close

Privacy guaranteed - Your email is not shared with anyone.

Fox Labs still among the best?

Discussion in 'Cop Talk' started by emt1581, Aug 24, 2011.


  1. emt1581

    emt1581
    Expand Collapse
    Curious Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2002
    19,885
    2
    Location:
    Penn's Woods
    I need to order more spray for my wife and I. Is Fox still among the best if not the best or is there another brand to look at?

    Also, we usually get a 3.XXoz can with a flip top (has a tensioned top you slip your thumb under).

    Who generally has the best price on them and is there anything new in the past few years brand or model-wise I might want to look at?

    Thanks!

    -Emt1581
     

    Wanna kill these ads? We can help!
  2. Landric

    Landric
    Expand Collapse
    Supervisor?

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2000
    406
    0
    Location:
    North Carolina and Virginia
    I have no idea anymore. I haven't sprayed anyone since Christmas Day 2008, and that was because my Taser was down for service. I remember using spray all the time prior to 2004 when I was first issued a Taser, but it was never Fox. I always meant to get some to try out, but it never happened.
     

  3. PuroMexicano

    PuroMexicano
    Expand Collapse
    VIVA MEXICO !!!

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2004
    3,606
    6
    Location:
    Monterrey, Mexico
    selfdefenseproducts.com used to have them, so I'm also interested to know where to buy them
     
  4. MeefZah

    MeefZah
    Expand Collapse
    Cover is Code 3

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2008
    3,945
    303
    Location:
    Lost Coast, Cali
    I use FOX, haven't yet found anything better. I think my last can came from either officerstore.com or copsplus.com, I got it at the same time as a new OC holder.
     
  5. DaBigBR

    DaBigBR
    Expand Collapse
    No Infidels!

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2005
    8,798
    8
    Location:
    Circling the wagons.
    My personal field experience is that it all works the same. One may be hotter than another on paper, but they're all hot. I have found that it doesn't work at all MOST of the time until the person is physically brought under control anyway. Once the adrenaline stops pumping so hard and those nerves start realizing how bad it burns, then they whine and cry and cough and spit.

    FWIW I had only ever had one OC deployment that I would consider "successful" (where OC had the near immediate effect of stopping resistance) prior to this year. This year, I'm two for two...and that was with plain 'ol red can Def Tec.
     
  6. NC Bullseye

    NC Bullseye
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2006
    948
    49
    Location:
    Foothills
  7. Grayson

    Grayson
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2006
    2,632
    14
    BR, good food for thought...

    I guess my respect for OC is somewhat tainted by my exposure to some Fox. I've not had the cajones to spray myself, but I was unknowingly exposed to a small amount via a contaminated object. No adrenaline at all invovled. In short order it was: Cough. Cough-cough. "Hmm, throat tickling." Cough cough cough *eyes run, nose runs, throat burns* "GAAAAH, what the bloody hell!!!?!?"

    I figured if I had that experience from what amounted to secondhand exposure, the effect of a full on blast of it would be...something else...
     
    #7 Grayson, Aug 24, 2011
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2011
  8. Agent6-3/8

    Agent6-3/8
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2006
    7,543
    105
    Location:
    The ramparts of civilization
    Fox is good stuff. Its what I used with my previous department. I was sprayed with it and it hurts like a mother. (even got it in my mouth and down my throat) I was able to find through it and perform various offensive and defensive task with relative "ease". The real pain started with decon when I had nothing else to think about but how bad it hurt.

    My personal experience with OC is like DaBigBR's. I saw one crazy MF'er wipe it out of his eyes, let out a manical laugh and ask, "what'd ya do that for?" My personal favorite was when a coworker sprayed a dog near an open window with a fan. The fan sucked it up and blew it into the house. Various other fans indoors spread it about. Cleared the place out pretty fast! :rofl:
     
  9. scottydl

    scottydl
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    May 31, 2005
    2,669
    48
    Location:
    The Middle
    Sabre Red. It hurts. Bad.
     
  10. Denikes

    Denikes
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    May 29, 2006
    127
    0
    Location:
    Virginia
    This.

    Although like most here, my experience is this: OC hurts cops, not drones. I've never observed the stuff actually "work" on anyone but the cops it rubbed off on.
     
