completely know either, whether it was a double charge from WW, or whether the barrel "very used' I bought from the guy as a spare had been 'severly abused' with stupid loads from the previous owner (it was a very old barrel with a ton of wear) as in "on the brink of destruction", and he finally went, when I fired that shot, (for time and space sake let the reder understand here).

We do not know. WW does not know. But were kind enough to replace the Gun anyway free of charge.


There ya go for shorts!


I did want to ring the neck of that guy who sold me the barrel ! haha... Plus kick my own butt for buying it in the first place. So we don't know bottom line. GT'ers flooded me with opinions when first posted years ago. A good deal of wrong ones, and a few that made good sense, and thanks to them all.... But problem is, in the senerio I just gave above. There is NO WAY to know for CERTAIN, whether that was a severly abused barrel from a nut case hand loader and on the fringe of going south, and I was the lucky guy to get it there, or whether it was the WW ammo... I will never know.

Personally. I do have a very deep gut feeling it was the Used Barrel... MY opinion, Just a gut feeling. Again, we will never know. May have been a bit of both.



I feel for the OP, because yes, it hurt like the dickens ! :wow:


I have grown up on a ranch being kicked, mashed, hit, stomped, crushed, and bit, and in my share of fist to cuffs, uh hum... But man this Kaboom (at least mine) blinded me for a short spell (as in could not see) threw shards of junk into my face, and my hand looked like a pumpkin painted different colors.. A whole new kinda pain.. haha. Shook it off and went on, (had to keep up that lousy cowboy pride in front of the fellas.. :embarassed: ) but it was a doozy ! :supergrin:


So there ya go on this one... I just can't resist bringing these out when I see a Kaboom thread. Perhaps I should restrain myself in the future, BUT as my COP neice said when she saw them and me, 'Man it makes ya more aware "at least in practice times," to wear eye protection haha, (then she added) and not to shoot a Glock !" She carries a 45acp Smith (she was joking about the Glock of course). She is SVU, and a gun shooting ranch girl. So I bring out the pics, not to scare folks, but to freak them out a bit... haha.


We have NO control over what "Factory ammo" will or "can do." We sure can take ALL precautions on our hand loads though... I like to wildcat, yes. But get crazy, careless and stupid ? No !


Just don't buy used barrels, and be careful out there, and don't act like hot shot harry with the hand loads on your equipment, whatever you shoot. Finally, know that yes, even factory loads, can Kaboom ya.


Thats all folks !




Stay safe
Be blessed







CanyonMan
 
#113 ·
CanyonMan, those photos give me the shivers every time you post them.

That is a pretty nice example of what can go wrong!


:wavey:



:rofl:


Yes sir, me too !


I guess it should give the "shivers."

I hope they (the pics) always help folks to be careful, and understand things can go wrong with any gun. Not just Glocks or Smiths or Rugers, but any gun, given just the right circumstance!

Also, "Although this was NOT caused from my my hand loads"... I always hope it will also help hand loaders stay on their toes, and not get crazy !


Thanks Tater. Hope all is well with you and family amigo !



Stay safe




Adios guys ! :wavey:





CanyonMan
 
#114 ·
CanyonMan (or anyone else), do you have any opinion on whether a different, aftermarket, barrel (like KKM) would/could have prevented that?

I have two two (both lengths) for my G20SF, because I shoot stuff like the fairly-hot BB loads. I am thinking of getting one for my G27 because I shoot fairly hot loads through my various .40s. Nothing crazy, just stuff like the CorBon 150gr loadings and the like, which are on the upper end of what the mainstream ammo mfrs produce.

Or should I just stick with the stock barrel?
 
#115 ·
Canyon Man's used factory barrel may have been abused, but it is thought of as the Winchester ammo was overloaded. Although it may have been a sever setback of the bullet, that caused the pressures to spike.

Your stock barrel should be fine with reasonable loads. The aftermarket barrels are 416R stainless steel and said to be 160Lk to 180K pressure rated. However that doesn't mean that they will not come apart.

Good handloading practices will go a long way to not stress you equipment.
 
#116 ·
CanyonMan (or anyone else), do you have any opinion on whether a different, aftermarket, barrel (like KKM) would/could have prevented that?

I have two two (both lengths) for my G20SF, because I shoot stuff like the fairly-hot BB loads. I am thinking of getting one for my G27 because I shoot fairly hot loads through my various .40s. Nothing crazy, just stuff like the CorBon 150gr loadings and the like, which are on the upper end of what the mainstream ammo mfrs produce.

Or should I just stick with the stock barrel?


THE SHADOW wrote:

Canyon Man's used factory barrel may have been abused, but it is thought of as the Winchester ammo was overloaded. Although it may have been a sever setback of the bullet, that caused the pressures to spike.

