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Anyone Ever Seen TMJ's Tested in Gel?

Discussion in 'The 10 Ring' started by G29SFWTF, Apr 14, 2013.

  1. G29SFWTF

    G29SFWTF

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    Aug 3, 2012
    I know JHP's are what is normally tested in ballistic gel but I was wondering if anyone has ever seen a 10mm TMJ tested. Or if not, any caliber ball ammo in gel. If TMJ and FMJ are meant for penetration on large game like grizzly, then surely they also get tested at some point to measure their effectiveness.

    Or do they just send some guy out in the woods with a bunch of ball ammo and see if he comes back?
     
  2. KenMac

    KenMac

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    Nov 21, 2011

    Yes, but he's not back yet.
     


  3. They're still trying to buy enough ballistic gelatin to capture a 10mm TMJ round. Testing being done in Texas, complaints from neighbors in Arizona about rounds hitting their buildings.
     
  4. cowboy1964

    cowboy1964

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    Sep 4, 2009
    U.S.A.
    It's kind of pointless to test most FMJ/TMJ in gel. Most will pass right through a standard block so you need two blocks. The one exception to this is .380 ACP and smaller calibers. tnoutdoors9 on YouTube has done a few .380 ACP FMJ gel tests.
     
  5. Andrew Wiggin

    Andrew Wiggin

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    Dec 15, 2011
    I tested PPU 180 gr JHP, which was too slow to expand and exited the side of the block at 23". I also tested Cor-Bon's 180 gr BCSP, which had a healthy velocity but also did not expand. It penetrated 28" of gelatin and some water. I even tested Underwood 220 gr HC, which yawed sharply and exited the blocks at 20".


    Unfortunately, it seems that non-expanding bullets have a marked tendency of yawing and leaving the block. This makes it a bit frustrating. We know the penetration from even relatively light solids can be pretty significant but it takes a LOT of gelatin to document that.


    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5PdOyZiWThU"]Gel test: 10mm 180 gr Prvi Partizan JHP - YouTube[/ame]


    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3wEAPXNAkxY"]Gel test: 10mm CORBON 180 gr BCSP - YouTube[/ame]


    [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jPNqAUn1nGw"]Gel test: 10mm 220 gr Underwood hardcast - YouTube[/ame]
     
  6. G29SFWTF

    G29SFWTF

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    Aug 3, 2012
    Thanks for that. I remember now when you did the hardcast. Buffalo Bore states with regards to their penetrator rounds that they are flat nosed because round nosed tends to yaw and not damage tissue as much. Looks like the yaw can happen with flat nosed too. Maybe the 220gr being such a long bullet has something to do with that also.

    It's interesting that there was no deformation even with the BCSP. That is supposedly a hot round also.
     
  7. Ak.Hiker

    Ak.Hiker

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    Homer Alaska
    I have shot tons of LBT and Keith hardcast handgun bullets for penetration through wood and have never seen one that did not penetrate straight. Most will exit and go straingt into the backstop. Flat point FMJ's loaded by Buffalo Bore, Double Tap and others will penetrate straight as well.
     
  8. Any Cal.

    Any Cal.

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    Oct 27, 2008
    I haven't seen any bullets yaw in wood. It seems like wood is more a test of nose shape efficiency, pointier noses win. 9mm nato does great in wood, but would tumble in a softer medium.

    Straight line penetration is mostly a matter of weight distribution, just having a flat nose does not ensure anything.
     
  9. Angry Fist

    Angry Fist Dehumanizer® Lifetime Member

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    Hellbilly Hill
    It would be nice to know the gel penetration of UA 200 TMJ.
     
  10. Andrew Wiggin

    Andrew Wiggin

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    Dec 15, 2011
    Some day, but it'll take a LOT of gelatin to do it.
     
  11. Angry Fist

    Angry Fist Dehumanizer® Lifetime Member

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    Hellbilly Hill
    Just a 3' square block about a half mile long. :supergrin:
     
  12. gofastman

    gofastman

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    Jan 29, 2010
    MN
    I dont know if this is ultimately what you are trying to figure out or not, but usually Hardcast > TMJ/FMJ even if they have a flat point.
    a properly designed hardcast bullet shouldn't yaw, those truncated cone profile bullets from Underwood and BB are far from ideal