close

Privacy guaranteed - Your email is not shared with anyone.

Firefighter fecal hair /Whats your policy?

Discussion in 'Firefighter/EMS Talk' started by mfackler, Feb 8, 2005.


  1. mfackler

    mfackler
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2001
    130
    0
    Location:
    Van Wert, Ohio, USA
    Looks like we are about to have a little peeing contest at my department. Our policy literally states "No facial hair that interferes with mask seal." That has always been interpreted as "No Facial hair except a short mustache." Well wouldn't you know someone is finely testing it. He has a short goat tee (sp). Normally I would have said he doesn't have a chance of keeping it BUT. I'll give him a little credit in his timing. We had fit testing yesterday. He passed with his hair!

    I worked OT on that shift this AM. Didn't feel I could tell him to shave it off under those circumstances. Looks like a job for the chief to decide.

    Anyway, I was just wondering....Anyone have any good info on this. (Google didn't give me much)

    Heck too tell you the truth I'll probably have me facial hair next week if he pulls this one off.
     

    Wanna kill these ads? We can help!
  2. beemerphile

    beemerphile
    Expand Collapse
    CLM

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2001
    949
    0
    Location:
    Danielsville, GA
    Well, with "fecal" hair it looks more like a crapping contest than a peeing contest. - Lee
     

  3. mfackler

    mfackler
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2001
    130
    0
    Location:
    Van Wert, Ohio, USA
    Oops never mind. A little more searching and I found what I was looking for. here

    Thanks of pointing that out Lee. Zoomed right past spell checker.
     
  4. Squid.HM2

    Squid.HM2
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2004
    102
    0
    Location:
    USA
    fecal hair...it just burns my ass:steamed:
     
  5. gruntmedik

    gruntmedik
    Expand Collapse
    Honk Honk
    CLM

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2005
    6,753
    218
    Location:
    Taylorsville, KY
    Should be more careful what you eat.
    ROTFLMGDMFAO
     
  6. mfackler

    mfackler
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Jan 16, 2001
    130
    0
    Location:
    Van Wert, Ohio, USA
    Moderator:
    Can someone please delete this thread.? I didn't mean any offensive language and the post has produced no useful info.


    Thanks

    Sorry for any inconveniences
     
  7. Tvov

    Tvov
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2000
    4,463
    312
    Location:
    CT,USA
    Getting back to legitimate responses (although the title is rather interesting...);

    1910.134(g)(1)(i)(A)
    or that interferes with valve function; or
    1910.134(g)(1)(i)(B)
    Any condition that interferes with the face-to-facepiece seal or valve function.

    Repeat --
    "Facial hair that comes between the sealing surface of the facepiece and the face"


    To me, this says NO facial hair except for trimmed mustache. It seems that a goatee would interfere with the seal. Just because it happened to work at one fit test, possibly right after the goatee was carefully trimmed, what about in two days? The mask may not work. This is something officers have to crack down on right away, and not let anyone slide by. Hell, let the small goatee go, and what if the next guy shows up with a beard? Even over a small carefully trimmed beard, I bet you could pass a fit if you really tighten the straps. This doesn't mean it should be allowed.

    I am not one big on lots of regulations and SOPs, but when they exist, they should be ENFORCED! Equally among people. Otherwise, change or get rid of them. We have a new guy, less than a year in, who is starting to grow a scruff on the end of his chin. He is a great guy, everyone likes him, but when I got in I was told nothing except for a small mustache.

    One more thing to annoy me! lol
     
  8. nam02G

    nam02G
    Expand Collapse
    Angry Bunny

    Joined:
    Feb 4, 2002
    1,108
    57
    Location:
    Vancouver USA
    When I joined up in 1981 Washington state had just implemented a law banning facial hair based on interfering with the mask seal. A number of the, then (at least to me), old-timers swore that they never smelled smoke with a mask on until after they shaved off their beards. This was back before fit testing and it was one size fits all, even if it didn't.
     