Your stock barrel should be fine with reasonable loads. The aftermarket barrels are 416R stainless steel and said to be 160Lk to 180K pressure rated. However that doesn't mean that they will not come apart.

Good handloading practices will go a long way to not stress you equipment.



MarineHawk,


This is about it amigo...!

I do think it was a little of both. A very abused barrel on the brink of blowing, and had been severly weakened. This is based off gut feeling and a whole lot of looooong story other stuff I do not want to get into please.. Plus, as Shadow said, the WW ammo was more than likely double charged or had a severe set back, that last one I reall do not think so as i am pretty geared at looking at the rounds as I load. I developed that habit (for practice shootin) years ago, and also when i load a carry mag as well. So I do not think set back. But a very over abused barrel on the brink of "blowing" and or the ammo itself, bottom line.

Someone who is crazy, and abuse's a barrel with consistant nitro loads, and is warned, "Hey don't do that, etc.." He is warned "because we know he can blow that barrel and his hands and head with it...

Ok, I may have gotten 'such a barrel', and it just needed a few more rounds of any kind and BAM ! It may have been the ammo or both. We could around this for 100 years.

Point is, don't buy used junk, and be aware of everything you do at a loading bench, and know even factory stuff can go KABOOM !


Do you need and after market barrel ? Not in my opinion. I got several for G20's and G29's and have learned to hate all of them for various reasons "over my stock equipment".

"Only" reason I bought them was to "save on brass." I have shot tens of thousands of rounds of "hard cast lead" through "stock Glock barrels" and NEVER one issue of any nature at all...

I see no real accuracy over the OEM barrel to right home about with the AM barrels (for me) as of yet. I can kill deer cleanly at 100yds with the G20 and a 200gr HC bullet of my own loading, and out here on the ranch in loooong range shooting/play time, we have seen stuff I won't repeat here at long range with this G20 and other semis as well, so i won't be called a liar by someone who has the itch to do so. :whistling:

I have way to many friends here that know me, but there is always that one guy somewhere that wants to rumble, haha, so I will just say, the Glocks we own and shoot are accurate as all heck STOCK.

I shoot my hand loads all the time out of stock at 1300fps, and have never had ONE single issue with anything. Just hog belly brass. haha. So I bought some AM barrels to save on brass life with some of my loads, and that is about it pard...

Stay safe, becareful, and don't worry about your stock barrel with factory loads of "very good quality and reputation," and do not get plumb crazy if you hand load ! ;)


Stay safe
Be blessed



Thanks Shadow !





Adios amigo's !









CanyonMan
 
#118 ·
Thanks for the update, Canyonman.

It's always a pleasure.


You are most welcome amigo ! ;)




Thank you Shadow !

Thank you OP for giving us a 'wide loop here' ! ;)


Bless y'all !




Gotta close for me on this one fellas. I have over stayed my GT limit for a short spell... :wavey:



All you old boys take care and please stay safe !
PM's welcome. I check them fairly regular.














CanyonMan
 
#119 ·
CanyonMan (or anyone else), do you have any opinion on whether a different, aftermarket, barrel (like KKM) would/could have prevented that?

I have two two (both lengths) for my G20SF, because I shoot stuff like the fairly-hot BB loads. I am thinking of getting one for my G27 because I shoot fairly hot loads through my various .40s. Nothing crazy, just stuff like the CorBon 150gr loadings and the like, which are on the upper end of what the mainstream ammo mfrs produce.

Or should I just stick with the stock barrel?
I'll chip in as the anyone else. The stock and aftermarket barrels have very similar dimensions. I ran the numbers on bursting strength with 416 stainless at various tempers a while back, and found that 37,5 KPSI is a very good limit for the barrels. If you count the fact that all manufacturing has tolerances, so strength isn't always optimal, then exceeding SAAMI specs can be getting into a very thin margin, even w/ aftermarket barrels.

The materials and heat treat in the aftermarket barrels isn't particularly special, and while amply sufficient for factory loads, just don't have the mass needed for a sufficient safety margin with over-spec loads. The outside of the barrel is a fixed dimension, the only way to get a significantly thicker wall would be to go to a smaller caliber.
 
#120 ·
MarineHawk,

Someone who is crazy, and abuse's a barrel with consistant nitro loads, and is warned, "Hey don't do that, etc.." He is warned "because we know he can blow that barrel and his hands and head with it...
...
Point is, don't buy used junk, and be aware of everything you do at a loading bench, and know even factory stuff can go KABOOM !

...

"Only" reason I bought them was to "save on brass." I have shot tens of thousands of rounds of "hard cast lead" through "stock Glock barrels" and NEVER one issue of any nature at all...

