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Fully Supported Chamber???

Discussion in 'The 10 Ring' started by ColGlocker, Sep 28, 2011.

  1. ColGlocker

    ColGlocker

    79
    0
    Sep 25, 2011
    Hello:

    What does it mean to have a fully supported chamber? I was reading a thread in the General Glock forum. In it, it was implied the G29 did not have a supported chamber. Also, I was looking at the Swamp Fox web site. The ammo I was considering is described as "Fully supported chamber version". Is it an issue I need to keep in mind when purchasing ammo for a G29?

    Thanks in advance.
     
  2. OregonG20

    OregonG20

    645
    180
    Sep 5, 2011
    Oregon
    [​IMG]
    That is basically it. The area of the case exposed because of the feed ramp. Glocks have more loose tolerances, because they want a gun that will feed reliably. With tighter tolerances, you get more chamber support and you aren't as hard on brass, but you may not have 100% reliability, especially if you handload.

    I have heard it is a misnomer. Any semi auto pistol that has a feed ramp into the barrel won't have a fully supported chamber. They may have more chamber support, but the only handguns with fully supported chambers are revolvers, or so I have read.

    I guess you can keep it in mind, and I shoot a G20, but I have never had over pressure signs or "glock smiles" in any of my brass. I have reloaded almost all of it over 6 times, and it still is trucking, and my reloads are coming in over 600 fpe. Not nuclear by any means, but warm. YMMV.
     


  3. ColGlocker

    ColGlocker

    79
    0
    Sep 25, 2011
    Thanks for the information. So my next question (which might be better asked at the vendor site) is what does it mean when Swamp Fox ammo advertises "Fully Supported Chamber Version"? Does it mean the ammo can only be used in some 10mm weapons or that weapons might need to be modified in order for the ammo to work properly? Does it mean the ammo are reloads, but they were used in a fully supported chamber?

    Thanks again.
     
  4. OregonG20

    OregonG20

    645
    180
    Sep 5, 2011
    Oregon
  5. 21Carrier

    21Carrier Until I Gota 29

    3,037
    11
    Feb 4, 2011
    Hoover, AL
    I'm assuming it was my comment in GG that caused this. Here's the deal. You can fire pretty much anything out of a G29. Trust me, I've gotten pretty wild with mine. What I meant was that there has been some evidence that shows that the G29 may not be able to handle quite as much pressure as the G20. The G29 will still shoot insane loads just fine, I do it all the time. I said this in reference to Swamp Fox ammo because he's the one that figured this out. He realized that a single load (200gr bullet at max power) was a little too hot for the G29, so he made a G29 specific load. All I meant was that the guy needed to buy the G29 specific load.

    It is well known that ALL Glock barrels are not fully supported. This goes for all calibers. This thread could go on for years and be beat to death, but all you need to know is this: if you buy a G29, there is only one load in existence, that I know of, that you should NOT shoot through it. That's the 200gr Swamp Fox load. He says not to, and has a G29 specific load. Don't overthink this and decide you have to have an aftermarket barrel because you absolutely don't, especially if you'll be shooting mostly commercial ammo.
     
  6. ColGlocker

    ColGlocker

    79
    0
    Sep 25, 2011
    Thanks for the information.

    Not knowing any better, I was thinking of placing an order for the 200gr. fully supported chamber ammo. Then, as you noticed, I read the thread in GG. It triggered (no pun intended) me to post this current thread.

    The intent was not to buy a new barrel, but to make sure I was purchasing ammo compatible with my current (stock) set up.

    Thanks again for the help/heads up.


     
  7. Oklahoma

    Oklahoma

    9
    0
    Aug 3, 2011
    Not sure if this could be done but I will ask it anyway. Could you take a fine pointed sharpe and trace around each one of these a the top of the barrels and then remove the case and post a pic of the marked outline of what is not supported. It is kinda hard to tell by the pic if one barrel supports more then the other. Just thinking out loud here....:whistling: :whistling:


     
  8. OregonG20

    OregonG20

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    Sep 5, 2011
    Oregon
    I would love to, but it's not my picture. I only have one barrel, but it would be interesting to see.
     
  9. Oklahoma

    Oklahoma

    9
    0
    Aug 3, 2011
    I could do the lone wolf barrel but don't have a factory barrel. I will try to post up a pic this evening if I can remember to do it...Maybe some of the guys with the other barrels can help out.


     
  10. 21Carrier

    21Carrier Until I Gota 29

    3,037
    11
    Feb 4, 2011
    Hoover, AL
    I'll post a picture of the support offered by my G29's stock barrel. If you do this, either scratch the case with something, or use a fine point Sharpie. A regular Sharpie will make too fat of a line.