  9. FireGuy

    FireGuy
    Expand Collapse
    Into The Breach
    CLM

    Joined:
    May 20, 2002
    260
    15
    Location:
    Hiding In The Rockies
    Your first post stated the policy as "No facial hair that interfered with the mask seal".

    When referencing 1910, we have to remember that the sealing surface actually varies on different types of masks. The posibility of interference with other parts also depends on the type of SCBA used.

    So - I'd have to say you must PROVE his goatee is an obstruction. Personal preferences and "we always thought it meant" don't count if he decides to contest the decision.

    That said, I'd rather side on caution but we don't always have a choice. Careful wording in policies is very important. So - can you get the policy changed...

    FG ;g
     
  10. DaleGribble

    DaleGribble
    Expand Collapse
    Sandwich!

    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2003
    7,290
    424
    Location:
    Land of the toothless!
    Sounds like your guy is within policy. So leave him alone about it or change the policy if you want to eliminate facial hair.
     
  11. davew83

    davew83
    Expand Collapse
    hhhhhhhhmmmmmmm

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2004
    1,428
    6
    Location:
    SC
    I went interior a few weeks ago, stuble over my face, and full goatie, never had a problem getting a seal in MSA SCBA kinda surprised me
     
  12. Slinger646

    Slinger646
    Expand Collapse
    King of Sling

    Joined:
    Sep 5, 2004
    476
    0
    Location:
    In the Mountains of VA
    As long as it seals, its fine. I have Mutton Chops Circa 1975, never had any problems.
     
  13. obxprnstar

    obxprnstar
    Expand Collapse
    Goth Lover

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2003
    1,009
    0
    Location:
    Zombie Patrol
    We have SCOTT packs where I work.

    When I did my fit testing a few months ago I had about a days worth of growth on my face and I failed my fit test. I did the test about ten times with diffrent size masks, and even having the tester yanking on the starps. I had to go to the store and buy a new razor/shaving cream and shave.

    I have done training with several days growth before and never had a problem.

    I shaved my goatee when I got into the fire service.
     
  14. obxemt

    obxemt
    Expand Collapse
    Chaplain of CT

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2001
    7,467
    0
    Location:
    In the middle of the Atlantic Ocean
    Fecal hair is the only thing not regulated by my department...YET. They regulate what I wear in the bunkroom, how I conduct myself in the bathroom, what terminology I use in reference to other firefighters and supervisors...OOPS! They're not firefighters or supervisors, but CO-WORKERS.

    So, logically speaking, fecal and groinal hair grooming requirements are probably just a hair away from the policy manual.

    "Butt" seriously, I was recently told that NC OSHA standards now require no facial hair whatsoever. Haven't been able to verify.
     
  15. ff19106

    ff19106
    Expand Collapse

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2004
    19
    0
    Location:
    Cherokee Co. Georgia
    Our policy states the following:

    -Only facial hair allowed will be sideburns no more than 1/4 inch from earlobe.

    -Mustache hair will be no longer than 1/4 inch below the corner of upper and lower lips.

    Vollies now have their own little fun and games with this,some Depts. are very progressive and in line with our policies and some arent.

    I know of one Volunteer Fire Dept. "Ball Ground F.D. in Ga."

    The Chief and Assistant Chief "Position by popular vote each year" both have full beards and mustaches.

    I as well as many others feel this to be a slap in the face of traditional grooming standards for Suppression personnel not to mention the safety and lead by example discrepencies!

    Real Firemen don't have beards anyway!
     
  16. AggiePhil

    AggiePhil
    Expand Collapse
    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2004
    1,862
    0
    Location:
    Texas
    Fecal hair just gets in the way, really.
     
  17. obxprnstar

    obxprnstar
    Expand Collapse
    Goth Lover

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2003
    1,009
    0
    Location:
    Zombie Patrol
    Fecal hair = Klingons.