I see no real accuracy over the OEM barrel to right home about with the AM barrels (for me) as of yet. I can kill deer cleanly at 100yds with the G20 and a 200gr HC bullet of my own loading, and out here on the ranch in loooong range shooting/play time, we have seen stuff I won't repeat here at long range with this G20 and other semis as well, so i won't be called a liar by someone who has the itch to do so. :whistling:

I have way to many friends here that know me, but there is always that one guy somewhere that wants to rumble, haha, so I will just say, the Glocks we own and shoot are accurate as all heck STOCK.

I shoot my hand loads all the time out of stock at 1300fps, and have never had ONE single issue with anything. Just hog belly brass. haha. So I bought some AM barrels to save on brass life with some of my loads, and that is about it pard...

Stay safe, becareful, and don't worry about your stock barrel with factory loads of "very good quality and reputation," and do not get plumb crazy if you hand load ! ;)
...
CanyonMan
I took out my favorite parts ...

Basically, CM is right on point (as usual). Stock barrels fine AND accurate, but might work your brass a bit more. Not so much a safety issue at all; rather, more of a "brass" issue. LOL! As long as you reload safely (yes, even hot stuff... but SANE hot stuff), you should be fine with stock. In fact, I figure AM barrels can actually INCREASE pressure on loads because of the tighter tolerances... but I digress...

The only REAL work a Glock needs (to ME) is a Ghost connector and MAYBE some different sights (although stock will work here, too, if you are well versed in how iron's work.

Nick
 
#121 ·
Okay, thanks guys for clarifying.

I bought the KKM barrels primarily because I wanted to run lead rounds through them, and I've ssen too many people report problems with firing unjacketed rouds through the polygonal stock barrels to even think about taking a chance.

I never had a single jam with my stock 4.6" Glock barrel in it brief use in my gun.

I've never had a single jam wit my 4.6" or 6.0" KKM barrels.

So, one can tell me that the KKM's are a wast eof money, which subjectively could be true--amatter of opinion. But, both of my KKMs (combined with 22l tunsten spring rod) have never jammed..

They, at least in my hands, produce tighter groups--at least with the ammo I shoot. Not a scientific study to be sure.

Alos, the main point of my question above is that don't the KKMs wrap the base of the cartridge a lot better than the stock barrels. I haven't taken pics, but it seems so for me when I compared, and I've seen similar pics from others. That's what I was thinkin gof, rather than a thicker barrel or chamber or superior metal.

If either of my two KKMs had ever jammed once, I would worry that they are too tight. But since not, isn't it better to have more support around the base of the cartridge when you're getting up to high-10mm pressures? Or is that not material? I honestly can't say about the materiality of the lesser support. But two KKMs in my gun have never had a single FTF or FTE. So, I'm not worried about the tollerances being too high. Just wondering whether the additional clamping around the base of the cartridge might help prevent the base of the cartridge from rupturing and making the parts below that go "boom."
 
#122 ·
It is great that you are ok. In years of shooting reloaded lead for my revolvers I found that the only problems with the guns were with reloads. When I hear of the FN 5.7, the Glocks kabooming it is almost always with reloads and probably non supported parts of the firearm. I will not shoot reloads in my semi autos. When I was twenty I was immortal but when over forty I want to be around and in one piece for a while. I am really happy that the only damage was to the firearm and your pride. Stay safe.:supergrin:
 
#123 ·
Well I went out and shot about 5 rounds today. I was somewhat apprehensive as I was afraid I would jump and flinch like crazy. I thought I might dry fire awhile...then I thought first I'll see if I have a problem, then I'll dry fire.

Don't have my G29 sf back yet, so I shot a few out of my xdm 40. Amazingly to me, all 5 rounds were in a circle of about 3 inches at 7 yards. So you know what? I walked away....knowing that there is more to do, but happy and smiling that the muscle memory is still there....I haven't lost it.

As soon as I get my g29sf back from Glock, I'm going to send it off to Ken Hunnicutt of Gripreductions.com. He did some work for me a while back on the glock that blew up, and I liked it. I want my gun back, but I want it to be mine as I knew it from before....when I shoot it again.

On the way back...it feels pretty good.

And a thank you shout out to Shadow...thanks man.


deadandgone
 
#125 ·
I get my Glock 29 sf back.....for something that hurt me pretty bad to be such a welcome sight....I guess it speaks to the human condition somehow someway.

I took the gun out of the box, and lo and behold....Glock took my aftermarket parts, put them in a plastic bag, and sent them back. The extra power recoil springs, the Ghost trigger setup...all there as well as the 10mm 40 cal conversion barrel. And the recoil spring setup they sent back seems new...

Unable to shoot due to terrible weather here in northern NC today...freezing rain, sleet, snow....yuck!!!


I am , at this point, willing to let this thread settle down some. I just want to say thank you to Glock for their repairs and their exemplary customer service.

And thanks to Shadow....for so many reasons.

Swamp Fox ammo is still dangerous....who knows how much is still out there?

I am alive, healing nicely...and I got my Glock back!!!!


Hooray!!!
 
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