    To the OP, when you order from Swamp Fox, just make sure you order the G29 specific 200gr load, and tell him about your gun (what barrel used, spring used, or just stock).
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2011
  11. 21Carrier

    21Carrier Until I Gota 29

    3,037
    11
    Feb 4, 2011
    Hoover, AL
    Here are some pictures showing the support offered by my stock G29 barrel:

    This first picture shows a dummy round in the chamber:
    [​IMG]

    These next two show four shells, from left to right: actual Glocksmiled case fired from my gun (caused by over-pressure, load too hot), dummy round scratched with needle then marked with Sharpie, dummy round scratched with needle, another actual Glocksmile.
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Same rounds with a picture of a dummy round keychain I made. Just wanted to post it somewhere. 175gr Silvertip, dead primer, nickel brass, no powder.
    [​IMG]

    It's interesting that the actual Glocksmiles are pretty similar to the scribed lines on the other cases. I'm not so sure what else I was expecting, but still.
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2011
  12. OregonG20

    OregonG20

    645
    180
    Sep 5, 2011
    Oregon
    I scratched a line on this case. Stock G20 barrel.

    [​IMG]
     
  13. _The_Shadow

    _The_Shadow Ret. Fireman

    4,520
    21
    Jul 23, 2007
    Southeast, LoUiSiAna
    Being that the case spaces on the mouth's rim, one thing to also check is the actual length of the casing...too long less support!
     
  14. Oklahoma

    Oklahoma

    9
    0
    Aug 3, 2011
    This from my LW barrel. I don't have a stock barrel since I bought the G20 used and the LW was already installed. There really isn't much that isn't support and what isn't supported is very near the web. I can see why they say the LW will handle the Hot Loads better. .

    [​IMG]



    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]



    [​IMG]




    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2011
  15. Note: My understanding is that "Fully Supported" chamber means not just what is "sticking out" but also the "tightness" around the entire length of the casing.

    Some of you guys who reload, am I correct?
     
  16. blastfact

    blastfact

    1,676
    25
    Aug 15, 2011
    Oklahoma
    All the pics tell the tale.

    inspector: While a tighter chamber will give you a few thousands more wall thickness it only figures in slightly on the support front. With most striker fired semiauto's and others. The bottom of the chamber is not supported as well as the sides and top. Not to mention the feed ramp angle and cut.

    While comparing my new LW barrel to the trash OEM barrel. I liked the better support concerning the feed ramp. But I was also impressed with the fact that the cut out in the bottom lug was not as deep as the OEM thing they call a barrel. From what I can tell it is about .010 to .012 thicker along the bottom of the chamber. This may also account for LW's claim of tighter lock up. Thus the more shallow buttom lug cut leaves more metal around the chamber. Thus better supported. Also of note the total feed ramp thickness seems to be .003 to .005 thicker.
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2011
  17. g29guy

    g29guy

    177
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    Dec 29, 2010
    Georgia
    I've always referred to match grade for the tightness of both the inside and outside of the barrel and fully supported as the amount of brass not exposed.

    Most aftermarket barrels are both fully supported and match grade.

    Some guns come from the factory fully supported but aren't match grade for reliability.(not the case in striker fire guns)

    All guns are not made match grade because they don't chamber rounds as reliably in combat or extreme conditions or for self defense.

    From Wikipedia:

    Match grade frequently refers to firearm parts and ammunition that are suitable for a competitive match. Sometimes, it also refers to other devices and parts that made with high precision.
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2011
  18. BIGBOY61

    BIGBOY61

    183
    0
    Apr 23, 2011
    Chantilly, Va.
    It is not so much how "tight" the chamber is to the actual round when you are determining a "fully supported chamber."

    The case needs to expand inside the barrel to prevent the gas from blowing backwards. It needs to expand to make the seal. LW barrels has a more snugger clearance surrounding the case vs. a stock Glock barrel.

    Fully supported chamber means how far the barrel engulfs the case just up to the extractor grooves. The more the barrel chamber surrounds the case the less chance the case bulges when fired and a KB occurs. All things being equal-as long as you are not reloading "nuclear" rounds.

    Glock barrels, in order to feed all sorts brands of ammo, have more "room" in the chamber and does not "fully support" the entire case.

    LW barrel leaves some area exposed near the feed ramp, but not as much as the Glock stock chamber.
     
  19. awdxtc

    awdxtc

    476
    41
    Jul 8, 2011
    PA
    So is the lone wolf barrel the best choice for shooting nuclear loads?
     
  20. g29guy

    g29guy

    177
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    Dec 29, 2010
    Georgia
    It is one of the many aftermarket barrels that are exceptional. Bar-sto, KKM, Stormlake, Lone Wolf Distributors are all fine components. Each is better than the other in one way or another.

    I like KKM because I can get a longer barrel and You will have it in less than a week.
    Bar-sto are very accurate but their wait time is crazy and they are expensive

    I don't have experience with the other two, but I have ordered trigger components from Lone Wolf and their customer service has been great and JR is available in the GATE forum (he is owner) he'll answer questions specifically if you pm him.:cool: