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Crimping ?

Discussion in 'Reloading' started by racking on, Sep 12, 2012.

  1. F106 Fan

    F106 Fan

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    Oct 19, 2011
    If you are crimping a straight wall cartridge hard enough to prevent setback, you are crimping too hard. The crimp should be just enough to close up the case mouth and not hard enough to indent the bullet. Neck tension should hold the bullet.

    Plated bullets don't work well when the plating has been damaged by a crimp.

    I don't reload carry rounds, I buy them. I try to rotate them but, for what they cost, I don't shoot them very often.

    As to my reloads? When they go into the magazine the brass will soon be on the ground. I don't think I have ever rechambered a reload.

    Richard
     
  2. fredj338

    fredj338

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    It actually does not. You can NOT taper crimp tight enough to prevent bullet setback. In fact, too ,uch taper crimp can actually reduce neck tenstion & proper neck tension is what prevents setback.
     


  3. dmit

    dmit

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    Aug 18, 2012
    Is one way any better than the other to seat and crimp with one die or seat with one die and crimp with another?
     
  4. Taterhead

    Taterhead Counting Beans

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    Boise, Idaho
    Seating and crimping in one step can work just fine if setting up the die properly. I have had far better results with seating and crimping in separate steps when using soft plated bullets like Berry's though.
     
  5. Taterhead

    Taterhead Counting Beans

    3,615
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    Dec 13, 2008
    Boise, Idaho

    That and if you have severly work-hardened brass neck tension can also be compromised. I have observed nickel-plated cases to be susceptible to this.
     
  6. judgecrater

    judgecrater

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    north GA
    Most will agree that separate dies are best. This is especially true when roll crimping. If roll crimping and seating is attempted with one die, the crimp is attempting to hold the bullet firm while the seating operation is still moving the bullet. The two simultaneous operations are fighting one another.
     
  7. judgecrater

    judgecrater

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    Dec 24, 2011
    north GA
    An ideal range of OAL for a Glock or any other pistol is fully dependent on the bullet shape. One length that is idea for a roundnose may not feed properly for a truncated cone or some other shape. As for the balance of your post, you are absolutely correct. Far too many reloaders closely follow the bullet weight/powder charge in the manual, then ignore the OAL, which is equally important in maintaining safe pressures.
     
  8. fredj338

    fredj338

    21,930
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    so.cal.
    With jacleted bullets, seating & crimping in one step can be done w/ good results. With soft plated or lead, separate steps tends to yield better results. It can be done either way though.
     
  9. Gpruitt54

    Gpruitt54

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    what's odd is the OAL provided in the manuals matches one-to-one my factory loads. So, it seems, at least to me the manuals are correct.

    I never load above max. If I go beyond the mid point, its at least 2 to 3 10ths of a grain below max (Always). In my manuals, for any given load, the OAL is the same for the minimum to the max load.

    So, how much longer should I go? Is there general rule for this adjustment over and above what is listed in the manuals. I am using the Lee (2nd Edition), Hornady (8th edition), and Lyman.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2012
  10. Gpruitt54

    Gpruitt54

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    How is a new reloader supposed to know when not to follow the manuals. I am a new reloader. It seems dangerous for me, or any new reloader to simply start ignoring the published information in the manuals. Try not to confuse those of us who are new to this. Maybe after I have 10 years of reloading experience, I will be in a position to ignore the published tables.

    But I am not there yet. If, I may speak for new reloaders.
     
  11. F106 Fan

    F106 Fan

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    Oct 19, 2011
    Bluntly put, you are in the position of having to derive information because you bought components for which, at best, there is only limited data. That pretty much sums it up.

    If you bought a manual, bought components to match and assembled to a given OAL, there wouldn't even be a question about the loads.

    There is no suggestion that I have read in this thread to ever work outside published data. I certainly don't do it and I would never recommend it.

    Richard
     
  12. Colorado4Wheel

    Colorado4Wheel

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    CO
    It's not that complicated. Look at the chart below. The right side of the chart is safer, the left side is more dangerous (hint, hint). Big side of the < is safer NOT better.

    Heavier Powder Charge < Lighter Powder Charge
    Shorter OAL < Longer OAL
    Heavier Bullet < Lighter Bullet
    Lead < Plated < FMJ/JHP

    How does this information help?

    So if your moving the variable to the right side of the chart you are moving to safer direction. Not a riskier direction. So a manual will have a OAL of 1.110". If you load to 1.120 you can safely ignore the manuals suggestion for OAL (assuming it fits your barrel and has enough bullet engagement). I always load longer then the manuals OAL. I also always figure out how long I can load that specific bullet in my barrel. And then load it just a little shorter (about .010").

    The mistake many reloaders make is they take every variable above and go to the safer side (THE RIGHT ;)). Then they wonder why their reloads don't work right. You want a reasonable amount of pressure to make everything (including your gun) work right.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2012
  13. judgecrater

    judgecrater

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    north GA
    Sorry if I miss led you. Always follow the manuals.
     
  14. judgecrater

    judgecrater

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    I missed it too. Don't feel bad.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2012
  15. F106 Fan

    F106 Fan

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    Oct 19, 2011
    I must be having another senior moment. Moving the powder charge from light to heavy, which is to the right, is not making it safer. In my view...

    Richard
     
  16. Colorado4Wheel

    Colorado4Wheel

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    CO
    Watching Denver lose is frustrating. Guess I was distracted.
     
  17. shotgunred

    shotgunred local trouble maker

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    Washington (the state)
    Every glock 9mm and 40 bullet I have ever tried (except some 180 simi-wadcutter lead bullets, which would never reliably feed) has loaded fine in that range.

    But new loaders should follow published recipes!
     
  18. Gpruitt54

    Gpruitt54

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    Hay, thanks. I appreciate all the feedback and advice I get from this forum. For me, it's a valuable resource. I am not pointing fingers, just looking for clarification. We all have points of view that some of us are in a position to take advantage of, and other are not yet ready. Give me a few more years of reloading, I'll get there.

    In the meantime, thanks for your input.
     
  19. Gpruitt54

    Gpruitt54

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    What the...? LoL!
     
  20. Gpruitt54

    Gpruitt54

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    Not sure if I replied to this one, but I increased my powder load to 4.0gn and another set of rounds at 4.3gn. Boy-o-boy that really did the trick. The gun cycles flawlessly, and the accuracy and groupings are better than I could have asked for... fantastic!

    Both powder loads were very good, but I think I like the 4.3gn load just a little better. As I look at my load notes, I think I found a load for the 9mm with Accurate #2. I've said it before, the ultra small particles of Accurate #2 seem to fill the Lee Pro Auto Disk opening more consistently than any of the other powders (HP-38 and Unique).

    I cannot measure FPS, I don't have the device to measure velocity.