  11. emt1581

    emt1581
    Expand Collapse
    Curious Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2002
    19,885
    2
    Location:
    Penn's Woods
    What's the solution then? Tasers are a possibility but you only get one shot. I have seen what yall are talking about though...no effect at all. Except at an EMS conference. An officer deployed an inert unit that was filled with compressed air (fogger) into the room....all the old folks and women cleared the room like Jeopardy was coming on or there was a sale on shoes...choking, pissing and moaning that they couldn't breathe....:upeyes:

    -Emt1581
     
  12. Denikes

    Denikes
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    May 29, 2006
    127
    0
    Location:
    Virginia
    We have only had TASERs for a year but they're getting used a good bit. Being a good sized (~750 sworn) urban department we have a lot of back up and usually just use what I call the "blue tsunami" move and bury the joker in bodies.
     
  13. Jayman

    Jayman
    Expand Collapse
    Big Dummy

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2002
    393
    0
    Location:
    Chantilly, VA
    I've always seen it have SOME effect. It was rarely the "lay down and cry like a baby" effect, but always something. One guy wanted to fight me and I sprayed him, he decided he'd rather run. Even the crazy guy shut his eyes for a bit, which was enough to grab him and get him in cuffs. I never count on it working, but it is nice when it does do something.
     
  14. Jayman

    Jayman
    Expand Collapse
    Big Dummy

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2002
    393
    0
    Location:
    Chantilly, VA
    I've heard that referred to as the "pig pile" as well. :)
     
  15. DaBigBR

    DaBigBR
    Expand Collapse
    No Infidels!

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2005
    8,798
    8
    Location:
    Circling the wagons.
    I don't doubt the effectiveness of Fox, for what it's worth, or pretty much any other spray for that matter. We had a guy from our department get hit with it in the academy and he ended up with a nasty chemical burn on his lip from it. I'm just not convinced that it's not "overkill"...in other words, how much hotter can something be than the "average OC" and have any greater effect.

    I've always thought that Sabre Red was the best smelling OC out there, right up to the point that you start coughing.
     
  16. skyjumpr

    skyjumpr
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2009
    75
    0
  17. Vigilant

    Vigilant
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2005
    6,582
    88
    Location:
    Inside the Perimeter
    I could tell a story about an attack of flatulence and a series of fans, but I won't..... :rofl:
     
  18. Vigilant

    Vigilant
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2005
    6,582
    88
    Location:
    Inside the Perimeter
    I like the smell of Def Tec in the red can. I used to huff a bit now and then to stay somewhat immune to the fumes. Sabre Red to me is just downright rough to breathe. Maybe I'm just a lightweight.

    There used to be a table on the Net with the different brands and their strengths. It showed Sabre Red as one of the hottest, and Fox not far behind. Def Tec was pretty low on the list. I have heard that Sabre Red is slow to take effect, and that Fox is one of the quickest to take effect.

    Rumor has it that a good shot of Def Tec on a toilet seat can bring about a good bit of consternation. :supergrin:
     
  19. RVER

    RVER
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2004
    367
    5
    Location:
    PA
    Fox Labs and Sabre Red both are excellent. Any more heat won't make a difference due to the effects of sensory overload, however more heat will prolong the BG's recovery time (which may not be a bad thing for a civilian). As far as the "mythical" immediate incapacitation properties of OC -there is no such thing. I've used OC in the field at least 30 times starting in 1985 with the original Cap-Stun and the only things that you can count on is that 1) little effect for the first 5-8 seconds. 2) That you will have no idea how the BG will respond... I've had them drop and cry, stand there and tell me how rude that was, to being punched three times in the head before I could even side step... OC is a great product however have a plan B and C ready.
     
  20. scottydl

    scottydl
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    May 31, 2005
    2,669
    48
    Location:
    The Middle
    And remember that NO less-than-lethal option should ever be intended as "immediate incapacitation" that requires no additional actions. For law enforcement, OC/taser/baton/whatever just buys you a few seconds of distraction so you can handcuff, etc. and really get the person under control. For a civilian in self-defense mode, it gives you a few seconds to run, get away, call for help, etc. Be prepared for what needs to happen AFTER you deploy that spray.