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Does the test in These videos mean that the .40 165 GDs suck?

Discussion in 'Caliber Corner' started by Ramses II, Aug 25, 2010.

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  1. Ramses II

    Ramses II The Great

    357
    0
    Jul 8, 2004
    AZ
    I just bought 40 rounds of these!:steamed: Two boxes of Speer Gold Dot 165 gr. .40s.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JF7U9mBQQWk&feature=search
    It isn't the most scientific test, but if you look at the other tests he performs, the other HPs don't penetrate this much. I also saw this test, which seems to confirm that these over-penetrate. 16" after heavy clothing, the entire length of one gelatin block. That's a bit deep isn't it. I noticed that the ATK test personnel did NOT say that this ammo met FBI specs as they did with the other ammo that they tested

    Go to the pistol ammunition video, about 8:38 in:
    http://le.atk.com/general/irl/videos.aspx
     
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2010
  2. KAK

    KAK

    178
    0
    Aug 20, 2010
    Waco Texas
    It damn near made the first jug explode. That could be homeboy's chest cavity. Penetration is good. Wounds are 3 dimensional. It is fact that more tissue damage will occur the further the bullet penetrates. You want the bullet to exit, then it does 100% of what it can do.
     

    Last edited: Aug 25, 2010

  3. BWT

    BWT

    528
    7
    Apr 27, 2010
    USA
    Its a great round with a proven track record. You did good.
     
  4. Ramses II

    Ramses II The Great

    357
    0
    Jul 8, 2004
    AZ
    Good point. I did notice that it had considerably greater effect on the first jug than any of the other rounnds this guy tested.
     
  5. cadillacguns

    cadillacguns Millennium Member

    4,279
    236
    Jan 20, 1999
    Indianapolis, IN USA
    I am a 180 fan, but after buying and trying Win PDX-1, FED HST, etc etc, I keep going back to the ol reliable 180 gr GD's in my Fotay's!
     
  6. Bullet Man

    Bullet Man

    34
    0
    May 23, 2003
    Florida
    The 53949 was made for the FBI, it's slower than the standard 40 165 by 100 fps. The 53970 is what all of the agencies that I sell to use not the 53949. Again this round was designed around the FBI'S specs. I believe that the reduced fps and early pluging of the HP and then the clothing being peeled off as the bullet went through the jug had something to do with the expansion. Another note, the the person testing should always purchase the ammunition for the tests right off of a dealers shelf to insure the highest quality and integrity possible.... AGAIN DO YOUR OWN TESTING!!!!!!
     
  7. BleedNOrange

    BleedNOrange Go Vols

    1,327
    0
    Jan 31, 2009
    Volunteer State
    Awesome round. Our Dept just switched from Ranger T 165gr to these.
     
  8. Ramses II

    Ramses II The Great

    357
    0
    Jul 8, 2004
    AZ
    :cool:
     
  9. DRT

    DRT

    864
    8
    May 6, 2001
    USA

    That's a step backwards.
     
  10. DRT

    DRT

    864
    8
    May 6, 2001
    USA

    Sorry Tom, the rounds he tested were the 1150fps version (53970) straight out of a 50round LE box. Bottom line is that these rounds don't open as well as others when fired through clothing.
     
  11. DRT

    DRT

    864
    8
    May 6, 2001
    USA
    It's not the worst ammo in the world however there are definitely better choices if robust expansion after clothing is important to you. Look at pictures about 2/3 way down on page 2 of the following:

    http://glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1229261&page=2


    .
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2010
  12. BurkGlocker

    BurkGlocker Texas Redneck

    469
    0
    Feb 25, 2010
    Burkburnett, TX
    The lack of expansion is one reason that I try to stay far away from Gold Dots. If I am looking for something that doesnt expand well but penetrates deeply, its either Gold Dots or XTPs.

    Burk
     
  13. Berto

    Berto woo woo

    24,175
    2,127
    Sep 15, 2003
    WA
    That hardly qualifies as a bad performance.
     
  14. MinervaDoe

    MinervaDoe

    9,241
    1,490
    Jan 26, 2009
    San Jose, CA
    The video is very well made. The author is very well spoken and knowledgable and I respect his opinion.
    Still:
    • 500 foot pounds of energy (A 230 grain .45 ACP going 850 fps has 369 foot pounds of energy).
    • The retained mass of the round looks good.
    If you factor in law enforcement's prospective use of the round through soft cover, windshields, or car doors, the over penetration and retained mass seem to be a plus.

    The denim, was mentioned as part of the test, but when you think of why denim makes sense to use in a test like this, the round actually did quite well. When I think of testing through denim, I think of using it to see if clogging the hollow point will prevent expansion. The hollow point did open, it just happens to be a round which does not open up to add another 70% to it's diameter.
     
  15. cowboy1964

    cowboy1964

    19,687
    2,128
    Sep 4, 2009
    U.S.A.
    For some reason .40 Gold Dots don't seem to work as well as 9mm and .45 from the tests I've seen. Not that they fail but they just don't seem to expand and penetrate as consistently. I would still use them though.
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2010
  16. Bullet Man

    Bullet Man

    34
    0
    May 23, 2003
    Florida
    Sorry, I just watched it again, the person states 53949, not 53970...Way to go Tenn. Smart move.. We have had 10 Law Enforcement shootings here in Florida in the last 3 months. All were FDRT and all used the Speer 40 caliber Gold Dot. After much testing the FHP changed from Winchester to Speer Gold Dot this summer.

    Again do your own testing....
     
  17. H&K 4 LIFE

    H&K 4 LIFE Leonum A Ignis

    3,381
    2
    Jan 27, 2009
    CT
    So in other words what you are saying is despite not typically expanding in gel and water jugs into pretty little flowers the GD's worked in the real world, where it actually matters? ;)
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2010
  18. DRT

    DRT

    864
    8
    May 6, 2001
    USA
    I was refering to TWSG26's (tnoutdoors9) video listed 1st above.

    After much testing the Feds dropped the 165gr GD in favor of Winchesters so what's that prove. FHP also went with .45 GAP so I don't put a lot of weight on their choices. On the other hand there's probably not too much heavy clothing to worry about in Florida. Probably isn't much GAP ammo around other than GD either.

    If a .58 caliber hole is good, then a .75 caliber hole is that much better given that both penetrate at least 12" which they do.

    If they used HST then I guess they would have been MFDRT. Lots of other anecdotal stories .....like Porland's HST impressive OIS records.
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2010
  19. wruckis

    wruckis

    11
    0
    May 12, 2010
    Gold Dot suck? I dont think so. I think it's a really good bullet, but i believe HST and Ranger "t" expand much better.
     
  20. Ramses II

    Ramses II The Great

    357
    0
    Jul 8, 2004
    AZ
    What's FDRT?